Fifty Shades of Grey...

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#21
Yeah, I will step out and say I loved it.

Was the writing great...nope. Was it an accurate portrayal of BDSM...yes and no. It was an accurate view of two damaged people attempting it.

I admit, I do NOT think Christian ever crossed over into abuse. Did he have a crap load of demons, oh yeah, but when Ana leaves, he lets her, every time. He NEVER ONCE ignores her safe word! Actually that is one of the big fights they have...he is so upset that she did NOT use it. He thought she understood the rules and she didnt...or at least didnt feel comfortable enough to use her safe word which is a problem.

I loved they psychology behind the book...Christians past really drove him to his future. He very likely had some kind of attachment disorder. He channeled that into very strict and controlled relationships after being well, molested, and brought into the world by an older woman. I have talked to several people involved in therapy and psychology and they liked it as well from that point.

I also like that I dont feel Ana came across as the "savior" and that he changed just because of a woman. It was a whole series of events coming together, he had lots of professional help as well. She gave him the motivation to try...and yes, that is believable.

Their relationship was messy. There were ups and downs. He acted like an ass at times, she acted very wishy washy and confusing at times.

For those who saw abuse etc in this...did you read all three books?

I am usually pretty frustrated with books that make a controlling jealous ass into a hero. SO many YA books do that. This one though, I admit, I dont think that is how he came across....it wasnt oh look, he loves me so much! It was oh look, something is REALLY wrong here.

Twilight....I HATE that series. Drives me bonkers. Read it three times thinking maybe I was just in a bad mood but no, ick. 50 Shades, yep, love it. I dont think the "sex scenes" are really that sexy because well, they really arent. They are a symbol often of their vulnerabilities and motivations and a lot of other stuff happens during them. For people who never read erotica I can get why they think it is...for people who like erotica I can see why if they go in thinkning this is erotica they would be let down...but I would never classify it as erotica or romance.
 

MicksMom

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#22
Also... When did he ignore her safe word? I heard that before I read them and I am on the third book and haven't seen it yet.
I don't remember him ignoring it. I do remember the emotional turmoil when the first time she used it, tho. Pretty sure that happened towards the end of the first book.
 

Fran101

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#23
I'm going to step out of this thread before I give myself a hernia lol but this article sums up my feelings quite well
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/carey-purcell/fifty-shades-of-grey-feminism_b_2395932.html

I'm not here to orgasm police, people need to enjoy what they enjoy, to be clear I have no problem with people enjoying the books.

but those books are not a healthy BDSM relationship. AT ALL.
from someone who partakes in such culture just trust me on this and say the realities of a christian grey dom would be ****ing horrifying.
 
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#24
but those books are not a healthy BDSM relationship. AT ALL.
No its not...because they are both screwed up going into it. They realize that and its kind of the premise of the book IMO. But I still think its accurate in that yes, that is what BDSM would look like with people who are using it for the wrong reasons.
 

Grab

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#25
I have not. It's right up there with the Twilight books on things I have not even a slight curiosity about, no matter how much hype they get.
 

Xandra

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#26
Ehh never been interested. I figured it would be just like Twilight, what with the controlling powerful dream-man taking an obsessive interest in an inexperienced woman etc. Not a setup that I find appealing. Not really into the hardcore BDSM scene either.


BUT this thread just made me download it, smh...

I plan to skim it.
 

Dizzy

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#28
Just stepping in to say....

It's fiction. I don't think it's supposed to be a guide to BDSM. So the fact it's "inaccurate" or "dangerous" is no surprise.

I mean, I've read books where someone got murdered in them, I probably wouldn't try to recreate it ;) I've also read books and seen films portraying all manner of things badly.

If you're using 50 shades of grey as a reference book.. You're doing it wrong.

**disclaimer** I've not read this book, and have no intention of reading it. I've read other books though, that portray different fetishes, and to be fair, they're all fantasy.... They're there to get a buzz from, not to use as a dummies guide.
 

MrsBoats

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#29
I'll be another that goes against the grain...I read all three 50 shades and all of the Twilight series. I read the ebook version of 50 shades and listened to all of the Twilights from my library's digital section. So I didn't drop a dime on any of it. And...I enjoyed them all. I look at these forms of books as chocolate cake for my brain. LOL...sometimes I just want to read something that I don't have to think too hard about, especially if I have a lot of crap going on in my work/personal life. Books like these are a good mental vacation from real life for me.

I totally knew that 50 Shades was a Twilight fan fiction spin off when I went to read it. When I downloaded any of those books....I was so not expecting to experience literary genius to the likes of Tolstoy or Jane Austin. LOL

I probably will go and see the movie but with one of my friends. I don't think I could get Mr. Boats to sit through it. He did watch the parts of the Twilight saga that are on TV and he liked them....go figure. I am bummed that Matt Bomer didn't get cast as Christian Grey. That man is hot! :hail:
 
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#30
Just stepping in to say....

It's fiction. I don't think it's supposed to be a guide to BDSM. So the fact it's "inaccurate" or "dangerous" is no surprise.

I mean, I've read books where someone got murdered in them, I probably wouldn't try to recreate it ;) I've also read books and seen films portraying all manner of things badly.

If you're using 50 shades of grey as a reference book.. You're doing it wrong.

**disclaimer** I've not read this book, and have no intention of reading it. I've read other books though, that portray different fetishes, and to be fair, they're all fantasy.... They're there to get a buzz from, not to use as a dummies guide.
I dig this, but there are certain tropes that drive me batty and the "I'm the one special woman in all the world who's going to change and save him!!!!" fantasy is one of them. I just can't abide it.
 

sparks19

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#31
Totally agree with Greenmajick! That was exactly how I saw the books as well.

It's not supposed to be a guide to BDSM and I don't think it's supposed to be an accurate portrayal really. I think it shows the way he tries to cope and suppress his deamons.
 
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#32
I dig this, but there are certain tropes that drive me batty and the "I'm the one special woman in all the world who's going to change and save him!!!!" fantasy is one of them. I just can't abide it.
Well yeah, those drive me crazy too but for me, personally, I didn't feel that so much in this book.
 

Beanie

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#33
Just stepping in to say....

It's fiction. I don't think it's supposed to be a guide to BDSM. So the fact it's "inaccurate" or "dangerous" is no surprise.

I mean, I've read books where someone got murdered in them, I probably wouldn't try to recreate it ;) I've also read books and seen films portraying all manner of things badly.

If you're using 50 shades of grey as a reference book.. You're doing it wrong.
I don't think that's quite what Fran is saying - I think more it's that the book is one of many in pop culture that promotes damaging relationships. And regardless if you're not "supposed" to use it as a manual or a how-to - I mean, women in the US really like co-dependent relationships because that's what TV and movies tell them a relationship should be like.

I read a manga series a few years ago where the main character was being pursued by three different guys. At the end of the series, she picks the guy who is emotionally and physically abusive. I was really disappointed that it ended that way, and even though I really liked the art, I'll never read through it again. And maybe "that's life" because sometimes people decide to marry somebody who is emotionally and physically abusive, but you know, I don't like it when my ACTUAL REAL-LIFE FRIEND marries an emotionally abusive jerk either, so I'd prefer to not re-live it in my fiction. That's just me personally... I know some people dig the whole "I LIKE MY FICTION JUST LIKE REAL LIFE. IT SUCKS." thing.


But at the same time, you know, people rage against this one but nobody rages against Nicholas Sparks, writer of ALL THINGS CO-DEPENDENCY. This is just a much easier target because the "harm" is much more obvious because the relationship is so overtly damaging to the characters involved.
 

Dizzy

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#34
Well on that note I posted a while ago about a pop songs lyrics being totally terrible (young girl singing about relationships, totally derogatory and the message was awful) and was very quickly shot down by many people here that "oh hay I've heard worse songs" and "it's just lyrics omg it's just a song"...

How is that any different?!

I can't remember the bloody song now to search for it!
 
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#35
I will say, I do worry a lot as sooo many o the young adult and new adult books make unhealthy relationships look like what they should be. All the passion and love and soul mates stuff overrides the controlling and manipulation that is often present. Some of the books actually address that and had the characters go through serious help to get healthy. Those I am ok with. Most though, oh every thing just works out because you know, love. I really do worry about impressionable girls from broken homes reading these type and thinking that real relationships and true love looks like that. It is a very real issue for me.

However, I just happen to feel 50 Shades does not promote an unhealthy relationship as the bad parts are pretty obvious and cause major issues that have to overcome. And that they actually have to work through things, not just admit they love each other and live happily ever after.

But yes, 50 Shades gets hammered about it a lot when it's crazy common throughout many books and best sellers.

And of course, everyone is going to have different reactions to different books. I think for me I went into reading it hearing how awful it was, how abusive, etc so maybe expecting really extreme stuff I ended up not seeing much at all.
 

Laurelin

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#36
Well on that note I posted a while ago about a pop songs lyrics being totally terrible (young girl singing about relationships, totally derogatory and the message was awful) and was very quickly shot down by many people here that "oh hay I've heard worse songs" and "it's just lyrics omg it's just a song"...

How is that any different?!

I can't remember the bloody song now to search for it!
It was a pink song and if I recall the lyrics didn't seem abusive to me. It was her singing about frustration but not acting on it. Like 'you're an asshole bit I love you' and well... To me that's just not that bad. How many tomes gave I said 'oh man I'm going to kill my sister or my dog. But I'm obviously not going to actually. It's a figure of speech.
 

Dizzy

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#37
Found it. It was pink, you're right. She sings about slapping her boyfriend in the face.

Which was on mainstream radio and is aimed at teenagers....

To me, it's 6 of one and half a dozen of the other. And I'm just sayin ;) if that's ok, and acceptable, then this is. Can't change the rules half way through!

To be fair, I said that song irritates me more than anything because it's aimed at youngsters. Adults who are experimenting with BDSM I'd hope are more able to recognise not to use a book to model their relationship on.

Regardless. People found it acceptable to aim a song at teenagers about slapping in relationships, and thought teenagers could distinguish between a song (fantasy) and real life.

So by that rule, surely adults can?
 

Laurelin

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#38
But that was the crux of the argument. She says I want to slap you. Not I slapped you. To me I read it as someone who is frustrated and saying things along the lines of 'I'm going to kill him!' When they don't mean it. She's not actually beating her boyfriend.
 
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Dizzy

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#39
But that was the crux of the argument. She says I want to slap you. Not I slapped you. To me I read it as someone who is frustrated and saying things along the lines of 'I'm going to kill him!' When they don't mean it. Ahesnot actually beating her boyfriend.
Kind of semantics. It's a song about violence in relationship (actual or not) aimed at teenagers on mainstream radio.

But everyone thought teenagers are capable of distinguishing that "oh she didn't mean it, and oh it's JUST A SONG".

Well this is just a book, read by (presumably) people over the age of 18... Are they more stupid than teenagers?
 
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#40
I don't think people are worried so much that people are going to use it as some kind of BDSM guide, but that it's a very negatively inaccurate portrayal of a kink that already gets sort of side-eyed by a lot of people in a Judgy McJudgerson world.
 

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