Let's talk about MOVEMENT!

[FrenchKissed]

Interestingly enough, the gait on a show golden is nothing like the ones that actually work in the field.
Also in dealing with a breed like the pyr, they want the dog gaited in the ring, but the natural gait of the dog in work mode (i.e. moving across the pasture) is a fault in the ring. The alternate gate saves energy and strength and doesn't require as many resources and can be upheld for an extended period of time (hours if need be).

 

[PWCorgi]

The way a Cardigan (or Pemmie) moves is EXTREMELY important for the work they were originally bred for. A Corgi needs to be shockingly quick on their feet, with an effortless gait, and the ability to turn on a dime.

Too true!
It is very interesting to watch Izzy and Frodo play. Izzy has correct structure, Frodo does not...at all. Izzy dips and dives and cuts and spins circles around Frodo, the only way he can get her is in an all out run in a straight line because his legs are much longer than hers.

 

[Sada]

English Setter Movement according to the AKC Standard:

An effortless graceful movement demonstrating endurance while covering ground efficiently. Long forward reach and strong rear drive with a lively tail and a proud head carriage. Head may be carried slightly lower when moving to allow for greater reach of forelegs. The back strong, firm, and free of roll. When moving at a trot, as speed increases, the legs tend to converge toward a line representing the center of gravity.

As a judge told me on Saturday, a sporting dogs movement need to be correct or they will tire in the field quickly. I believe a trot is the normal pace for a sporting dog to move at rather than a gallop or a full out run, but I could be wrong on this.

 

[HoundedByHounds]

Setters quarter looking for birds in a bounding or galloping gait...watch here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M0zFbgbfqf0

English Setters working:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x0f8_t_7j8o&feature=related

 

[JennSLK]

Black and Tan Coonhound:

When viewed from the side, the stride of the Black and Tan Coonhound is easy and graceful with plenty of reach in front and drive behind. When viewed from the front the forelegs, which are in line with the width of the body, move forward in an effortless manner, but never cross. Viewed from the rear the hocks follow on a line with the forelegs, being neither too widely nor too closely spaced, and as the speed of the trot increases the feet tend to converge toward a center line or single track indicating soundness, balance and stamina. When in action, his head and tail carriage is proud and alert; the topline remains level.

 

[RedyreRottweilers]

Well we can always quote our standards, and that is certainly good information to know.

I am more interested in a rather informal discussion among those of us who are interested in learning and understanding structure as it relates to correct movement in the different breeds.

For example, misplaced upper arms, causing the appearance of an upright or short upper arm are common in my breed, the Rottweiler. This can cause a restriction of reach, lifting, and sometimes pounding, none of which are benficial for a trotting working dog.



For this reason lots of breeders in Rottweilers are seeking that elusive properly placed upper arm that is back under the body with good return and layback, as that generally produces strong reach in the front. If combined with the proper rear, then one has a dog who moves effortlessly and takes fewer steps than a dog with a more upright front or less turn of stifle in the rear.

')

 

[protodog]

Here is a question...

For breeds that work at a run, how valid is judging the movement at the trot?

Excellent question!. For anyone who's interested, here is a link to a study on speed in borzoi: http://www.nktelco.net/teine/speed2.htm

Not everyone involved in borzoi was exactly thrilled with the results. Three of the biggest factors that influence speed are length of loin, skin elasticity, and ear set. Shoulder angle wasn't particularly relevant.

Venus often plays with her cousin, Penny. Although I can't see what Venus looks like when I gait her, I've gotten a number of compliments on her movement at a trot. Penny, however, is the faster zoi at a gallop, and Penny's trot is atrocious. She is hackneyed, and she crosses over when seen coming towards you. Yet, Penny is the better runner when the two of them are out in the field together. Both girls have long loins, but Penny has tighter skin and higher set ears than V.

 

[FrenchKissed]

For this reason lots of breeders in Rottweilers are seeking that elusive properly placed upper arm that is back under the body with good return and layback, as that generally produces strong reach in the front. If combined with the proper rear, then one has a dog who moves effortlessly and takes fewer steps than a dog with a more upright front or less turn of stifle in the rear.

')

Wasn't it Pat Trotter? (I could be wrong) who said that what people were wanting is not what works in functionality? Something about how short upper arms (or equal upper arm length and forearm length) and the "90degree shoulders" is not contributive to a proper gait in just about any working breed.

Been a loooong time since I read that book....but I do remember the "fantastical" 90 degree angled shoulder argument.

 

[Dekka]

Protodog thanx for posting that! Very interesting. (They did a study on top dressage horses and found that many things that were thought to be very important conformationally were insignificant.)

I love it when people take an objective look at the link between function and conformation, vs just what is pleasing to the eye.

 

[Renee750il]

This is a pretty decent video of Filas moving around . . . and playing the infamous AHA! I'VE GOT YOU NOW! game, lol. These look to be fairly young dogs - I'm going to guess the big fawn male might be two years old, but that's my guess from his movements.

http://www.searchforvideo.com/watch...Fscience%2Fanimals%2Fdog%2Ffila-brasileiro%2F

 

[RedyreRottweilers]

In ALL dogs, the humerus is longer than the scapula. It is the placement of the bones that can cause the APPEARANCE of a shorter upper arm, or one that is more upright in appearance.

And yes, the actual 90 degree angle or 45 degree layback is a fallacy. This is much easier to understand when looking at the actual skeleton of a dog. The Gilberts also explain it pretty well in their book and in their seminar.