Horse incident: Am I at fault?

Miakoda

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#1
**sigh**

So yesterday afternoon the farrier was coming out to trim the horses and replace Lucky's shoes and Raja's only shoe (trying to heal up a quarter crack). Raja doesn't mind having his feet trimmed or filed down, but he cannot and will not stand for the hammer and nails part. Thus we have been sedating him (mildly) for the procedure. It has been this way every 6 weeks for the past 10 months.

Well, yesterday, I was not informed of the farrier's visit until 10 minutes before his arrival. I live an hour away now (thanks to distance + traffic). So my friend, the one who owns the house/property, said she'll handle everything. Heck, the farrier has even done the horses all by himself when he's had to. Even Raja.

I don't know why the brain farts occured, but after Raja was trimmed and whatnot, they decided to keep on going since he was standing so good. Yeah....after that first nail hit, he went berserk. He started trying to rear up and was lunging forwards and back. The farrier backed off and went to the truck to get the tranq shot. My friend, afraid Raja was going to hurt himself on the stand, for some reason bent down in front of him to grab the stand and fling it out of the way. She doesn't really remember exactly what happened, but the hand she put against the outer stall wall (he was tied in the aisle) ended up getting crushed when he went forward. She just remembers feeling the lead rope on her hand and then her fingers hitting metal.

The result is 2 completely crushed fingers, 3 ripped off fingernails, and a tiny portion of the tip of one finger being gone. And a sprained hand/wrist. She is at the doc's right now (an orthopedic hand surgeon) and I'm waiting to hear the final outcome.

I feel horrible about it and I can tell she and her husband are a bit pissed off. She is just telling me it was a freak thing and not to worry about it. She's had horses for 30 years so she knows the risks. But yet both her and her husband gave me a few quips on "working with him and getting him under control". I feel like a whipped puppy.

But..........I am pissed at the farrier for NOT sedating him beforehand. He knows he's supposed to sedate. We've done it this entire time with no problems. And I feel my friend should know better than to put herself between a freaked-out horse and a wall.

I offered to pay her medical bills, but she said they are at a 100% coverage point with their insurance. Even so, she said she wouldn't take anything.

Am I at fault here? Did my actions, or lack thereof, cause all this as I'm underhandedly being led to feel?
 

Taqroy

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#2
Uh....no I don't think you are at fault. Did your friend know that he is supposed to be sedated though? Even if she didn't, even I know better than to get between a freaked out horse and a wall and I have never ever owned horses. I'm sorry for your friend because that is a very costly mistake, but I don't think this was your fault.

And I would be super pissed at the farrier as well.
 

Miakoda

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#3
By the way, he's been there for 3 years now with absolutely zero problems.

And I'm just waiting on my final quote from RAMM fencing and we're going to getting our fence up here within the next month (keep fingers crossed!). I'm already on the books for the first week of December with the install guys.

I guess that even though they are saying "freak accident" and "not your fault" and "don't worry about it" on one hand, they follow it up with the "work with him" and "out of control with the farrier" comments.
 

Miakoda

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Uh....no I don't think you are at fault. Did your friend know that he is supposed to be sedated though? Even if she didn't, even I know better than to get between a freaked out horse and a wall and I have never ever owned horses. I'm sorry for your friend because that is a very costly mistake, but I don't think this was your fault.

And I would be super pissed at the farrier as well.
Yes, she knew. She's stood in for me before when I couldn't be there.
 

darkchild16

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#5
FOr one you would think she would give you more notice of the visit, two what she did was not the brightest thing in the world. Im sure in a barn they had something they can ue to knock it out of the way if she was that concerened. THe farrier shouldnt have risked it either.
 

Taqroy

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#6
Yes, she knew. She's stood in for me before when I couldn't be there.
Okay I'd place blame on her and the farrier then. If I were you I'd be tempted to put a stop to the backhanded comments. I'm sorry they're trying to make you feel guilty for something that IMO is clearly not your fault.
 

Brattina88

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#7
Accidents happen!! I can understand why you're feeling responsible, but I honestly think there is nothing you could've done any differently ;) I don't think you're at fault.

30 years with horses and the knowledge that the horse should've been sedated... I'm sorry, but it kinda sounds like your friend (AND the farrier) should've known better!! Her and her husbands quips sound like... hurt pride... :eek:

I wish her a speedy recovery!
 

mom2dogs

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#8
Definately not your fault!

and I would be super pissed at the farrier for not following the regular regimen, especially with me not being there to make the final decision.

I think they are right in saying he does need to be worked with (ONE time, repeating it doesn't help anybody), but results don't happen magically overnight for most issues. But you in no way, shape, or form should feel guilty when they did not take the precautions to make sure everyone (including him) was safe.
 

Cheza

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#9
No... and working with horses carries inherent risks, in particular with one that has a history of being difficult. Offhand I'd say they're trying to pass off the "I did something wrong" and toss the blame along to you. I had my hand crushed last year on a metal hitch by a mare (wasn't mine) who didn't like to be tied ... I'm not going to blame the fact that I put myself in a stupid position on her owner.

I'd be pissed if I had that kind of damage to my hand no doubt... but I'd be pissed at myself for not following the same old routine that always worked.
 

Zoom

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#10
I understand why you're upset, but you are not at fault here. She KNOWS how Raja is with the farrier and the farrier knows how Raja is with him and why he's supposed to be tranq'd. Since they made the conscious decision to work with him anyway, they assumed risk. And anyone who has been around horses at all KNOWS you don't get between a reacting horse and a wall, for this very reason!

It was an accident.
 

darkchild16

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#11
I also would be VERY hesitant to keep him there. Not because i think they will do something to him. BUT if that had been the Farrier you risk the chance of being sued if he felt like it.
 

skittledoo

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#12
I definitely would say that you are NOT at fault... I know I'm echoing everyone else when I say that they knew the risks, but the fact of the matter is they knew better in my opinion. I used to work as a barn manager at a local barn in VA and we had a horse that was extremely stubborn when it came to standing for the farrier. We had to mildly sedate him as well. He was a perfect horse in all other situations... but when it came to putting shoes on he just wasn't going to have it.
 

Brattina88

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#13
When I volunteered at Remelton, there was a horse that everyone knew liked to step on your feet, like slam down on them on purpose :rolleyes:
We weren't supposed to lead him out unless we had proper footwear on. Well, we were running behind one day and the volunteer who's turn it was to care for him didn't show up, so I just went in there really quickly and did it myself. And, yes, he stepped on my foot. It hurt like a you-know-what, but I kept very calm and kept him walking like it didn't happen, and he remained calm as well. I still have a scar from the bruise, but nothing was broken. It was my own fault, no one elses! I knew before hand, weighed my options in my head, and just did it... and I still don't regret it. :p :eek:
 

Sit Stay

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#14
It wasn't your fault - they knew his issues and decided to work with him anyways. It sounds like they made the very, very poor choice to push him past his limits and he couldn't handle it mentally. You had nothing to do with it!

I don't think she's saying that he needs to be worked with in a nasty way though. In a way I agree with her. Some horses are completely set in their ways and it's better to just take the easy road, but some can really benefit from short, positive sessions a few times a week. You know him best and how he would respond :)
 

Miakoda

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#15
I agree he needs to be worked with on that. But I'm usually alone out at the barn and IMO tying him up and tapping his hooves with the backside of a hoofpick....all by myself....is a recipe for disaster....IMO. And he's actually come a long way. I got him from my uncle and other than the very rare farrier visit, he was virtually "untouched". He had free roam of 90 acres with a pond. He was never in a barn (although they had their cattle barn that the horses could go into if they should so desire...but they had so much natural protection from the elements that I don't think they ever did). He was definitely never in a stall. AND he was an 8-yr-old stallion at the time. He's still intact.

But these days he stalls like a dream (well, as long as he's not watching his friends romp free without him). He's sooo mild mannered that we've used him for her kids' Boy Scouts demonstration stuff. He's not broke to ride yet (thanks to me either being pregnant and busy with a newborn), but you can saddle him and I can put the kids on his back with no problem. You can groom him with barely a move by him. And he'll stand quietly for the vet and farrier...as long as a hammer and nails aren't in the deal. Even when the resident mare is in heat, he'll do all of the above with little to know fuss (although I do take extra caution mentally).

And now I do think they are kinda blaming it on the fact that he's still intact.

I dunno. I just don't want a ruined friendship over this.

And Breeze, I finalized the fencing today with the installer using his supplier for the wood. He's coming in from OK the first week of December and then we'll move Raja here.
 

Paige

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#18
I wouldn't say anyone is at fault. Accidents happen especially when working with large animals. Hell my horse nearly shoved me into oncoming traffic on a busy road yesterday. I've had him for five years and children can lead him without issue. THANKS BUDDY! It's a risk we al ltake by being alive.

That being said are you working with him to behave better for the farrier?
 

Miakoda

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#19
I do work with him. But slow and steady. I know we've got to work on the freak-out when being shod.

But he's not a mean horse nor is it done out of temper or anger. It's more of a fear thing. As mentioned, you can do anything else to his feet and he'll stand there like he's bored to death.
 

Buckshot

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#20
When dealing with creatures that have a mind of their own, there are risks involved. I would not poke blame at anyone. If you cant handle a dog bite don't deal with dogs, if you can't handle a horse applying its weight on you don't deal with horses. Everyone involved needs to keep physics in mind and consider the horses weight and the durability of the human body in relation. Weigh the risks, just like driving your Prieus beside a semi doing 75 miles an hour, think of the physics involved.
 

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