Chazzers, I need your help

Charliesmommy

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#1
I know I haven't been around here in quite some time but I hope I still have some friends here, so I hope you don't mind my coming here for help. It's about Charlie. Something is wrong and I'm trying any and all avenues to find out what. This is gonna be kinda long....

About 5 or 6 weeks ago he stopped eating and when he would try to eat just a little bit he would vomit. Went to the vet and they thought he had a bowel obstruction. They did x-rays and couldn't find anything so they gave him an enema and put him on an antacid. He lost 20lbs during this time but after the enema and all that he seemed to get right back to normal and has been eating fine ever since. (I don't know if any of this part is related to the current problem or not, but it could be)

Last Wendesday we were out in the yard and he had would I would call a little freak out. He started running all crazy and yelping. It lasted about 15 seconds and then he was fine again. I thought he was just super, super excited about something or maybe he got stung by a bee, but I didn't think much of it.

Then Friday night about 7pm he had a major psycho freakout. Again, he was out in the yard and he started running all crazy and yelping. I ran outside and when I opened the door he went running in the house. He raced through the house, on top of the furniture, tables, etc, knocking over lamps, yelping the whole time and pooping all over the place. I opened my bedroom door because that is where he sleeps and we never play in there so it is sort of a calm place for him and I thought he would calm down. He didn't. He raced over the top of the bed, over the bedside table, up onto my dresser, in and out of the closet, again yelping and pooping the whole time. He also tried to bite if I came near him. This lasted a good 4-5 minutes.

When he finally calmed down he was drooling like crazy and standing with his feet kind of splayed out and he was a bit wobbly like he was going to fall down but he didn't. I called his name several times and got zero reaction. After about a minute it was like he snapped out of it and looked around and came to me and was fine. I called the E-vet right away and they were certain that he had gotten stung by a bee and said not to worry about it. I knew that was not the case, but they would not see him that night.

About 2am that same night the exact same thing happened except this time it started in the house. Again, the psycho running, yelping, pooping, snapping. This time it lasted even a bit longer. Called the E-vet again and they said the only thing they can think of that would exhibit such symptoms would be a brain tumor and to bring him in first thing in the morning.

So Saturday we went to the vet. She checked him over from head to toe and found nothing obvious. No pain anywhere, no enlargements in the abdomen, etc. We weighed him and he has lost an additional 6lbs since he was there last for the enema and all that. She took some blood. Bloodwork came back on Monday and liver, kidneys, thyroid all check out fine. His pancreatic enzymes were a bit elevated but he isn't currently exhibiting any of the other symptoms of pancreatitis, which would be vomiting, diarrhea, enlarged belly and pain.

He stayed at the vet on Monday and they monitored his blood pressure, which was high all day - around 190. She is still thinking brain tumor and wants me to take him up to Purdue for an MRI. She is also thinking possible adrenal tumor and he is having an ultrasound on Friday to look for that. Another option could be epilepsy but that does not explain the weightloss.

He has been pretty lethargic, sleeping a lot and not wanting to leave my side. He is skin and bones. He weighs 64 now and this is a dog that used to weigh 95. I am so sick and haven't slept in days and I just don't know what to do. None of the possibilities the vet has come up with really seem to fit.

The neurologist at Purdue wants us to video it if he has another episode. Last night we tried to play with him and get him excited, hoping to induce an attack so we could video it, but he wasn't really willing to run around much and got exhausted after about 10-15 minutes. This is unheard of for him. He is normally a non-stop ball of energy.

I don't want to have the MRI done. If he has a brain tumor I won't pursue brain surgery or chemo/radiation.

There's probably more details I could add but I can't think of it all right now.

Has anyone ever seen anything like this at all? If anyone has any ideas of what could be going on, I would appreciate any help anyone can give. I am just beside myself with all this and I don't know what to do.
 

Lizmo

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#2
Oh my gaw :( I'm so sorry ((((((HUGS))))))

We've had a thread going about "rage", and it sounds like the same thing maybe? I really have no idea, but it's a thought. I would definitely have an MRI done ASAP.
 

Charliesmommy

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#3
I've read some about "rage" and that doesn't seem to fit. It's not like he was trying to bite me, it's more like he was so terrified that he didn't know what to do. It was like he was hallucinating that something was trying to kill him and he couldn't get away from him. It was just pure fear. That's the best I can explain it.
 

Brattina88

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#4
First off, "Hi" :) .... WB

Does Charlie have a 'freak out attack' :)p sorry lol) is he starting to go #2? I'm just wondering if its something related to the digestion - excretion system still. When Nikki was young she had a mild obstruction (it passed with some meds) she would dart around the yard whining when she had to 'go' until it passed. I imagine she was in pain, and some dogs to lash out when they are scared and in pain... I don't know. Instead of an x-ray has the vet considered any other avenues in that area? I was just thinking that there are a lot of things a dog could get into that wouldn't necessarily show up on an x-ray. . ??

Anyway, I wish you and Charlie the best. I'm a big Charlie fan :eek: and it saddens me to hear your both going through this. ((((((((hugs))))))))))
 

goldiefur

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Yes I would get the MRI to rule out a brain tumor. When I read your post my first thought was a brain tumor or thyroid/adrenal problem but I am no authority on this at all. I will keep Charlie in my prayers and I am sure you will get some good advice from members here with more knowledge then me.
 

Charliesmommy

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#6
Does Charlie have a 'freak out attack' :)p sorry lol) is he starting to go #2?
Hey Brattina, good to see you.

No, there doesn't seem to be any correlation. The first 2 times it happend he was running around playing. The 3rd time he was just lying around the house.
 

Charliesmommy

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#7
I'm not going to get the MRI done. I know some won't agree with my decision, but I don't see a point in it. If he has a brain tumor, I won't put him through the treatment for it. I would rather try to find out what other things it could possibly be and treat for those. If I exhaust all the other possibilities and he continues to decline like this, then it is clearly a brain tumor and he will be PTS. I'm crying just typing this, but I don't believe in putting dogs through chemo, radiation, brain surgery, etc. I've seen it done and it changes them. They are not the same dog, and then most of the time they die anyway.
 

Lizmo

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But why wouldn't you want to rule out the posibility of brain tumor? I understand not wanting to put him through chemo, but if it's all along the tumor, your just making him suffer more when waiting and trying all these other things?

Just my opinion as always. :)
 

bubbatd

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#10
I'm SO sorry to read this !!! Charlie is such a lovely dog ! Yes , I agree with an MRI . That way you'd know . My IB had a brain tumor but she had seizures . Why don't you call Amy B. .... even just for support . How worried you must be ! Please keep us posted gal !
 

vanillasugar

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#11
Oh no :( I'm so sorry you've come back under such awful circumstances. I have quite a fondness for Charlie, and I wish I had more to offer than support and lots and lots of (((((((((((((((((((HUGS))))))))))))))))))))))

I understand your choice for not going through chemo etc. for a brain tumor, but please re-consider the MRI, even if it's just to rule it out! It may *not* be a brain tumor, and without the MRI, you won't know where else to look.

I'll definitely be thinking about you both.
 

Laurelin

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#12
We're dealing with all the things with Hiro and he went through an MRI yesterday. We should have some answers today... It's hard, but this way we KNOW if it's something wrong with his brain that we can't fix. It's just another step to finding out what's wrong. If you find something, you don't have to treat it, but I think just looking for everything just to make sure is worth it. I wish we would have had time to do this with Harry. The worst thing is never knowing what happened and never knowing if you could've fixed it.

Just my opinion of course.
 

Charliesmommy

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But why wouldn't you want to rule out the posibility of brain tumor? I understand not wanting to put him through chemo, but if it's all along the tumor, your just making him suffer more when waiting and trying all these other things?

Just my opinion as always. :)
He is not suffering. He is lethargic but he is not in any pain so far as the vet or I can tell. I can't spend $2000 on a test that I feel is unnecessary. If I thought it would do something good for him, I would come up with the money somehow, but it won't. If it gets to the point where he is suffering, or where he is having these episodes often and we have exhauted the other possibilities, then I will have him PTS.

At this point the vet only has 3 ideas. One is an adrenal tumor and we'll rule that out on Friday with the ultrasound. The other is epilepsy. If he has another attack, we'll put him on phenobarbital. If that does not stop the attacks, then it is a brain tumor and he will be PTS.

I came here looking for ideas on what other possibilities anyone can think of.
 

Charliesmommy

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#15
Hi Grammy, Vanilla and Laurelin. Thanks for your support.


Laurelin, I know you have been going through so much lately, what with Nikki and now Hiro. I haven't been able to really say much about it but I hope you know I've been thinking about you a lot. (((hugs, girl)))
 

Laurelin

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#17
Laurelin, I know you have been going through so much lately, what with Nikki and now Hiro. I haven't been able to really say much about it but I hope you know I've been thinking about you a lot. (((hugs, girl)))
Thanks so much. It's hard isn't it? Charlie will definitely be in my thoughts and prayers.

Have you seen anyone other than your normal vet? (It may have been mentioned but I missed it) We went to a referral vet and they had a lot more ideas on what to try for Hiro and how to connect him with the neurologists.
 

bubbatd

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#18
Glad you did ! I e-mailed her too . That meet up was so much fun ! She misses her Kobe so !!
 

Charliesmommy

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Thanks so much. It's hard isn't it? Charlie will definitely be in my thoughts and prayers.

Have you seen anyone other than your normal vet? (It may have been mentioned but I missed it) We went to a referral vet and they had a lot more ideas on what to try for Hiro and how to connect him with the neurologists.
Yes, it is hard. I haven't slept in days.

We've been talking by phone with the neurologist from Purdue but haven't been up there. It is about 3 hours away and they want to see video first.
 

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