He's a brat now. I need support.

bcmoffatt

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#1
Sigh.
Overnight, Cricket went from perfect wonder puppy to brain dead, selectively deaf idiot dog. I already have an idiot dog! LOL! Cricket was supposed to be the good one. j/k. :D

He's still a really good boy, don't get me wrong, but he's being awful with training practice. He's no longer doing things he was doing at 100% three weeks ago.
I'm having a lot of trouble keeping him interested and focused. I have been feeding him his dinner as rewards during training, and he still won't focus. I get him all fired up with a tug and use that as reward and it works a bit better, but obviously not for heeling. His recall is CRAP now. He gets within 6 feet of me and wanders off. Even if I run away from him.

I understand this is a normal phase at this age, but what exactly can I expect? What do I do?? He's by no means out of control, he's still well-mannered and obeys the basics, and I've taken away any liberties, but I'd really like to stay on track with training. All his littermates are owned by people with way more experience than me. I don't want to be an obvious and total failure, since I see them a lot, and it would be obvious. LOL.

Any tricks or techniques that anyone can recommend? I have class with him in two days, and I haven't managed to get anything out of him practice wise since last class. Last week, he ran away from me during the heeling exercise. He ran out of the training hall, through the lobby and into the office...:rolleyes:

People laugh and think it's cute when a husky puppy does that... A Border Collie does it? Ooh, you must be the worst trainer ever! LOL!


HELP!
 

Dekka

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#2
Ah I 'love' that stage. You can't win. What I do for the next few weeks is to not train much. All it does is frustrate both of you. Just play, don't put him in situations where he can chose not to listen.

When its over all the training you did previously will still be there.
 

ihartgonzo

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#3
Awww, little Cricket is entering his d-bag adolescent phase! I know it's hard, but it happens to all of us. *hug*

I recommend taking a few steps back, as far as his training goes. Use a leash or a long-line, so that he does not have the option of running away, or wandering off, or ignoring commands. Don't feed him anything - at all - before training sessions, and use SUPER high value treats to get him motivated. The tug is a good idea!

It sounds like you're doing everything right. Don't worry... this is THE worst part, and it could be a lot worse! ; )
 

lizzybeth727

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#4
I agree, don't worry too much about training right now, just try to manage behaviors (keep him on leash, etc.) so that he doesn't learn to ignore you.
 

bcmoffatt

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Ah I 'love' that stage. You can't win. What I do for the next few weeks is to not train much. All it does is frustrate both of you. Just play, don't put him in situations where he can chose not to listen.

When its over all the training you did previously will still be there.
Awww, little Cricket is entering his d-bag adolescent phase! I know it's hard, but it happens to all of us. *hug*

I recommend taking a few steps back, as far as his training goes. Use a leash or a long-line, so that he does not have the option of running away, or wandering off, or ignoring commands. Don't feed him anything - at all - before training sessions, and use SUPER high value treats to get him motivated. The tug is a good idea!

It sounds like you're doing everything right. Don't worry... this is THE worst part, and it could be a lot worse! ; )

Thanks. That's what I thought. :( I tried to combine play AND training to make it as fun and interesting as possible, but that only helped a little. He's crated all day, I don't feed him before hand, and I STILL get minimal interest. I've been hand-feeding him and limiting his time with Kena, and I've noticed it's made him more clingly and fixated on me in general, but not in training.

My trainer says not to expect anything of him, and not to be hard on him at all. I guess I'm going to have to be prepared to be embarrassed in class for the next little bit.

Play and fun it is, I guess. :)
I can always stand to play tug and build drive, right? He's been starting to fly at me for the tug and make chomps in the air at the tug. He moves so fast I can't really see him, but I hear his teeth clack. Wheee.

How long can this last? With Kena, he didn't come around until 18 mouths or so. I hope it doesn't take quite that long!!

Thanks for making me feel better. :)
 

Dekka

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#6
Start working on self control. Not taking the tug till invited. Letting go promptly on cue etc


Hmm that reminds me have you seen this vid on youtube? Its hysterical... but also demonstrates what I mean by self control.
 

bcmoffatt

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#7
Start working on self control. Not taking the tug till invited. Letting go promptly on cue etc


Hmm that reminds me have you seen this vid on youtube? Its hysterical... but also demonstrates what I mean by self control.
I did see that on here like, last week? It's soo funny. Awesome! I don't really have problems with out, but I do whack and push on them while they tug. I try and push them back and keep them away, and they go NUTS! I want to make a monster out of Cricket. :)

Are you still thinking of taking privates there? If you ever need a place to stay here let me know!
 

Dekka

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#8
Nah Dekka's contact issue resolved itself before I ever got to say yes.

The whole taunting thing with the tug and not having them grab it works really well with drivey dogs. I do that with Zo.
 

lizzybeth727

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I tried to combine play AND training to make it as fun and interesting as possible, but that only helped a little. He's crated all day, I don't feed him before hand, and I STILL get minimal interest. I've been hand-feeding him and limiting his time with Kena, and I've noticed it's made him more clingly and fixated on me in general, but not in training.
Here's what I would do:

He's not interested in training? Then don't interest yourself in him.

To me, it's kind of like building food drive (only train before meals) or toy drive (keeping the toy away, etc.). Continue doing NILIF - he has to work for everything you give him - but keep your interractions with him to a minimum. Fix his meals in a bowl, and wait until he sits; when he sits, quietly put the bowl down and let him eat, without interracting with him any more. Take him outside to potty on leash, don't try any recalls or play, just potty and a little exercise if needed. Don't talk to, pet, or play with your puppy.

It usually only takes about one day before your puppy will be begging to work for you. When he starts getting clingy, ask him to sit or lay or something simple, and when he does, pet and praise him enthusiastically for about 3 seconds - not long. Then go back to ignoring him for a while (maybe 20 or 30 minutes, more if it takes him longer to start clinging to you again). Gradually ask for more and more difficult behaviors, increase your rewards, and decrease the amount of time you ignore him until he's enthusiastic about training consistently again. Again, it usually only takes a few days before puppies are back to "normal", although you'll certainly have temporary setbacks for several more months.
 

SharkBait

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#10
What age is Cricket now bcmoffat?
Matisse was mostly a brat at about 5 months onwards... he still is... but has improved a bit now that he's grown a bit (he's 10 months now), like i actually think he's gained a bit of respect for me, before it was like he set out to annoy me! :rolleyes:
i lol'd picturing Cricket running away in obedience, hehe he sounds like a lil rebel!
It reminds me of the other day... i had to do a recall in obedience class... so the trainer held him at one end of the hall, and i stood at the other end. i called him, he came bounding over so quickly, only to swerve right past me at last minute and cause havoc! winding up all the other dogs and going crazy!! oh dear... i was rather embarassed, but i guess he's still a pup, and not a robot! :p
 

bcmoffatt

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#12
What age is Cricket now bcmoffat?
Matisse was mostly a brat at about 5 months onwards... he still is... but has improved a bit now that he's grown a bit (he's 10 months now), like i actually think he's gained a bit of respect for me, before it was like he set out to annoy me! :rolleyes:
i lol'd picturing Cricket running away in obedience, hehe he sounds like a lil rebel!
It reminds me of the other day... i had to do a recall in obedience class... so the trainer held him at one end of the hall, and i stood at the other end. i called him, he came bounding over so quickly, only to swerve right past me at last minute and cause havoc! winding up all the other dogs and going crazy!! oh dear... i was rather embarassed, but i guess he's still a pup, and not a robot! :p
Yep, he's just over 5 months old. :rolleyes:
He's only really being bad with training. He's by no means a terror or anything. I'm mostly upset because I had been having so much fun training him, and know he won't pay attention.
I guess it was funny when he ran away... hehe. It's not so much that he's being a rebel, but that there are sooooo many things in the world to see that are more exciting for him right now.
That's what I get, I suppose. Up until now, he's been pretty much blowing all the other dogs in his class away. He's 3 months younger than the next oldest dog, and all the other ones are much older than that. People were starting to think he's a robot, actually! :D
 

milos_mommy

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#13
hahahaha you're going through the bratty teenage stage. All I can say is "better you than me" :p. Just cured my puppy fever, thanks!
 

bcmoffatt

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#14
I seem to have given the impression that Cricket is a bad boy, which is untrue. He's still a fantabulous puppy, he's just not perfect anymore! :p

The last two dogs I raised were huskies, so Cricket is going to have to pe preeetty creative if he wants to top some of the trouble they gave me! LOL! :D
 

bcmoffatt

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Ooooooh, shouldn't've said that, you just jinxed yourself!!!!!
And creative is a Border Collies first middle and last names! :D:D:D:D
Hehehe.. I know, but he's not really like that. He's smart, but I wouldn't describe him as much of a thinker, and he's definitely not devious... Someone on another forum I'm on has a BC a month younger than Cricket, and he's been giving her trouble. Cricket has been a breeze so far. (fingers crossed that he stays that way now!)
 

Lizmo

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#19
Blaze is just slightly starting to blow me off on some very, very easy commands.

And with me I'm always thinking "He's a Border Collie, he's smart he should remember that! Border Collies are so fast and quick". So I have to keep myself in check during those times....which itsn't easy :eek:
 

bcmoffatt

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Blaze is just slightly starting to blow me off on some very, very easy commands.

And with me I'm always thinking "He's a Border Collie, he's smart he should remember that! Border Collies are so fast and quick". So I have to keep myself in check during those times....which itsn't easy :eek:
You're how many weeks behind us? LOL! It seriously just started like 2 weeks ago. Things got really good right after that video I took and posted, and then went to crap. I'm sure he still knows his stuff, it's still there, like Dekka said, he's just trying to blow me off. I'm going to keep him on a short leash, so to speak... But I can't make him want to train, and I won't try. I don't want to squish his drive for it.

And it is the easy ones he's fudging. The ones he was awesome with. Like his recall, and his heeling just got awesome and then it went. The things he took a bit longer to learn are still working, like down at a distance, and even the stand-stay. Erg. I did manage to get a little bit out of him this morning. And he did look happy about doing it.
 

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