What's so bad about breeding 'designer' dogs?
- Thread starter ~Janessa
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GlassOnion- I don't recall asking, lol. It was just a response.
Psyfalcon- If/when the day you go blind and you refuse what's provided because it's not a labradoodle, good luck with that lol. In any event, if I said I needed a dog that was hyperallergenic and someone who trained the dog as a guide dog gave me a Basenji, I wouldn't complain. If a dog is trained, why do you care what breed it is? I think that's rather unfair, to be honest. Anyway, my point was was that there are already a huge list of dogs that "fit the bill" so I fail to see any reason to create more designer dogs, which they are to me until they are bred for an actual purpose.
Again I have to say, agree to disagree. Cheers!
Psyfalcon- If/when the day you go blind and you refuse what's provided because it's not a labradoodle, good luck with that lol. In any event, if I said I needed a dog that was hyperallergenic and someone who trained the dog as a guide dog gave me a Basenji, I wouldn't complain. If a dog is trained, why do you care what breed it is? I think that's rather unfair, to be honest. Anyway, my point was was that there are already a huge list of dogs that "fit the bill" so I fail to see any reason to create more designer dogs, which they are to me until they are bred for an actual purpose.
Again I have to say, agree to disagree. Cheers!
Well, I got my designer dog from a shelter. She is officially a MonkeyButt/MissMadam mix. (Pap and Pom mix). I got her as an adult, so house training was a breeze, she never chewed or destroyed and she has been the light of my life.
So yeah, breed designer dogs if you must, charge however much you want for them, but I am going to continue to get my super fancy dogs from shelters thanks.
So yeah, breed designer dogs if you must, charge however much you want for them, but I am going to continue to get my super fancy dogs from shelters thanks.
Here is my issue with breeding NON typical dogs for guide dogs. As it is there is a fairly high fail rate with puppies bred to be guide dogs as it is. It takes a lot of time and money, seperate from breeding healthy puppies to create a guide dog. Lets take Basenji's as I love the breed and they were brought up (though they aren't really hypoallergenic in anyway I have heard when talking to breeders).
To breed basenji's to have the qualities to be a guide dog you would have lots and lots of surplus puppies. Yes they place them, but that is the same as if you are creating a breed, you will have lots of surplus pet puppies to place. Also you will not be breeding to the standard, as they don't have the correct temperament to be guide dogs. Very few breeds do. So they will be producing off standard surplus pups. This is not good for the breed, and it is not good for guide dogs as it would substantially raise the cost of each successful guide dog produced.
This is why they try to breed the best dog for the job, not try to simply find them. IMO this way will produce less extra pups to contribute to the over population.
So corgi love... since the cattle dog is often over all a better herder than corgi's are you ok with getting rid of corgis? (don't get me wrong I love corgis just making a point) I know people who like goldendoodles. Are you saying they should not be able to have one. That you should have to pick a cattle dog (a small herding dog same idea as corgi... and MUCH more similar than comparing a goldendoodle to many of the breeds you mentioned) If people find them in shelters that is great, but there are people who want puppies. I work with JRT rescue, I have fostered and worked with some great dogs, but only one I would have wanted to own. Does that make me bad that I want certain things in a companion?
yep agree to disagree. I am all for genetic diversity, I am against people saying what dogs people should own (this is why I am sooo against BSL) I think ethical breeding is more important than breed.
To breed basenji's to have the qualities to be a guide dog you would have lots and lots of surplus puppies. Yes they place them, but that is the same as if you are creating a breed, you will have lots of surplus pet puppies to place. Also you will not be breeding to the standard, as they don't have the correct temperament to be guide dogs. Very few breeds do. So they will be producing off standard surplus pups. This is not good for the breed, and it is not good for guide dogs as it would substantially raise the cost of each successful guide dog produced.
This is why they try to breed the best dog for the job, not try to simply find them. IMO this way will produce less extra pups to contribute to the over population.
So corgi love... since the cattle dog is often over all a better herder than corgi's are you ok with getting rid of corgis? (don't get me wrong I love corgis just making a point) I know people who like goldendoodles. Are you saying they should not be able to have one. That you should have to pick a cattle dog (a small herding dog same idea as corgi... and MUCH more similar than comparing a goldendoodle to many of the breeds you mentioned) If people find them in shelters that is great, but there are people who want puppies. I work with JRT rescue, I have fostered and worked with some great dogs, but only one I would have wanted to own. Does that make me bad that I want certain things in a companion?
yep agree to disagree. I am all for genetic diversity, I am against people saying what dogs people should own (this is why I am sooo against BSL) I think ethical breeding is more important than breed.
Exactly, how many Basenji puppies would have to be bred in order to find one that will NOT chase a cat running from it? Thats so far out of what a Basenji is supposed to be, can you find them all homes? Maybe, they do look nice, and some people who want a bidable dog could now have one.
But guess what, you've just changed the temperament so much you might as well call it a different breed.
But guess what, you've just changed the temperament so much you might as well call it a different breed.
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Australian Cattle Dogs were raised and bred for the purpose of being able to be a good heeler in the Australian outback. A Cardigan/Pembroke Corgi's main purpose was to herd cattle without being kicked, hence their height. Not a great comparison on your part, but I do see your point. Oh well, we can't agree on everything 
:yikes::yikes:
if you'll get rid of JRT's - after all, can't ya just use a patterdale??
I agree - many breeds are unsuitable for guide work. There's a reason the majority of guide dogs are labs, goldens and GSD's. All three are big time shedders.
As for a comment a couple pages back about someone who hadn't seen two labradoodles that look alike - I have seen 3 that looked alike ~ but they were all clients at the same boarding kennel and it's possible they had all come from the same breeder. I never asked where they had come from.
if you'll get rid of JRT's - after all, can't ya just use a patterdale??
I agree - many breeds are unsuitable for guide work. There's a reason the majority of guide dogs are labs, goldens and GSD's. All three are big time shedders.
As for a comment a couple pages back about someone who hadn't seen two labradoodles that look alike - I have seen 3 that looked alike ~ but they were all clients at the same boarding kennel and it's possible they had all come from the same breeder. I never asked where they had come from.
Well, maybe you folks should get involved in the service dog training organizations then. After all, they were the ones who started breeding doodles for "no reason". I think the fail rate of standard poodles in one was something like 1 in 12 (though I'd have to double check to be sure) which is why they used poodle crosses. And the reasons they failed were exactly because the poodles were too defensive with the general public, showing teeth etc. That's 11 puppies being born and having to go to a pet home for every 1 service animal. If that rate become even 1 in 6, that saves a crapload of money for the organization, as it's something like $20,000 to train each animal. To have that high a fail rate tells me that something about the breed makes it unsuitable for the work they expected of it, and they why they are going about creating a new breed to do that work.
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There's something I don't get about this "hipo allergernic" stuff.
Why a dog has to be a non shedding for being hypo allergic?
I can undested why people want a dog that dosen't shed, I'm not expert in fur allergies but how come a person that's allergic to dogs is not goin to be allergic to it if the fur isen't ON the dog??
Maybe because a dog hair can get inside in a person nose, but that will be if they are only allergic to breat the fur.
But for what I heard some people that's allergic to dogs and cats is because they touch the fur and have allergic reactions it dosen't matter if the hair is ON or outside the dog.
Can someone please explain this to me?? I just don't get it why the issue that has to be a non shedding dog to be hypo allergenic.
Why a dog has to be a non shedding for being hypo allergic?
I can undested why people want a dog that dosen't shed, I'm not expert in fur allergies but how come a person that's allergic to dogs is not goin to be allergic to it if the fur isen't ON the dog??
Maybe because a dog hair can get inside in a person nose, but that will be if they are only allergic to breat the fur.
But for what I heard some people that's allergic to dogs and cats is because they touch the fur and have allergic reactions it dosen't matter if the hair is ON or outside the dog.
Can someone please explain this to me??
I just don't get it why the issue that has to be a non shedding dog to be hypo allergenic.
I think the allergies are something to do with how much dander a dog produces. Some produce more than others..
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure thats it. I didn't think it had anything to do with how much the dog sheds, but how much dander it produces.
Sooo... therefore, a dog could shed to high heaven, but if it produces little or no dander, then it would be hypoallergenic right?
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure thats it. I didn't think it had anything to do with how much the dog sheds, but how much dander it produces.
Sooo... therefore, a dog could shed to high heaven, but if it produces little or no dander, then it would be hypoallergenic right?
Australian Cattle Dogs were raised and bred for the purpose of being able to be a good heeler in the Australian outback. A Cardigan/Pembroke Corgi's main purpose was to herd cattle without being kicked, hence their height. Not a great comparison on your part, but I do see your point. Oh well, we can't agree on everything
Same job, no need for the Corgi.
S
There's something I don't get about this "hipo allergernic" stuff.
Why a dog has to be a non shedding for being hypo allergic?
I can undested why people want a dog that dosen't shed, I'm not expert in fur allergies but how come a person that's allergic to dogs is not goin to be allergic to it if the fur isen't ON the dog??
Maybe because a dog hair can get inside in a person nose, but that will be if they are only allergic to breat the fur.
But for what I heard some people that's allergic to dogs and cats is because they touch the fur and have allergic reactions it dosen't matter if the hair is ON or outside the dog.
Can someone please explain this to me?? I just don't get it why the issue that has to be a non shedding dog to be hypo allergenic.
Why a dog has to be a non shedding for being hypo allergic?
I can undested why people want a dog that dosen't shed, I'm not expert in fur allergies but how come a person that's allergic to dogs is not goin to be allergic to it if the fur isen't ON the dog??
Maybe because a dog hair can get inside in a person nose, but that will be if they are only allergic to breat the fur.
But for what I heard some people that's allergic to dogs and cats is because they touch the fur and have allergic reactions it dosen't matter if the hair is ON or outside the dog.
Can someone please explain this to me??
I just don't get it why the issue that has to be a non shedding dog to be hypo allergenic.
Cats, on the other hand, are a little different. Its not their dander that people are allergic to, its their saliva when they lick themselves. Thats what I heard on a TV show on discovery channel anyway.
I honestly do not see sound logic in the whole getting rid of already established breeds argument... NO ONE here wants to kill dogs, or eliminate breeds.
I have no problem with people responsibly, ethically creating new breeds to fill a need. I DO have a HUGE problem with a girl breeding her Labrador to her Mom's Poodle to make cute puppies... THEN, after the breeding is done, show some interest in helping to establish a breed. Maybe she could have thought of this before bringing 8 lives into the world? Maybe. Her breeding her pet Lab to a pet Poodle is doing absolutely ZERO to help the "breed". I also have HUGE problems with the fact that Labradoodles have simply become a trendy pet to have... what percentage of them, do you think, are the product of a breeder who genuinely wants to make this a breed? .0001% maybe? What percentage is actually used for guide work? Personally, I have met ONE single guide dog Labradoodle, and it was a puppy in training. She was also very skittish and shy... I highly doubt that she ever became a guide dog. What percentage is anywhere beyond F1/F2? What percentage descends from more than simply a Labrador and a Poodle? What percentage is bred with ANY regard for health and "conformation"? I would guess, a miniscule number.
What I hate most is that this whole craze is producing, at least in the vast majority, poorly/randomly-bred pet dogs on a huge scale. There are currently more Labradoodle ads in my paper than there are for Labradors, which is just bizarre. It's like a puppy mill/BYB DREAM! They not only get to breed completely random dogs and add in whatever mixes they please, they also know that there are no limitations as far as conformation, and they rely on the "hybrid vigor" myth to trick buyers into thinking their puppy is going to be healthy.
I have no problem with people responsibly, ethically creating new breeds to fill a need. I DO have a HUGE problem with a girl breeding her Labrador to her Mom's Poodle to make cute puppies... THEN, after the breeding is done, show some interest in helping to establish a breed. Maybe she could have thought of this before bringing 8 lives into the world? Maybe. Her breeding her pet Lab to a pet Poodle is doing absolutely ZERO to help the "breed". I also have HUGE problems with the fact that Labradoodles have simply become a trendy pet to have... what percentage of them, do you think, are the product of a breeder who genuinely wants to make this a breed? .0001% maybe? What percentage is actually used for guide work? Personally, I have met ONE single guide dog Labradoodle, and it was a puppy in training. She was also very skittish and shy... I highly doubt that she ever became a guide dog. What percentage is anywhere beyond F1/F2? What percentage descends from more than simply a Labrador and a Poodle? What percentage is bred with ANY regard for health and "conformation"? I would guess, a miniscule number.
What I hate most is that this whole craze is producing, at least in the vast majority, poorly/randomly-bred pet dogs on a huge scale. There are currently more Labradoodle ads in my paper than there are for Labradors, which is just bizarre. It's like a puppy mill/BYB DREAM! They not only get to breed completely random dogs and add in whatever mixes they please, they also know that there are no limitations as far as conformation, and they rely on the "hybrid vigor" myth to trick buyers into thinking their puppy is going to be healthy.