Training classes
- Thread starter lizzybeth727
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Everyone has different opinions so I'm not saying yours is 'wrong', but ....
Lizzybeth is going to be teaching clicker training .. plenty of people have never even heard of clicker training. I am familiar with clicker training and it's principles ... but have never actually used clicker training so I would really appreciate it if a trainer using that particular method had a "no-dogs" policy for the first class!
Ihartgonzo also mentioned the place she brings her dogs (4Paws University) does a first "no dogs" class ... and 4Paws is one of the best places to bring dogs for training.
Lizzybeth is going to be teaching clicker training .. plenty of people have never even heard of clicker training. I am familiar with clicker training and it's principles ... but have never actually used clicker training so I would really appreciate it if a trainer using that particular method had a "no-dogs" policy for the first class!
Ihartgonzo also mentioned the place she brings her dogs (4Paws University) does a first "no dogs" class ... and 4Paws is one of the best places to bring dogs for training.
I'm in the middle of a puppy class with my puppy,,and the first class was without the dogs, the trainer explained theory and method of clicker, tho I am familiar with it, and have used a clicker,,most were not,,I did not find it boring as I'm always willing to listen to new ideas/even old ones from a different person's perspective..
One thing, I have to say I really do not like about this puppy class, is the absolute lack of respect some people have for other dog's "space"...Alot of these people are very very new to owning puppies, and just let things the trainer say go in one ear and out the other.
I'm finding this "positive class" isn't a real positive experience for MY puppy, when others are allowing their puppies to jump on her and scare the crap out of her..
(
Ok my vent for the day)
diane
One thing, I have to say I really do not like about this puppy class, is the absolute lack of respect some people have for other dog's "space"...Alot of these people are very very new to owning puppies, and just let things the trainer say go in one ear and out the other.
I'm finding this "positive class" isn't a real positive experience for MY puppy, when others are allowing their puppies to jump on her and scare the crap out of her..
(Ok my vent for the day
)diane
I guess to me it would just be like hiring a horse trainer to do lessons with you and your horse and having the first lesson completely horseless, with the trainer going into riding theory instead. It just seems weird to me.
I'm a learn by seeing and doing type person. Being told how to use a clicker would not really sink in.
That's just me though....
I'm a learn by seeing and doing type person. Being told how to use a clicker would not really sink in.
That's just me though....
LOL!
I want to clicker train humans! What will you be using as treats?...
As far as learning by doing rather than hearing... many people learn in the same way. It's a good thing that it's only the FIRST class, which will be an overview of the class objectives/rules/etc in addition to the fundamentals of clicker training, is going to be dogless. It's not like Lizzybeth is holding 8 weeks of dogless classes. The classes that I have been to in which everyone brought their dogs on the first day were pure chaos; because, honestly, the average person doesn't even teach their dog basic commands like "sit" or "down, much less how to walk decently on a leash, behave in public, etc. Add onto that the fact that the trainer is trying to go over rules, etiquette, a course outline, etc; with a bunch of dogs barking/whining and people paying more attention to their dogs than to the trainer. Even if going over basics is boring to you, it probably isn't to the "average" dog owner enlisted in basic obedience... I'm pretty sure that was the point Golden and others were trying to make.
I want to clicker train humans!
What will you be using as treats?... As far as learning by doing rather than hearing... many people learn in the same way. It's a good thing that it's only the FIRST class, which will be an overview of the class objectives/rules/etc in addition to the fundamentals of clicker training, is going to be dogless. It's not like Lizzybeth is holding 8 weeks of dogless classes. The classes that I have been to in which everyone brought their dogs on the first day were pure chaos; because, honestly, the average person doesn't even teach their dog basic commands like "sit" or "down, much less how to walk decently on a leash, behave in public, etc. Add onto that the fact that the trainer is trying to go over rules, etiquette, a course outline, etc; with a bunch of dogs barking/whining and people paying more attention to their dogs than to the trainer. Even if going over basics is boring to you, it probably isn't to the "average" dog owner enlisted in basic obedience... I'm pretty sure that was the point Golden and others were trying to make.
LOL!
I want to clicker train humans! What will you be using as treats?...
I want to clicker train humans!
What will you be using as treats?...
I think that one of the problems with how clicker training is taught is that it's presented in such a way that really intimidates people. While it is a science, it's certainly not rocket science and can be explained and demonstrated.. and used in a very short period of time.
I used to teach all of my classes without the dogs present. I added clicker training some 10 years ago and have been using them in all of my puppy classes and many of my other formats without difficulty with respect to client understanding or compliance ever since...with the exception of the first few months when I felt it necessary to explain the heck out of what a reward marker was.
Now, with a brief discussion on 'why' clicker training works so well, what it means to the dog (that a reward's coming), and how it's best used by the owners (like a camera, 'clicking' a picture of what you wanted to see), I've seen a drastic reduction in the confusion over this powerful, temporary, and really simple training tool.
I do hand out my own booklet to every client with every clicker question known to man/woman for reference and of course we continue to fine tune, dispell myths, and teach principles as we go.
I found that if presented as clearly and simply as it really is, it's actually quite easy to do on the first night with dogs present.
I also used to do the owner exercises and other techniques that I learned from Chicken Camp in order to gently 'desensitize' clients to the clickers but found that this over-explanation made things much worse. People were over thinking everything and many just dropped the clicker because it seemed to complicated.
I started 16 puppies last night, will start another 32+ tomorrow and each one will learn and use the clicker within the first 1/2 of my 1 hour class..with success.
I've also dropped the old "charge the clicker" routine as well. This is another exercise that I find wastes time and complicates the process. If done right, we all know that a "clicker virgin" puppy can and does understand the meaning of the click by simply using it for a new, easy behavior such as "Watch Me".
Again, this is just my opinion but having done this for as many years as I have and having done it both ways, I'd never waste an entire class and the opportunity to meet and 'read' new dogs in order to have the owners undivided attention. It is a dog class after all..
Oh, and I have to add that I am a BIG believer that training is about the owner and the dog, not the trainer and the dog, and I make that clear in every class. The dogs presence in the first class is entirely for the benefit of the dog/handler team and the safety of the group.
With all of my classes, like I've stated in a previous post, I am extremely detailed with my registration to avoid or eliminate first night safety issues. Rules are very clearly given both over the phone and with follow-up email to all who attend.
I can't tell you the number of people who choose my class over other, equally qualified trainers simply because their dog can attend and begin learning from the very first night.
Just another way to look at it....
I used to teach all of my classes without the dogs present. I added clicker training some 10 years ago and have been using them in all of my puppy classes and many of my other formats without difficulty with respect to client understanding or compliance ever since...with the exception of the first few months when I felt it necessary to explain the heck out of what a reward marker was.
Now, with a brief discussion on 'why' clicker training works so well, what it means to the dog (that a reward's coming), and how it's best used by the owners (like a camera, 'clicking' a picture of what you wanted to see), I've seen a drastic reduction in the confusion over this powerful, temporary, and really simple training tool.
I do hand out my own booklet to every client with every clicker question known to man/woman for reference and of course we continue to fine tune, dispell myths, and teach principles as we go.
I found that if presented as clearly and simply as it really is, it's actually quite easy to do on the first night with dogs present.
I also used to do the owner exercises and other techniques that I learned from Chicken Camp in order to gently 'desensitize' clients to the clickers but found that this over-explanation made things much worse. People were over thinking everything and many just dropped the clicker because it seemed to complicated.
I started 16 puppies last night, will start another 32+ tomorrow and each one will learn and use the clicker within the first 1/2 of my 1 hour class..with success.
I've also dropped the old "charge the clicker" routine as well. This is another exercise that I find wastes time and complicates the process. If done right, we all know that a "clicker virgin" puppy can and does understand the meaning of the click by simply using it for a new, easy behavior such as "Watch Me".
Again, this is just my opinion but having done this for as many years as I have and having done it both ways, I'd never waste an entire class and the opportunity to meet and 'read' new dogs in order to have the owners undivided attention. It is a dog class after all..
Oh, and I have to add that I am a BIG believer that training is about the owner and the dog, not the trainer and the dog, and I make that clear in every class. The dogs presence in the first class is entirely for the benefit of the dog/handler team and the safety of the group.
With all of my classes, like I've stated in a previous post, I am extremely detailed with my registration to avoid or eliminate first night safety issues. Rules are very clearly given both over the phone and with follow-up email to all who attend.
I can't tell you the number of people who choose my class over other, equally qualified trainers simply because their dog can attend and begin learning from the very first night.
Just another way to look at it....
I would suggest that the students bring their own rewards, same as they would as if it was their dog. lol, small, soft and easy to eat AND various levels of the value, along with lots.
People could have allergies, diabetes etc, much easier to ask them to bring their own. Not to mention avoiding the headache of you trying to figure out what to use.
Another suggestion, why not trying to run two different classes? One that is dogless for the first class and the other which has the dogs there, especially for those people that balk at being dogless
Then you can also figure out which class progressed faster and which one you prefer. Just a thought.
People could have allergies, diabetes etc, much easier to ask them to bring their own. Not to mention avoiding the headache of you trying to figure out what to use.
Another suggestion, why not trying to run two different classes? One that is dogless for the first class and the other which has the dogs there, especially for those people that balk at being dogless
Then you can also figure out which class progressed faster and which one you prefer. Just a thought.
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Well that explains it then.
Gonzo was right on in her last reply ... people have different learning styles.
Visual = Learns best by reading, seeing diagrams & pictures, watching others.
Auditory = Learns best by listening and reciting, talking with others.
Kinesthetic = Learns best by doing, needs hands-on activity.
Most people are a combination, with definite leanings toward one or the other. True kinesthetic learners are the least common type.
Gonzo was right on in her last reply ... people have different learning styles.
Visual = Learns best by reading, seeing diagrams & pictures, watching others.
Auditory = Learns best by listening and reciting, talking with others.
Kinesthetic = Learns best by doing, needs hands-on activity.
Most people are a combination, with definite leanings toward one or the other. True kinesthetic learners are the least common type.
Again, this is just my opinion but having done this for as many years as I have and having done it both ways, I'd never waste an entire class and the opportunity to meet and 'read' new dogs in order to have the owners undivided attention. It is a dog class after all..
Oh, and I have to add that I am a BIG believer that training is about the owner and the dog, not the trainer and the dog, and I make that clear in every class. The dogs presence in the first class is entirely for the benefit of the dog/handler team and the safety of the group.
With all of my classes, like I've stated in a previous post, I am extremely detailed with my registration to avoid or eliminate first night safety issues. Rules are very clearly given both over the phone and with follow-up email to all who attend.
I can't tell you the number of people who choose my class over other, equally qualified trainers simply because their dog can attend and begin learning from the very first night.
Just another way to look at it....
Oh, and I have to add that I am a BIG believer that training is about the owner and the dog, not the trainer and the dog, and I make that clear in every class. The dogs presence in the first class is entirely for the benefit of the dog/handler team and the safety of the group.
With all of my classes, like I've stated in a previous post, I am extremely detailed with my registration to avoid or eliminate first night safety issues. Rules are very clearly given both over the phone and with follow-up email to all who attend.
I can't tell you the number of people who choose my class over other, equally qualified trainers simply because their dog can attend and begin learning from the very first night.
Just another way to look at it....