Which would you feed?

[corgipower]

Definitely Orijen - we had disastrous results on Nature's Variety because they use citric acid as a preservative.... nasty stuff!

I'm sorry to hear it was so bad.
I've been feeding it for a long time now with no problems, so it's not nasty stuff for all dogs.

Oh as for the rabbit formula in NV it contains chicken fat, which causes bloat in larger breeds.

A lot of foods have chicken fat. Whether or not it contributes to bloat is widely debated and uncertain. The only dog I have who is prone to bloat is a 22 pound dog, and his bloat is related to his grass allergies as far as we can figure out.

They've all done fine with both citric acid and chicken fat for years. I'm not about to start worrying now.

 

[Juicy]

I'm sorry to hear it was so bad.
I've been feeding it for a long time now with no problems, so it's not nasty stuff for all dogs.



A lot of foods have chicken fat. Whether or not it contributes to bloat is widely debated and uncertain. The only dog I have who is prone to bloat is a 22 pound dog, and his bloat is related to his grass allergies as far as we can figure out.

They've all done fine with both citric acid and chicken fat for years. I'm not about to start worrying now.

I was just making note of it since the OP said no chicken, but the duck formula seems to be chicken free!

 

[Michiyo-Fir]

I would choose Orijen over NV. The amount of meat in Orijen RR is just astounding. I really love the list of ingredients and it's just in general a top notch dog food. I trust the company completely.

I don't trust NV as much because they have had recalls in the past. Also they have outsourced ingredients (only rabbit i believe) and just recently they had some raw food recall I believe.

 

[corgipower]

I would choose Orijen over NV. The amount of meat in Orijen RR is just astounding. I really love the list of ingredients and it's just in general a top notch dog food. I trust the company completely.

I don't trust NV as much because they have had recalls in the past. Also they have outsourced ingredients (only rabbit i believe) and just recently they had some raw food recall I believe.

Meh...Recalls happen. NV handled it well.
Nature’s Variety: How to do a recall right | PetConnection.com

The NV is 70% meat, which isn't much less than the orijen (75 and 80 percent), and the NV doesn't use potatoes, which I love about it. Many of the meats listed at the top of the ingredient list in orijen are meats, not meat meals, which means once the water is removed, they're not really the first ingredients any more.

Yes, they do get their rabbit from China, but they are involved in the process.

We are currently sourcing rabbit meat for our raw diets (including our exclusive freeze dried rabbit Bio-Coatingâ„¢) and for our canned diets from a supplier in China. In order to ensure the quality of these suppliers, members of our management team have personally visited and audited the facilities. Nature's Variety also has a PhD food scientist on staff in China, who visits the facility and monitors meat quality. In addition, samples from shipments received from this supplier are submitted to an independent lab for testing. All results of testing and auditing have matched our specifications for quality and nutrition.

 

[Michiyo-Fir]

Yeah I believe I talked with them about it before as well. It seems like a legitimate process but I just prefer no outsourcing in general if I can find it. Natura used to one one of my faves too before they got bought out.

 

[SizzleDog]

The problem with citric acid is that it's one of the ingredients thought to increase the risk of bloat - definitely increased Kaylee's chances, for the three weeks we fed it I went through an entire box of Gas-X and made one epic visit to the emergency vet.

I'm sure it works for many dogs - heck, my cats eat NV products - but I really wish they didn't use citric acid.

 

[corgipower]

Purdue Bloat Study | GREATDANELADY.COM

Citric Acid/Fats etc.

To comment on the citric acid and fats issue.....the past 15 years have shown us a tremendous decrease in the incidences of bloat in my breed, that is not science, that is anecdotal observations shared from breeder to breeder. This is due, in part to better diets that are now available to breeders/owners. The use of meat based foods, natural preservatives, higher quality fats and probiotic/digestive enzymes have helped to provide a better nutrition which in turn provides a quality live and longevity for these animals.

The Bloat study says -- one should not use a food with fat in the first four ingredients, or a food should not contains citric acid (a natural preservative) and the food should have rendered meat meal containing bone in the first four ingredients. Dr. Glickman's study suggests that these things cause bloat in canines. This conclusion is illogical, is made in the absence of real scientific research, is based in opinion only and severely flawed.

(Of course they ever look at things like pH environment of the gut, or high levels of pathogenic yeast or bacteria in the enviromnent of the gut perhaps due to over use of grain based foods, antiboitics and excessive vaccinations)

Nowadays, most owners feed a better quality food to their giants and THAT is why the foods that were reported to the survey contained citric acid a natural preservative, higher quality fats and meat based diets.

 

[jess2416]

*ponders*

why all the drama with food? as long as the dog is healthy and nourished who really cares if the chicken is from China or your backyard?

Heck, I'd feed a grocery store brand to Chloe if she would do well on it, but she doesnt, so I feed EVO...

 

[JustaLilBitaLuck]

*ponders*

why all the drama with food? as long as the dog is healthy and nourished who really cares if the chicken is from China or your backyard?

Heck, I'd feed a grocery store brand to Chloe if she would do well on it, but she doesnt, so I feed EVO...

Because I want to feed my pets the best possible food, and give them the best nutrition. And that involves research.

Many of the brands and foods involved in the major pet food recall in 2007 were produced in China, or were made using Chinese-produced ingredients. I do trust Nature's Variety's rabbit formulas, and would be comfortable with feeding them, because I'm comfortable with the company.

Most grocery-store brands (Alpo, Ol Roy, Pedigree, etc) use animal by-products, corn in all it's many forms, and harmful preservatives, among other things. i don't know why anyone would knowingly feed that to their dog, no matter how well the dog does on it.

 

[SizzleDog]

Yes I'm aware of what that study says. However, GDV is still a very mysterious problem and we don't really know what causes it... probably different for each individual dog.

 

[Dekka]

*ponders*

why all the drama with food? as long as the dog is healthy and nourished who really cares if the chicken is from China or your backyard?

Heck, I'd feed a grocery store brand to Chloe if she would do well on it, but she doesnt, so I feed EVO...

Same reason my kid doesn't live on lunchables and popcorn. He might look fine.. but down the road he is heading for some serious trouble. Its not the immediate effects I worry about but cancer etc. Often IME dogs fed grocery store brands look old before there time. Same as people who don't look after themselves.

 

[Saeleofu]

Same reason my kid doesn't live on lunchables and popcorn. He might look fine.. but down the road he is heading for some serious trouble. Its not the immediate effects I worry about but cancer etc. Often IME dogs fed grocery store brands look old before there time. Same as people who don't look after themselves.

:hail: :hail: :hail:

 

[JustaLilBitaLuck]

Same reason my kid doesn't live on lunchables and popcorn. He might look fine.. but down the road he is heading for some serious trouble. Its not the immediate effects I worry about but cancer etc. Often IME dogs fed grocery store brands look old before there time. Same as people who don't look after themselves.

:hail::hail::hail:

 

[corgipower]

However, GDV is still a very mysterious problem and we don't really know what causes it... probably different for each individual dog.

Exactly.
Which means we don't know if citric acid is a factor.

 

[JacksonsMom]

I love Orijen Regional Red and so does Jackson. It's probably his all-time favorite and he does really well on it (also being fed pre-made raw a few times a week). I pay $17.99 for a 5.5lb bag, compared to Acana Grasslands at $14.99, so I don't think it's *that* bad, but I'm not sure of the big bag prices.

Other than Acana and Orijen, I've fed Go! Endurance (also makers of Now!) and Wellness CORE with good results.

 

[ihartgonzo]

Same reason my kid doesn't live on lunchables and popcorn. He might look fine.. but down the road he is heading for some serious trouble. Its not the immediate effects I worry about but cancer etc. Often IME dogs fed grocery store brands look old before there time. Same as people who don't look after themselves.

AMEN! Working in a pet hotel and working with and feeding thousands of dogs has impacted me so much. I used to say "whatever works for your dog..." too. Until I started noticing that all of the dogs who were fed Beneful were covered in tumors at or before 5 years of age! And the dogs fed Science Diet pooped 7 times a day and smelled disgusting. And the dogs fed Kibbles N Bits had rotten teeth and hair loss at any age. It does make a difference. Sometimes, it just takes a while before what's going on inside becomes apparent outside. And sometimes, some people NEVER realize that their dog is suffering, that's just normal dog stuff to them. There is this precious Corgi that comes in who is fed Moist n Meaty! *gasp* She has bald spots, horrible eye goo, horrible breath, itchy feet, AND she ravenously eats other dogs poo - fresh from the source! It's almost impossible to stop her. I tried to explain to her owner that this is a sign of deficiencies and probably was the case considering what she's fed... they didn't listen at all, they even seemed mad at me for trying to help!

I also STRONGLY prefer Nature's Variety Instinct to Orijen. Much more easily digested, vastly better poops, nicer coats and breaths, and both of my dogs smelled faintly fishy on Orijen. I hate hate hate the smell of fish. They don't smell fishy even on Salmon instinct. Rabbit is my favorite, outsourced or not. I would imagine it's very difficult to get a good rabbit source in the states.

 

[nikkiluvsu15]

Thanks for all the replies. I went with the NV this time and so far, so good. Harleigh seems to enjoy it, but that isn't a surprise :lol-sign:

I love Orijen Regional Red and so does Jackson. It's probably his all-time favorite and he does really well on it (also being fed pre-made raw a few times a week). I pay $17.99 for a 5.5lb bag, compared to Acana Grasslands at $14.99, so I don't think it's *that* bad, but I'm not sure of the big bag prices.

Other than Acana and Orijen, I've fed Go! Endurance (also makers of Now!) and Wellness CORE with good results.

Yeah, the 29.7lb bag was close to $80 (it may have been more). I could probably get away with the 14lb bag as she'll only be eating it once a day, so it wouldn't go as fast.

And if I recall correctly the NV and Regional Red was around the same price for the same pound bag or close to it anyways, at the pet store. I think it was around $40 for the bag of NV I got.

 

[JacksonsMom]

Thanks for all the replies. I went with the NV this time and so far, so good. Harleigh seems to enjoy it, but that isn't a surprise :lol-sign:



Yeah, the 29.7lb bag was close to $80 (it may have been more). I could probably get away with the 14lb bag as she'll only be eating it once a day, so it wouldn't go as fast.

And if I recall correctly the NV and Regional Red was around the same price for the same pound bag or close to it anyways, at the pet store. I think it was around $40 for the bag of NV I got.

Yeah, it can definitely be pricey!

NV is a very good food! I forgot to mention I did feed that! I fed Instinct to Jackson for about 6 months, I think. We rotated between rabbit and turkey&duck. He did awesome on it, it was the first food I found where his eye boogers became non-existent. I found he gained a bit of weight on it, though... I'm pretty certain I wasn't over-feeding, I already feed way less than the bag suggests (I think it was suggested he, at 15lbs, eats 1 cup per day, but he only gets 1/2 cup per day of kibble). I noticed the fat content was a bit higher at 22% than other foods, so I'm wondering if that's why... I don't know! Maybe he was still just growing. But I still love NV and feed the canned foods still and I wouldn't hesitate to feed the dry food again.