BC needs urgent rescue in Ontario

*blackrose

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#1
I'm cross posting this from another forum. The poster is a member here, as well, but I don't think she's been here in quite some time.
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"I haven't talked to my friend in a while but she called me just now and has a huge problem.

Apparently over the past couple of months, Charlie has been dominant/aggressive (has bit her 4 times, one fairly nasty cut as I understood it). She's taken him to numerous trainers and nothing has helped (though there aren't any decent "behavioral" trainers in the area, so I'm not surprised). I'm not sure how long ago (likely 2 weeks maximum), but she had someone take him. She told the woman about his aggression, and the woman thought she could deal with it. However, she's pretty much told my friend (today) to come and get him ASAP......she can't cope. Problem is, my friend lives with her parents, and they won't allow him back in the house.

So guess who gets asked? LOL Now I'd be more than willing to take him temporarily to try and work with him, but with PJ being laid up, I don't want to take any chances bringing another dog into the house. Charlie hasn't been dog aggressive, but I'm just not prepared to chance it having an injured dog at home.

I have told her I will take him IF she finds him a home/rescue that'll take him and it's just a matter of here being an inbetween place where I'll just have to keep everyone separated for a couple of days. I'm just not prepared to do it long term.

She also asked me to find out if anyone on the dog forum I visited would be interested in taking him on. I honestly can't say how bad the aggression is since I haven't seen him since I took the pics, but being a young dog, I have a feeling he can be "rehabilitated", and I'm sure the issues won't seem as bad, or unfixable to someone who has knowledge and experience with dogs. My friend is NOT one of those people (Charlie is/was her first dog, and likely her last after this experience), and quite frankly I'm shocked that she chose a BC in her situation. She obviously didn't research the breed first.

There are some issues I feel have caused this behavior. First off, she lives in the city in a subdivision. Her yard is small, and most of it is taken up by a pool.....so he had no room to run. She did walk him (Two one hour walks/day), plus playtime, but he never got to be offleash/run. Secondly, her parents didn't want their house "wrecked" by the dog, so in the house he was pretty much in an x-pen all the time. So he was couped up and likely stressed/frustrated about it. Being a high energy breed with heavy exercise requirements, I think these things alone could have progressively caused his behavioral issues.

She did have a BC rescue willing to take him, but one of the "trainers" she went to called the rescue and told them he had "rage syndrome", so they will no longer take him. I've never even heard of "rage syndrome", but assume it's a term used by people who don't have an f'ing clue what the problem is.

Anyway. Charlie is now 9 months old, microchipped, up to date on shots and neutered. He has been raised with cats (not aggressive with them), and doesn't have dog aggression issues......it appears it's humans/authority he has issues with. If any of you have any suggestions on what to do here, or would be willing to take him on, please let me know. My friend is trying to do what's best for him here, and if he doesn't get out of the situation he's in real soon, she fears this woman may have him PTS or even dump him out in the middle of nowhere. She really is irate about my buddy not jumping on Christmas day to come collect him. My friend is also willing to drive him up to a few hours away if it means him finding a home (or foster home). If any of you are willing to take him on even as a foster and rehoming him yourselves, I'm sure she'd be willing to do that too.

She is trying to contact other rescues, but she's terrified she won't hear back from them (due to the holidays) in time before the woman that currently has him does something rash."

Some pictures (taken four months ago):




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I understand that not all dogs are salvagable, but I also understand that some aggression problems are escalated due to the dog's living conditions...I shudder to think of how Chloe would have turned out in the hands of a novice who had know idea what they were doing.

And although I've never seen the dog....I doubt it is rage syndrom. Really, really doubt it. We dogsat a Cocker one time that attacked a guest, constantly tried to bite at the kids, and would get extremely possessive over my mom and myself...but he didn't have rage syndrom, he was just babied by his owners and never given any rules. And because of that, he was euthanized. In a home that actually would have set down bounderies and enforced them he would have been fine (after a rough period while he got used to the new way of living) - he wasn't unstable, he just didn't have rules. From the description of the situation, that seems to be Charlie's predicament.

Can anybody help, or does anyone have any advice?
 

AgilityPup

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#3
Ah, man, I wish I was closer and could talk my parents into it. Seems like something that could be worked with, though it's hard to tell with how little information is given. It'd be nice to know what happened before he bit her each time, you know? Is he from a breeder that may take him back?

:( What a beautiful boy. I really wish there was something I could do.
 

AgilityPup

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#6
Mom and I are sitting here talking about him, and we both feel so bad... it seems like something that a little bit of stimulation and time and effort would take care of. I can't believe that OBCR isn't taking him!
 

*blackrose

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#7
Does it say where in Ontario he is? Would be helpful, Ontario is big :p
Ahaha, see, I'm in the states....I'm clueless. At least I just didn't say Canada. :eek: I think around Windsor.

It'd be nice to know what happened before he bit her each time, you know? Is he from a breeder that may take him back?
I'm not sure about the breeder...I'm sure he is from a breeder, but not one that will take him back.

I'll ask about the bite situations, but I think she's just as in the dark as we are.
 

*blackrose

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#8
I wish I could take him myself...but we just can't have an aggressive dog in the house with kids around. :( He'd have to stay outside, and that isn't the place for a dog that needs rehab.
 

AgilityPup

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#9
My mom has said that if one of us wasn't working/going to school, but sadly we all are. Even if I could talk her into it, he'd be in his crate a lot here (not a LOT, but while I'm at school) and we have a LOT of dogs, so probably not the proper place for him. And getting him here would rely on a transport arranged by members. But no, I just don't think I can talk them into it. :(
 
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#12
Poor boy. wish i was in a position to help. But if its windsor then thats really far any way

Ahaha, see, I'm in the states....I'm clueless. At least I just didn't say Canada. :eek: I think around Windsor.


.
It takes literally 24ish hours to travel ontario lol. its massive.
 

*blackrose

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#13
I googled and I'm only 5ish hours away from Windsor...ugh. Now I really wish I could take him. But if someone in the IN/KY/OH/IL area wants him, I could help with transport.

I'll definitally keep you all updated on him. So far the member hasn't been online yet today, but hopefully she can get us an update soon.
 

crazy_paws

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#14
He's incredibly beautiful.

I would offer to foster him, but I'm pretty far away. I don't have experience dealing with human agression either.
 

Zhucca

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#15
With some pondering, I could foster (and maybe keep) him. I don't have direct experience with my (using 'my' loosely. I don't have a dog.) own house dogs with handler aggression (besides resource guarding) however, I am very much willing to work on issues and have worked in a dog daycare for over two years, with countless positive reinforcement books under my "belt". I could provide an ideal home temporarily for him, since he could come to daycare every day and it would leave no chance for boredom.

Buuttt, I am a unexperienced dog owner. Basic dog obedience is a piece of cake (same with trick training), but I have little experience in actual behavior modification. Depending on the situation of this dog, it sounds like all he needs is a more dog/breed savvy home.

I'm in Alberta, however. It's a three day drive I think from Ontario.
 
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Whisper

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#16
WANT. WANT. WANT. But a) I'm way down in Arizona and b) I can't have a new dog right now anyway. Sigh. I hope someone can help Steve's twin.
 

JessLough

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#17
With some pondering, I could foster (and maybe keep) him. I don't have direct experience with my (using 'my' loosely. I don't have a dog.) own house dogs with handler aggression (besides resource guarding) however, I am very much willing to work on issues and have worked in a dog daycare for over two years, with countless positive reinforcement books under my "belt". I could provide an ideal home temporarily for him, since he could come to daycare every day and it would leave no chance for boredom.

Buuttt, I am a unexperienced dog owner. Basic dog obedience is a piece of cake (same with trick training), but I have little experience in actual behavior modification. Depending on the situation of this dog, it sounds like all he needs is a more dog/breed savvy home.

I'm in Alberta, however. It's a three day drive I think from Ontario.
36 hours if you go through the states. However, you still have to go through sask. and I do not think we have any members there. Most of our Canadians are in Ontario and Alberta, IIRC
 

Zhucca

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#18
36 hours if you go through the states. However, you still have to go through sask. and I do not think we have any members there. Most of our Canadians are in Ontario and Alberta, IIRC
Yeah, I can't think of anyone who lives in Saskatchewan. There's a lot more members in the states and to go directly across Canada would be much harder.
 

milos_mommy

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#19
If someone can find out more specific information about the aggression, what happens before he bites, at what age it's started, if he's had a full medical evaluation, if he's aggressive towards strangers or his handler, if he gives any warning before biting, and how bad the bites are, if it's just one bite or repeated biting/attacking, etc, I might *MIGHT* be able to find at least a foster home for him.
 
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#20
Thank you blackrose for cross-posting this for me, and thanks to all of you too. I'm hoping to get Charlie in the hands of someone who can get him back on track. Let's just say my friend bit off more than she could chew with this dog.

I met Charlie when he was 5 months old, and to be perfectly honest, he wasn't unlike any other BC puppy I've ever met (and I've met a fair amount lol). While I'm unsure as to when this all started, he had never bit my friend before I met him.

I've messaged her to call me when she gets home from work so I can ask her more questions about it all. I've written down the questions you've asked milo's mommy, and should have some answers by the end of the day.

As far as the bite situations go, knowing my friend, I can almost picture it. Being unexperienced when he has something she doesn't want him to have, I can be pretty sure she doesn't do the "higher value trade in" or move deliberately. I saw it when I met Charlie, she moved slowly in on him, almost in a nervous/stalking way. I can almost guarantee what he's doing is resource guarding, and she's just handled it wrong.

I'm going to ask my friend to talk to the woman who has him and see if I can go there and evaluate him in person. I'm sure the woman won't mind me going over if means there's a chance of him finding a new home. But we'll see. I'll do some tests with him, with food/toys/people, see how he reacts with the other dogs in the household...etc. Providing of course if she allows me to go. I may even ask if she minds if I videotape him while I do it (outside if necessary). That way you'll be able to see for yourselves what it is exactly he is doing. Much better than my trying to explain it.

Oh, and I did ask her about the breeder she got him from, and she's not saying she won't take him back (from what I've gathered), she simply refuses to respond to my friends email (which basically is a guaranteed, "I don't want YOUR problem back"). Typical of around here really, there's very few people in the area I'd consider to be good breeders.
 

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