Sigh..so it means nothing that positively trained dogs have won big in obedience, agility and Schutzhund? That I with my non obedience breed of dog regularly beat goldens and BC? Just because you don't think it feels balanced means nothing. Its what the dog feels that is important. I actually hardly ever praise my dogs, now that I think of it. My dogs know what is expected. And just because I don't hit my dogs does not mean there are no concequences, if they choose not to listen. But that doesn't happen often. my dogs respect me and for the most part *want* to work for me. You said in another thread that dogs don't like obedience. Now I know why..if you beat a dog they are not going to like it. Mine love obedience because, while it is hard, they know there are rewards. Its like school. Who would like HS if you had to be beated into submission. Many kids who are raised right, and who are properly stimulated, love school and achieve high marks. My dogs love 'school'.