Faith: The Wonder Dog

[Manchesters]

scenerio..old woman has a heart attack..falls on her porch..hitting her head on the railing..makes it inside but doesn't get the door shut..her dogs run out the door afraid..oh my..foresight? You have a fire..you run out..the dogs make it outside with you..the firemen leave the gate open....or gee..foresight ..your generalizations just turn me completely..no one knows it all..not about marraige, or babies, or being a vet..about training..or what people do with their lives when they are not on a 5 sec clip..it is one thing to base an opinion on an experience that you have been thru..it is another to cover something with a blanket statement..vets have come a long way even in the last 10 years..and i for one am grateful that someone would go to the lengths my vets of have done to help me with my animals..i am grateful for what they have taught me..i would stuff a sock in it before i went in and pretended to know a doc's business..if you obviously can tell he can't read an x ray..then you go to another vet until you find one that can.that is your responsiblity as a pet owner. No one can seer into the future and prevent something like the last two scenerios i presented..i could give you a hundred more just as likely to happen. Debate i will..i wasn't inferring to theperson in talking down..tongue in cheek i was referring to the behavior.
you carefully avoided the questions i noticed..
you know it all..what are "diagnoses" two have nothing to do with cancer..or diabetes..or heartworms

I hate to say it, but the last part of your post makes no sense to me....about the diagnoses???????

As far as falling and hitting my head, and the dogs running out......not a chance. The boys are in their crates in the dog room, or out in the ard anyway. The girls are in the front part of the trailer, and have open access at all times to the patio and carport which are fenced. This place is triple fence to prevent anyone from getting out. It is called FORESIGHT. As a matter of fact I went thru exactly that while in the coma during hurricane Ivan.

I have a fire, I take the dogs across lot 2 to Sharon and Orval's on lot 1, which is all fenced in, and since I own the property, there ain't much they can say about it......not that they would. They are dog lovers also. I have had 30 years of vet learning. Likely a little more than you. And I can tell you that if you depend on doctor's for your life, you are foolish. But after you live a few more years, and have a chance to learn more of the screw ups of doctors you will understand what I am talking about.

When I was having my heart attacks, I was the one that finally went to the doctor and told him I wanted him to do an EKG. HE nearly had a heart attack when he saw the results. I was the one who told him that I was dealing with CHF due to the contriction I was feeling in my neck. He agreed with me. I was the one that told the doctor that due to the symptoms I was sure I had developed diabetes. Sure enough. I was the one when I went blind told the doctor I suspected cataracts......no big deal---kinda obvious, rofl.

Sooooooo, you can go on flapping your fingers, but I am too tired to appreciate the chance to show you up for the knucklehead you are. Sorry if you are in a bad mood. Ain't my problem. After fighting witht this computer, and having Microsoft lead me down the prim rose path, I am not in the greatest frame of mind. And for you to snidely insinuate that I let my dogs die a horrid death is just pure ignorant, and without excuse. You assume too much. I have stated in other posts that the only reason my dogs go to the vet is for surgery or health certificates. Guess you missed those posts.

However, by keeping conditions safe for the dogs, and being blessed with healthy dogs, I have not been to a vet since I took Kelly in to have her put to sleep back in June. She was 12 years old and had lived a wonderful life right up to the very end. She clearly let me know when she was ready to leave, and so I took her in.

So, by all means, continue to judge everyone else by your own lack of knowledge and experience. It is a common enough mistake. But you just kinda picked the wrong one to dance around with this time!!! Rofl. Boy did ya ever, heheheheh.

 

[smkie]

if you claim to have knowledge..you should be able to back it up with fact.

 

[EliNHunter]

Omigawd... it's worse than I thought. You have your dogs in crates, too. So, if you have an "accident" or heart attack, or whatever, they will just be stuck. Do you have anyone that checks in on you and your animals daily?

 

[bubbatd]

I was thinking the same thing !!! What if you went into a diabetic coma with food on the stove !!?? Why did your manchester die at such a young age ???

 

[Manchesters]

Facts?????

if you claim to have knowledge..you should be able to back it up with fact.

I have given you the facts. If they leave you confused.....then there ain't nutting I can do. Unless perhaps you want to enumerate some specific items??? I diagnosed Blaize's diabetes and treated it for a year. Don't take rocket science......just a BG meter, which being diabetic myself I had, along with the insulin, needles etc. Hard part was finding a spot to test for blood on her. The edge of the lip did very well, and she didn't feel a thing.

As far as cancer???? Again no mystery. I have one dog that has a fatty tumor on her neck. Sadly, none of the others are exhibiting any lumps, or signs of lung/heart problems. No coughing or hacking after exertion, no abdominal swelling......not even an ingrown hair or toenail!!!!

The FACTS are.....MY DOGS ENJOY EXCELLENT HEALTH. I am sorry if that goes against your experiences in life, lol. But by keeping them up on their shots, and worm free, plus living in a safe, secluded environment, they enjoy a good safe, healthy life.

Kelly enjoyed her 12 years, right up to the very last breath she drew. And so, I hope will I. But not by indulging myself in anymore frivolity of this nature. So, I must beg off. Unless you have a specific question, then I would certainly be delighted to share my KNOWLEDGE and experience with you.

Although, about the only thing I had much experience with was one slight case of juvinile panrcreatitiis 30 years ago. Oh yeah.......and one incidence of CVI, about 25 years ago.

 

[smkie]

the heart attack is what happened to Shaffer's owner..a woman in her 90's..just stepped out on the porch to check the mail..shaffer was lucky to be found by logan..we will never know about MEdear
the dog with the swollen belly..a twisted intestine
the dog in the street..sitting up straight but not moving..broken back
my house went up in less then 20 minutes..i had time to run out calling 911 as i went and get the dogs in the car and that is because they ran out the door with me..mary was so afraid that she ran period and if it wasn' for the neighbors i wouldn't have had time to find her before she was in a danger zone
if they had been in crates? i didn't even have time to shove the parakeets out or look for the cats. fortunately the firemen shoved the birds out and the door open had allowed the cats to escape as well. I didn't find them until the next morning...
I can site where a little knowledge is more dangerous then none at all..especially especially when it comes to medication. Old boss and i went around and around on that topic..he knew old ways of worming..will refer to as the baseball bat and the fly
went by the old belief the more the more effective..we had a very heated arguement about a sulpha drug..he thought he was right..he gave too much the little pup's kidneys couldn't handle it and the dog died..it wasn't my kennel there was nothing i could do. i could debate as long as you can..without using words like stupid..or knucklehead..that is a resort to insult and a technique in arguing used to draw attention away from the facts..it doesn't work and everyone can see thru it. it's immature. You put forth these "facts" in your own words
you know more then most vets..
after basic routine care..a dog needs no more of modern science..and if it does..you can provide it
You can see into the future.
all i said i seriously doubt you can prove it....I don't believe you.. and that is "in my opinion"

 

[bubbatd]

Goodnight, Oh mighty one... hope you and your caged dogs have a good night... I'll be snuggled up with Chip. He's glad I had his heart checked again last week .

 

[bubbatd]

Just saw your post Smkie.... Kisses and sweet dreams!! Grammy .

 

[Manchesters]

Oh doG, Have Mercy!!!!!!!!

I was thinking the same thing !!! What if you went into a diabetic coma with food on the stove !!?? Why did your manchester die at such a young age ???

My stove has been "ungassed" for over 10 years, lol. And I doubt that anything would catch on fire in the microwave--not anything that I would be cooking, anyway. I do have a griddle type thing, deep sides, etc. And I do use it from time to time.

What Manchester died at a young age? 12 is an average age for a Manchester to pass on. She had cancer that had gone into the lungs. When the breathing stops, so does life.....one way or the other. And it was only 6 years ago that the dogs in the pedigree of my dogs did start dying off of cancer. The line is rift with it. That was not happy news to me.

Most of my dogs so far have lived to 16 years of age. I think that is pretty darn good. My oldest now is Mandy. She is 15 3/4.

My dogs do very well. I am sure they would appreciate everyone's concern, but it is not really needed. I do not go to a vet because I do not want to expose my dogs to parvo, or the killer influenza that is running around Florida these days. Once I stopped showing 7 years ago, I also quit going to the vets. I never even took puppies to the vet's unless it was one I was selling and it needed a health certificate.

Like I said, I had an extensive vet course earlier on in my doggie life. And I had some vets kill my dogs without needing to. I can do as well for my dogs as any vet can, unless it involves stitches.

As far as supplies, as Smkie asked, good grief.....has she never been to a drug store? Or looked at a dog catalog? All you need to keep a dog healthy is Betadine, peroxide, antibiotic ointment, gauze and tape!!!!!

Anyway........I do what I will with my dogs, and will continue what has stood them and me in good stead for 30 years now. I intend no sneering at anyone. Just pull a few chains once in a while, and sit here shaking my head when folks respond exactly as I know they will.

My dogs have the best of everything, including being lucky enough to have ME as their owner!!!!!

 

[Manchesters]

Oh My......So Sorry

the heart attack is what happened to Shaffer's owner..a woman in her 90's..just stepped out on the porch to check the mail..shaffer was lucky to be found by logan..we will never know about MEdear
the dog with the swollen belly..a twisted intestine
the dog in the street..sitting up straight but not moving..broken back
my house went up in less then 20 minutes..i had time to run out calling 911 as i went and get the dogs in the car and that is because they ran out the door with me..mary was so afraid that she ran period and if it wasn' for the neighbors i wouldn't have had time to find her before she was in a danger zone
if they had been in crates? i didn't even have time to shove the parakeets out or look for the cats. fortunately the firemen shoved the birds out and the door open had allowed the cats to escape as well. I didn't find them until the next morning...
I can site where a little knowledge is more dangerous then none at all..especially especially when it comes to medication. Old boss and i went around and around on that topic..he knew old ways of worming..will refer to as the baseball bat and the fly
went by the old belief the more the more effective..we had a very heated arguement about a sulpha drug..he thought he was right..he gave too much the little pup's kidneys couldn't handle it and the dog died..it wasn't my kennel there was nothing i could do. i could debate as long as you can..without using words like stupid..or knucklehead..that is a resort to insult and a technique in arguing used to draw attention away from the facts..it doesn't work and everyone can see thru it. it's immature. You put forth these "facts" in your own words
you know more then most vets..
after basic routine care..a dog needs no more of modern science..and if it does..you can provide it
You can see into the future.
all i said i seriously doubt you can prove it....I don't believe you.. and that is "in my opinion"

About your fire experience. How horrible. Unimaginable. I did neglect to mention one form of insurance that I employ........I trust in the Lord to keep me and the dogs safe. It has worked for many, many years, thru many horrid events.......like Ivan, for one. And Rocky Mountain Spotted fever.

I also should perhaps mention that I over the years I have had a huge network of people to provide knowledge based on their own experiences.

I do not use words such as knucklehead as an insult. In fact you should be flattered that I used it to address you. If I were trying to be insulting I would have just come out and tell you that you were being idiotic.

I have used Ivomec for the dogs for 20 years now. It kills microfilaria, hooks, whips and rounds. Does not affect adult heartworm, so you can use it on a dog without having to worry about their heartworm status. You CANNOT, however use it on Collies, or anything faintly related to Collies.......Shelties, Beardies, Borders, etc.

With the dogs on Ivomec, and being shot regularly, there is nothing else to be concerned with, for the most part. Oh, and my dad had cancer.....Hodgkins, and I got a crash course in it. Also with my stepmother, bless her heart. I mean dogs die from heart failure, cancer for the most part, just like people do. No mystery.

And as I said, I am blessed by being able to have this place fenced, double fenced, and cross fenced. And I am up most day and night. Sleep for an hour at a time maybe. Also, I have several fire extinguishers. Anyone who lives in a trailer has fire extinguishers.

Oh, and buddabt mentioned her dear doggie sleeping with her.......poor thing! Mine all sleep ON me, rofl. They have their own heated water bed........ME.

Some of us are just luckier in life it seems. I prefer to think that in spite of me being a bit of a devil, the Lord looks after me for the sake of the dogs, lol. I am their caretaker after all.

In 30 years I have never had a dog hit by a car. Or any of the other dreadful things that can happen. And I thank the Lord for that too.

Everyone have a great night, and be safe, and well. The Lord bless and keep us all.

 

[Manchesters]

Again, we bow down and kiss your feet and thank the dear Lord you have no say in our dog's health. !! You are not giving young owners much help when you say you know more than vets !! I'm glad for your dogs you can check their breathing and hearts, check their blood for heartworm , have a relibable source for needed drugs, etc. etc. As to going in for stitches, why ??? If their fencing is so great, then they must bite each other. Heck, I'd put on some freeze zone, add some antibiotic and stitch it up myself if I were you. Then your only vet bill would be putting them to sleep.....which I'm sure you could do too. Alot of people do it daily . Sorry, but you've gone too far with your mega " I know more than anyone " attitude. Also, since I'm 10 years your senior , respect me for some of my knowledge and experiences.

Of course I can check my dogs breathing and their hearts. That is what I spent $125 for a stethoscope for. Just like in the nursing training. And if you have understood what I wrote, you would have picked up on the fact that by using Ivomec there is no need to test blood for heartworm. And yeah, I have a source for needed drugs.....if I need any. Which I don't. Other than shots and Ivomec there is nothing else I need. Just the usual first aid items any household should have.

I am sorry you are so resentful of anyone who happens to be fully aware of just how much they DO know, and don't feel like kissing butt to be P.C. I have what some people call self esteem, and it seems that there are many people who do resent those of us who have self assurance. That is not MY problem! Tell me oh wise and experienced one......are you knowledgeable on what a PDA is? How it is diagnosed? What is the breathing rate for a dog? What is a normal pulse rate for a dog? Etc. You ask respect for YOUR knowledge, yet ridicule me for mine????? You may be 10 years older than I......big deal. My sister is 8 years older and had dogs for years. But she still seeks my advice before rushing off to the vet! And I ain't been wrong yet.....sorry about that!

I have had too many dogs killed by vets stupidity. One of them due to coccidia for doG's sake!!!!!!!!! You can have your vets.....I prefer to have my dogs alive, happy and healthy. You are welcome to your knowledge.......but if you have to take a dog to a vet to check its heart, then somebody's knowledge is not quite up to snuff!!!!! Or don't you own a stethoscope?

Anyway, I am bored with this issue. What I do or do not do with my dogs is my concern. If others wish to frequent a vet.....and they do not feel capable to oversee the health of their dogs......then by all means they should do so.

My dogs are bugging me.......they want their water bed back into the chair so they can go to sleep, lol.

 

[EliNHunter]

Of course I can check my dogs breathing and their hearts. That is what I spent $125 for a stethoscope for. Just like in the nursing training. And if you have understood what I wrote, you would have picked up on the fact that by using Ivomec there is no need to test blood for heartworm. And yeah, I have a source for needed drugs.....if I need any. Which I don't. Other than shots and Ivomec there is nothing else I need. Just the usual first aid items any household should have.

I am sorry you are so resentful of anyone who happens to be fully aware of just how much they DO know, and don't feel like kissing butt to be P.C. I have what some people call self esteem, and it seems that there are many people who do resent those of us who have self assurance. That is not MY problem! Tell me oh wise and experienced one......are you knowledgeable on what a PDA is? How it is diagnosed? What is the breathing rate for a dog? What is a normal pulse rate for a dog? Etc. You ask respect for YOUR knowledge, yet ridicule me for mine????? You may be 10 years older than I......big deal. My sister is 8 years older and had dogs for years. But she still seeks my advice before rushing off to the vet! And I ain't been wrong yet.....sorry about that!

I have had too many dogs killed by vets stupidity. One of them due to coccidia for doG's sake!!!!!!!!! You can have your vets.....I prefer to have my dogs alive, happy and healthy. You are welcome to your knowledge.......but if you have to take a dog to a vet to check its heart, then somebody's knowledge is not quite up to snuff!!!!! Or don't you own a stethoscope?

Anyway, I am bored with this issue. What I do or do not do with my dogs is my concern. If others wish to frequent a vet.....and they do not feel capable to oversee the health of their dogs......then by all means they should do so.

My dogs are bugging me.......they want their water bed back into the chair so they can go to sleep, lol.

This is the most ridiculous post I've heard from you yet, MC. I'm so glad you own a $125 stethoscope and that if someone else doesn't and actually takes their dog to a horrid vet, they are irresponsible. Also, do you realize those blood glucose monitors and strips you use on your dogs have NO BEARING on what their true bG results are?? And how the heck would you treat their high blood sugars if you think they have them? With YOUR insulin?? How would you know the dosage and if they should even be on insulin instead of orals if even needed besides from diet. I warn everyone that reads MC's posts that she is "out there"...

 

[nedim]

Rivetting conversation guys.lol From two legged dogs to stethesscopes to microwaves and heart attacks.lol

 

[Manchesters]

Your Density Is Showing

This is the most ridiculous post I've heard from you yet, MC. I'm so glad you own a $125 stethoscope and that if someone else doesn't and actually takes their dog to a horrid vet, they are irresponsible. Also, do you realize those blood glucose monitors and strips you use on your dogs have NO BEARING on what their true bG results are?? And how the heck would you treat their high blood sugars if you think they have them? With YOUR insulin?? How would you know the dosage and if they should even be on insulin instead of orals if even needed besides from diet. I warn everyone that reads MC's posts that she is "out there"...

You ever heard of that wonderful device invented by Bell???? Ya know....the one you call people on? Like...duh.....the telephone????

Everything you typed above is garbage. At least according to my vet whom I called to find out how to deal with Blaize's diabetes. Also......I take it you cannot afford an issue of Merk's Vet Manual??? So sad. And so foolish.

End of discussion.

 

[Old Dog]

How do you think vets make the bulk of their money and gladly take it from uneducated petmentality people that run to their vets for every little toe ache.Pet people who expect their pets to be treated like their kids. They love it. I worked for 3 different vets they don't make money off breeders or show people. Vets would go broke if they depended on breeders and educated pet owners that know a little about what to do as in preventative medicine for their pets but actually they like us because they respect our opions and when we do have to take our pet in we usually have a good idea what the problem is. I work with my vet and I know whenever I need him he will be there for me.

 

[EliNHunter]

You ever heard of that wonderful device invented by Bell???? Ya know....the one you call people on? Like...duh.....the telephone????.

And that has to do with.... ????????????

At least according to my vet whom I called to find out how to deal with Blaize's diabetes..

What the h*ll is Blaize's diabetes????

Also......I take it you cannot afford an issue of Merk's Vet Manual??? So sad. And so foolish..

LMAO - ROFLMAO - LOL

 

[yuckaduck]

When I problems with Yukon's ear I called Manchesters---ear was healed in three days, no hugh vet bill. Thank you Manchesters.

I will be starting Oct1 using Ivomec instead of paying $75 a year per dog; I will have 2 soon; to have a vet give me the same thing only in a beef chew.

If I have a vet question I go directly to OldDog and to Manchesters first. If they do not satisfy me then I search for a vet that I can trust---good luck on that one here too. It is all about how much money they can suck you for. I have never had to go to a vet after speaking with OldDog or Manchesters. Only saw a vet on Yukon's shoulder injury because it required x rays and someone else was paying for it.


I also know that Manchesters dogs are very well cared for and they live the life of luxioury. I wish I was one of her dogs!!!

 

[Manchesters]

The Price Of Eggs

And that has to do with.... ????????????
What the h*ll is Blaize's diabetes????LMAO - ROFLMAO - LOL

First off, I do want to semi-apologize for getting a bit testy in the previous posts. After two days of being dependent on Microsoft to try to solve a registry key problem, and then having a kind young lady from Trend Micro send me the solution in like 10 minutes, I was not in the best frame of mind. Plus having to pay Microsoft $35 for the privilege of being on the phone with them for a total of about 11 hours. Supposedly they are going to refund that money.

So having someone such as yourself and Smkie coming up with totally ridiculous stuff just to bug me just kinda finished the joy of the last two days. Otherwise I would not have even bothered responding to such stuff.

Anyway........since you did not in the least bit comprehend what I wrote.......I will explain for you. You had commented on my treatment of canine diabetics. Did I know the dog needed insulin instead of pills.....difference in insulin......difference in BG readings between dogs and people, etc, etc, etc.

What I was telling you was that I CALLED the vet, told him that I had tested BLAIZE's bg, told him what it was and got his suggestions on how to handle it. And of course there are several newsgroups for owners of diabetic dogs. Well....actually that answers both of your queries.....about what the h'll is Blaize's diabetes, lol.

If you folks feel you are doing so much more for your dogs by dragging them to a vet's office.....then by all means do so. You have not had near the exposure to dog health issue that even a casual breeder has had. And I mean an educated breeder, who has worked closely with a vet over a few decades, by the way.

For instance......we will use one of my litters as an exemplar.......mother has a booster shot about 4 months prior to breeding. Mother has been on Ivomec all her life, so no concern about worms and such. Mother is fed gormet meals throughout pregnancy. Pups are whelped, mother and pups are cleaned up and dried, and put into whelping box. Puppies are closely examined several times a day, and played "beep beep" several times a day. After 4 days, puppies start playing "beep beep" back!

Mother if fed gormet throughout lactation. Puppies grow and develop as puppies are want to do. At 5 weeks of age pups are given Ivomec, just in case a worm snuck from mother to kids. At 8 weeks they get first shot, then every 3 weeks until age of 4 months.

At no time do they go near a vet's office. If I have a pup I am selling out putting out on co-ownership, it gets a health certificate from the vet. Vet looks at eyes, flips u a lip, peers into ears, and listens to heart. I show him the shot record. Then gives me the certificate.

That is the way breeders do it. Of course having not bred for 7 years now I do miss the pitter patter of baby feets.

Oh, and you keep yammering that I think I know it all------well, just where do you think I LEARNED it all? From the vets, from research, from hands on experience, and from the experiences of hundreds of other breeders. I may not know it all, but I can wager that I know more than any pet owner on this forum. The only one I would trust to know as much or more would be Mary McQueen----because she is a BREEDER in the true sense of the word, and I am sure has had the same experiences over the years that I have had. And then of course there is Old Dog, from whom I picked up a good part of what I do know. It is nice having a vet tech for a friend, rofl.

So.......I hope that people will stop the character assination attempts just because some of you think I am "too big for my britches". Just take my word.....I do not say something unless I have the FACTS to back it up and/or the experience to PROVE those facts and experiences. The thing is......I ONLY NEED TO PROVE THOSE FACTS TO MYSELF, TO MY OWN SATISFACTION! If the others here wish to picture my poor little dogs dragging themselves around breathing their last breaths....that is THEIR problem.

Oh, and the reason Yucky knows what shape my dogs are in is because SHE HAS SEEN THEM! She even got to see Birdie Girl flash a quick "FROG LEGS".

You all have a fantastic day. I am about to start learning how to partition my hard drive. I am sure it will be a fun experience......hardehardehardehar.

 

[yuckaduck]

Oh, and the reason Yucky knows what shape my dogs are in is because SHE HAS SEEN THEM! She even got to see Birdie Girl flash a quick "FROG LEGS".

Yes and they are all so cute but I think Twit was my favorite. Robin is a close second. They sure looked awefully happy to me, poor abused dogs, jumping up on the chair with their mommy and sleeping on mommy.

 

[bubbatd]

To each his own ... I thought on one post you advised getting getting all the tests for hips,heart ,eyes etc ?? You do this too ??? Also, I thought you said your puppy's had health checks 3 times from vets before they left you at 12 weeks ?? Also, I thought you slept in a chair at night, because of your bad back. Also, since my dog weighs 90 #s, only his head lays on me at night, or a paw draped over me. And sorry , I leave his heart issue up to his wonderful vets. They rate the changes, and will tell me when it's time for a implant....which is something I wouldn't be able to do....I'm not a heart surgeon . My goldens lived to be 12 and over...your manchesters should be living until 16 or over. Glad you help so many on this forum...I listen to you , but trust my vets for their once a year check ups. The rest I treat myself.