what am i doing wrong?

[soft pawz]

i simply cant get baily to walk on a lose leash.

i use a flexi but i lock it to the lengh of a normal leash. i tried to stop everytime he started to pull or chang directions. i am not sure what i am doing wrong but after i did this for a month i gave up. he didnt get any exercise because of this.

i dont have a yard and there is no dog park around here and with that method we need 30 minutes for 100 meters and it gets me all frustrated.
i cant even call this a walk......

he didnt show a lot of progress either. when i stoped it took a couple of seconds ( or longer) then he sat down what made the leash lose and made me walk again just to stop after 3 steps.
i know he got the idea a little bit because sometimes he takes a few steps back to losen the leash but only to run in the leash full speed as soon as i start moving again..... he showed this behaviour already after one day of training but hasent progressed beyond that point.....


i just couldnt do this anymore and had to actually WALK! so the next thing i tried is pulling him back beside me if he tries to go infront of me, what worked for the first 3 days. and even though there was a lot of pulling back we got a lot of walking done, finally.

but this cant be it! i got the feeling this isnt going to teach him how to walk in MY Speed and nicely beside me.


i have no clue what i am doing wrong, what is the key to leash training? and why i am to stupid to do it? he learns tricks and commands in minutes and is otherwise really well bahaved but i just cant get his behaviour outside on a leash right..........very frustrating.

i also tried to give him treats everytime he walk nice beside me but all he does is spit them out ( even his beloved hotdogs ).........i really dont know what to do anymore.

 

[MIMUTTM0M]

I'm fairly new so I dont know what you've already tried... but... have you tried using the halti?
I have labs, they can be real pullers! I use the halti and always keep treats in my hand. They learned quickly to focus on me (cuz of the treat) instead of whatever they were in such a hurry to get to... lol

 

[soft pawz]

i always thought a halti is something for bigger dogs, do they come in tiny sizes (baily is only 9 lbs)?
i also dont really know how they work...

baily doesnt care much about treats when we are outside. birds, squirells or other dogs are more important to him so it is hard to keep his attention on me. he will take the treat the first 3 times but only to spit it out again and after that he doesnt even take it anymore.....

 

[JennSLK]

You coud go a training collar. I dont recomend a halti for a dog that lunges against the leashe. Pulls, yes but not if he lunges he could get hurt.

Or get a no pull harness.

 

[laneyandme]

my dog does the exact same thing. it drives me CRAZY. i worry so much about her throat! i have noticed one thing.. when she's tired, she does better. i know you said you don't have a yard or a dog park close by.... you could look for a fenced in field (like a school) or just take her for a ride in a car or something... or RUN with her for a little bit... and then walk with him... i'm still looking for solutions myself! ahhhhhhh!!!!!!! so i totally understand. tonight the lady leading the obedience class i'm in suggested using a prong collar.. so i'm going to look into that.
good luck!! (and if you find some luck, please send some my way!

 

[soft pawz]

it was impossible to use a normal collar with baily. he would strangle himself to the point of constant caughing so i always use a harness.....belive me it drives me nuts too and is very frustrating.

i took jenns advice and got an anti-pull-harness ( i really didnt know what else to do ). the kind that tightens under their armpits when they pull. i am just coming back from our first walk and it worked good. as good as no pulling. except for if he sees another dog, then he still freaks....

i also tell him what a good boy he is when he is walking right next to me, just to give him some positive reinforcment and not only the negative reinforcment from the anti-pull-harness.

this might really work for us.....maybe you want to give it a try to instead of the prong collar?

 

[laneyandme]

thanks for the feedback. i might just have to try that out. i hope it continues to work and you find some relief... take care

 

[tessa_s212]

Tools are only that: tools. You still need to do training.

Does your dog know an attention word? If not, now is the time to teach it. Once your dog has learned that attention word, you can add things as distractions, eventually leading up to having a dog say 20-30 feet away as the distraction. Eventually you will have a dog that will ignore those other dogs on command.

 

[soft pawz]

his attention word is his name, when i call baily he looks at me, 100% inside, 60% outside, we are still working on it to get it more reliable outside too it for sure doesnt work around other dogs yet.

can you explain more what you mean with tools are only tools and that i still need to do training too?
because i dont really get that. its a tool that teaches him "when i pull it gets uncomfortable", that called learning or training, isnt it? sure, negative reinforcement but thats why i praise him when he walks right beside me ( postive reinforcment )

is there anything else i should do as far as leash training goes? and if so what would that be?

also he is not food motivated ouside so should i maybe ONLY feed him outside in these situations? so he knows he has to listen outside or he will go to bed hungry???

 

[tessa_s212]

his attention word is his name, when i call baily he looks at me, 100% inside, 60% outside, we are still working on it to get it more reliable outside too it for sure doesnt work around other dogs yet.

can you explain more what you mean with tools are only tools and that i still need to do training too?
because i dont really get that. its a tool that teaches him "when i pull it gets uncomfortable", that called learning or training, isnt it? sure, negative reinforcement but thats why i praise him when he walks right beside me ( postive reinforcment )

is there anything else i should do as far as leash training goes? and if so what would that be?

also he is not food motivated ouside so should i maybe ONLY feed him outside in these situations? so he knows he has to listen outside or he will go to bed hungry???

Well, it depends. Would you like to use this tool for the rest of his life? If so, then no, you won't need any further training. But, if you would like to be able to wean off of this tool, yes, you will need further training. Though, I will admit that some dogs don't need weaned off, they will just learn not to pull, many dogs do not learn that. Many dogs will go straight back to their old ways once tools are removed(from my and many trainer's experiences).

I would wait for training sessions right before his supper time. Wait until he is hungry, and then perhaps he would be more food motivated outside. Also, what are you using for treats? Whatever it be, it should be something that REALLY motivates your dog. Regular ol' kibble will not do for such a wonderful distracting environment. I suggest trying some hotdogs, cheese, peices of chicken, and I even know of a few dogs who LOVE vegetables such as green beans, peas, carrots, etc.

As far as your attention word,.. Some people can succussfully use the dog's name as their attention word. Most, including myself, cannot. I am as guilty as the rest with "abusing" my dogs' names. Many times I will call out their names, they will come running, and then I take them inside the house for that night. Surely that isn't veyr good reinforcement. That is why *I* choose to have an attention word that I do not normally use in eveyr day life. My word is usually "watch me", though some people use "look" or even "ready"(when in the obedience ring, the judge asks you if you are ready, you say "ready" and you've just replied to the judge AND gotten your dog's attention..brilliant isn't it? ) But, if you feel his name as an attention word is working well enough, then by all means, continue using it.

 

[Dobiegurl]

his attention word is his name, when i call baily he looks at me, 100% inside, 60% outside, we are still working on it to get it more reliable outside too it for sure doesnt work around other dogs yet.

can you explain more what you mean with tools are only tools and that i still need to do training too?
because i dont really get that. its a tool that teaches him "when i pull it gets uncomfortable", that called learning or training, isnt it? sure, negative reinforcement but thats why i praise him when he walks right beside me ( postive reinforcment )
QUOTE]

No its called CONTROLLING. You are never suppose to TEACH your dog with an alternative collar but after you dog already knows the command given THEN you use corrections to modify it, not teach it.

 

[laneyandme]

for soft pawz!

Hey, i'm going on a small climbing trip tomorrow and i couldn't bare to think of laney pulling and pulling. .. her poor little throat! so i thought of what you wrote and went out and bought one.. one that tightens at the sholders when she pulls ahead.. i can't remember the name.. anyway. WOW! we... or at least I had a great time with her. she was great! we even ran into a little tiny puppy who wanted to play. laney (poor girl) pulled a bit then, but not much AND her throat didn't get harmed AT ALL! yeah!
just wanted to share! take care!

 

[soft pawz]

so how do i wean him off? i would love to have a dog one day who walks good with a normal collar.
i tried all kinds of treat, from normal dog treats to hotdogs and creamcheese. outside he doesnt care. he gets fed around 7pm so every training session is prior to dinner, he still doesnt care. ( and no he doesnt have a toy that motivates him enaugh either). thats why i asked if i should only feed him during training and no dinner anymore?

laneyandme i am happy it worked for you and you had a great time! isnt it a relieve to have a brake from pulling???

 

[laneyandme]

i know for me that when we walk every time laney b. pulls i say 'easy' and then i praise her (sometimes give her a treat) when she stops pulling (because of the harness). i also often take her to where she was pulling to when she stops pulling. i think part of it is she needs to know that when she walks WITH me, she'll still get to where she wants to go, most of the time.. didn't you just start using the harness...
take care... and yes, it is wonderful!

 

[Doberluv]

thats why i asked if i should only feed him during training and no dinner anymore?

Sure....let him be good and hungry. Whatever it takes, just find out what his favorite thing is, what motivates him, what he loves best. You have to have that going for you.

You don't need any special training collars. He's a Maltese isn't he? I don't use any special stuff on my almost 100lb Doberman who use to take off like a fighter jet off an aircraft carrier (got that from Marley and Me....love that! LOL) So, you must have adequate bisepts to hold back your toy breed dog. He's just excited to go for a walk. Dogs love walks more than just about anything in the world. If the dog hasn't had any exercise, free rip roaring around somewhere, he's bound to be pent up, chompin' at the bit and rarin' to go. So, try to let him get the zoomies out somewhere first, just a little.

Dogs do what works. Up to now, he has been reinforced by getting to go forward no matter how he pulls, sniffs, whatever he wants to do. So, barring any other motivation (treats, toys)....take a look at what he seems to want the very most! To go for a walk and that means going forward. You'll have to remove that reinforcer because you're rewarding his pulling. It's been working for a long time....that pulling and getting what he wants, so it won't change over night. He'll keep trying for a couple of weeks since it's always worked before. So, the very first step he takes which is causing tension in the leash, you need to stop. You can simply stop sometimes and stop and turn back the other way other times and retrace the same boring path with the same boring smells he already smelled 10 times. You can also zig zag, turn back, stop, sti, stop, sit frequently. Keep him guessing. When he manages to take one step and then two steps without tension in the leash, let him know right then and there, exactly while he's taking those nice steps, that that is what you mean and what you want. "YESSSSS!!! Goooood" and see if he wants a treat too. You'll need lots of those successes so every couple of steps, reward, praise. He has to figure out what you mean and reinforcement is the only way to add to his "bank" of understanding. Forget about the goal of walking to some specific destination on your walk. You might only get one lousy block. But training is crucial if you're to have nice walks later on.

Practice in low, low distractions at first. Do teach the "watch me" command at home, inside at first. Then try it later with the walking. It's training, it takes concentration and your dog is young, so keep the sessions fairly short. If you're wanting to take a decent walk, break it up so if he loses concentration after a bit of practice of nice walking, stop and do something else, play a little, give him some free time somewhere and you can also mix in some other skills.

It won't happen over night that he walks nicely on a loose leash, but being consistant and never walking one single step when he makes tension in the leash will teach him that that is not going to get him what he dearly loves, to go forward. Associating the loose, slack leash with going forward, happy voice, treats, toys, whatever.....and lots and lots of "wins" successess, reinforcers....will add up finally to change his behavior. But you have to be consistant and make the training fun and don't forget to reward the nice walking every few steps at first and when he's getting pretty good, you can space the reward out a little more. The trouble most people have is that they expect the dog to walk nicely for 20 feet before they reward them, and when they don't, the owner yanks on the leash and punishes the dog. The dog doesn't have a clue. But if you catch the dog doing behavior you like right away, and show him that that is what you want, "Yesssss!!! Goooooooood!" treat etc....every couple steps at first, he'll get it.

If you want to use a command for when the dog is to walk nicely, like "easy" or "let's go" don't use it while the dog is pulling. He'll associate that cue with pulling and think that when you say that, he is to pull. Be sure to use the word when the dog is walking nicely. I wouldn't bother with a cue word right away. Get the behavior first. Learning English and learning a new behavior is a lot to jam into a dog's brain. So, since he doesn't understand English anyhow, wait a while till you start attaching that word with the behavior.

 

[soft pawz]

thanks doberluv,
yeah he is a 9lbs maltese, i am happy hes not a 100lbs doberman or he could probably drag me around
he is so well behaved inside but i never really did propper training outside with him.
he is young and has so much engergy and i can feel his excitement when going for walks, sniffing everywhere, meeting other dogs, hunting birds or squirrels. i can understand that those things are more important for him then listening to me. hopefully with your tips that will change soon!!!

i tried the stopping when he pulls for a couple of weeks and got so frustrated with the constant stop and go. i didnt combine that with any treats though. at times when he didnt pull i just used praise so maybe that simply wasnt enaugh...