Nancy Grace has gone too far

Jeez-Someone woke up on the wrong side of the bed.

I just dont think that someone who has a pit mix should be talking about how vicious they are. I know I would never run around saying how vicious Dalmatians are (I do have a pit bull foster as well) or how vicious german shepherds are (own a GSD mix too). It would be like me having a kid with blue eyes and going around talking about how evil they are and how they will attack without warning, exc. Common sense tells you if your dog is a pit mix and you have no problems with him/her, you have no right to go around talking about how bad pit bulls are.

Plain and simple.

I thought you had pit bulls too Casa but I guess not??

BTW-My pit foster gives me kisses too, and yeah the media is partly to blame. Like the other day I saw on ET, that Rachel Ray was going to spend her holiday with her "family" which consisted of a husband and her "dog". Dog was a pit bull. Didnt say pit bull. Had it been a story about a "pit bull type dog" biting someone yes it would have been a pit bull. I will post links later about mistaken ID as well. Media does love stories that sell and they have found that bad pit bull stories sell, good ones dont, hence all the bad pit bull stories. Kind of like I asked one of the local TV stations to do a story on a cat surrendered to our kill shelter who had a very sad background. I was told NO, I guarentee if I were to email the same person back and say that our local shelter (where the cat was) was doing something wrong, they would be on it like flies on honey. It's how the media works. Sensationalism & horrible stories of sadness sell. Just how it is. By no means do I think it is *just* pit bulls that they sensationalize, I think it is every story that the news airs. Bad news/awful sad stories/stories about how "evil" something/someone is sells. Sad but that seems to be what people like.

And I WORK in a vet clinic & despite the very large pit bull population here in East Baton Rouge Parish, we rarely see pit bulls & other dogs in due to a fight between them. The worst case I ever saw was when 2 Yorkies literally mauled the 3rd one to death. We had a case of a Collie that literally gutted a Chihuahua (the entrails were outside of the dog). The most common breeds of dog we see involved in dog attacks here are Labrador Retrievers and Jack Russell Terriers.

And I will tell you what someone has already said: You are entitled to your opinion. I will listen to your opinion & take it for what it is. But in NO way is your opinion more valuable or factual than mine all because you deem it so.

Casablanca, it's nice that you can retaliate so childishly, but you didn't make any progress with your post. If you're going to spit out things about facts, then why not hold up, and give some out? If you're not capable of doing so, then step down and don't bring the subject up.

If it bleeds...it leads. Isn't that the saying in the TV news business?

I wasn't laughing at the incident. I was laughing at the ignorance.

You and all the other pro-pit zealots ganged up on this guy who disagreed, and gave him a hard time about his own dog, basically telling him to shut up since you claim to think his dog could be part pit bull, and thus his anti-pit bull opinion would be (gasp) hypocritical. Apart from the sheer illogic of that, it was a cheap way to try to win an argument. How would you feel if you were on a mainly anti-pit forum and people told you your opinion was meaningless because you owned one of those evil dogs, so you were obviously evil too?

And I think it's a bit silly to go on and on at the guy telling him you think, based on photos of his dog online, that his dog is a pit bull mix. You've never seen the dog move, or seen how the dog behaves, and basically, you have no idea if the dog is a pit bull mix or a lab mix. I agree that it's possible, but
it's impossible to prove. It's a point to bring up, maybe, but posting 30 links to pit mixes you think resemble his dog is nuts.

The kisses thing just exasperates me because it's meaningless. My sister's Yorkie gives kisses too, and then tries to rip your face off. It's not the affection a dog gives that's important in the examination of how safe or good a dog is, it's the violence it doesn't give, that it's unwilling to give, that it will stop giving as soon as it feels safe.

The best advice I can give to pit bull people is, if you're serious about helping these breeds, stop crying about the media. The media isn't creating these stories. It focuses on bad stories, but that's its job. It reports news - not feel-good fuzzies about good shelters and sweet puppies. An old line about the media is ""The job of the newspaper is to comfort the afflicted and afflict the comfortable." The afflicted, by the way, are not people who want to own a particular breed of dog in a particular zip code.

This just shows me how childish the Pro Pit people are, that they have to use totally foolish statements to try and discredit someone and make some sort of point ( whatever that point is , is beyond me). I know several vets and a couple of dog breeders and not one has ever said that Smokey looks anything like a Pit Bull. Maybe I should try scaring people that I don't want to be around, by telling that she is part PB , and they might be dumb enough to believe me and go away. :lol-sign:

I have seen this type of "logic" from the pro people, if you want to call it that, happen over and over when people relate problems with some Pit Bulls. When you ask them why more and more communities are banning this breed, they start blaming the press, the police, bad karma, the victims, etc.. anything to place the blame on someone or something else. I wasn't even going to jump into this thread again, because I see the same Mantra over and over and over again, regarding this issue from the Pro Pit people, and frankly it is like talking to a stone wall as far as I am concerned.

What got me back in to this "discussion" , was this obviously very angry and very traumatized young lady that posted that she watched her dog being killed by a Pit Bull and she "hated them". Now can anyone imagine what that is like to see your dog ripped to shreds by a dog that is known to be D/A? And then some PB defender trys to belittle her and call her immature. ( If you think she is immature, if a Pit Bull ever attacked and killed Smokey, dogs of that breed better steer clear of me from that moment on or they are going to have a really, really bad day )

When people get this breed of dog, they already know, if they have half a brain, that the dog has a reputation for being D/A. They shouldn't whine and complain when people are reluctant to let their animals or their kids come in contact with these dogs. There is a teenager that frequents the new Dog Park next to my house and if you ask him, he will tell you what a nice and friendly dog his Pit is. His nice and friendly dog has already bitten 2 dogs at the park and what was getting to be a crowded park when it first opened has very few visitors when he and his dog are known to visit there. So someone assuring you that their dog is the sweetest thing in the world means nothing, if the dog decides it doesn't like you or your dog. Calling animal control is useless because when they show up 4 hours later, the dog is long gone....

You can think what you want, but your dog does look to be a pit x german shepherd mix. If it helps you sleep better at night believe what you want. Yeah i think it is stupid for someone with a pit bull mix to say pit bulls are evil, I think that is extremly unwise. I am not taking the easy way out of the argument I am trying to get you people to realize that pit bulls are dogs just like yours. BUt I am out now, you all can not be reasoned with and will believe what you want to believe. Hopefully the news wont have a story about how the sky is falling because I cant imagine what kind of panic that will put you in since you believe everything the media tells you.

What makes me the maddest about all you pit bull haters is you dont even know any pit bulls. You believe what you see on TV. Not a good idea weither it is about pit bulls, war, and in general all the bad news stories.

Even if I wasnt "pro pit bull" i would still say yours looks like a pit. Has nothing to do with being pro pit or anti pit to me it has to do with people with common sense vs people without common sense.

PIT BULLS ARE DOGS LIKE YOURS & MINE. GET OVER IT. Or wait until YOUR breed is banned next

(BTW-GSDs are already banned and they are labeled as aggressive as well) I would pull up the links but you dont care and I doubt it will ever click in your mind that the problem isnt the breed until your dear Smokey is being drug away by ACOs to be euthanized because they have euthanized all pit bulls and german shepherds are the new "vicious evil monsters".

Enjoy living in your close minded bubble until it's your breed. (Although GSDs are in fact labeled vicious & banned in a lot of countries/towns-google it)

It scares me that people who claim to love their dogs so much have such a hatred toward one breed. For the very last time, and my last post on this thread, pit bulls are a breed of dog. They are not monsters and feel free to come by my house and meet my pit foster then tell me how aggressive and evil they are. You dont want to meet a pit bull because you know you are wrong. Meet a pit bull then we can talk.

When will people realize that there are also many other breeds known for their dog aggression? :|
Since that seems to be everyone's problem with Pits (EVENTHOUGH those same people constantly bring up how they attack people, which is actually pretty rare, by an ACTUAL APBT) I guess they didn't know that there's a good few handfulls of other breeds that regularly make in good numbers of attacking other dogs.

But I suppose it's their fault and they should all be put to sleep and banned too right?

Why don't you all just stop now?

Bob has his opinions and you yours... nobody is getting anywhere now.

To be honest, it's just plain annoying.

Put forth your energies where they can make a difference.. go visit your shelter and play with a couple dogs. They need a lot more attention then you are giving a member who MIGHT have a pit mix dog.

Gah.

Speaking of generalizing... I don't know about Bobsk, but I do know pit bulls. I've met them, I've patted them and walked them and admired them.
I never had a problem with them until I saw one nearly rip another dog open while three people struggled to stop it. That made me stop and think much more about the issue. They're - and I do mean all the fighting breed, not just the APBT - not the same as other dogs. The breeds that were developed to fight and kill other dogs or large animals such as bulls were bred to combine strength and obsessiveness so that they could as a single dog accomplish something that normally only a pack of dogs could do - kill an animal that's of equal or larger size, and fighting back.

That's vicious, you realize? You disagree with people strongly, so you disparage their own love for their pet? I don't know about other people, but the reason I have the opinions I do about pit bulls is my love for my pet, and my love for her breed type. I feel sometimes as if my next dog will be a fighting or guard breed because I spend much of our walks with my eyes on stalks, trying to spot dangerous dogs before they spot us. I've been doing this for years, of course, but the breeds that were common in the 1980s and 1990s were GSDs and Labs. And say what you will about those dogs, you could bury a foot in their ribs and they'd let go of your dog (I have first-hand experience, sadly). The fighting breeds don't. They bear down and grind down and suffocate or sever your dog's jugular or windpipe right in front of you. I came close to having first-hand experience of that, too. Meet a pit bull breed that's trying to murder your shaggy, friendly collie mix whose only desire is to get away from this monster on her throat, and then we can talk.

So all of these breeds deserve to be banned? Do you know how many breeds have been noted for their dog/animal aggression? You are pushing the limit with that. You are not singling out a small group of dog breeds, like you probably think you are. That type of aggression can stem into at least 4 different groups, naturally. Then you have individual aggression.

And where you said "so that they could as a single dog accomplish something that normally only a pack of dogs could do"...I've seen very very few paintings and pictures from these bloodsports where just one dog was set on a bear or bull. And if it were one dog, it was a large dog.

Here's a few pictures:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/b/b8/Bearbaiting.jpg
http://academic.scranton.edu/STUDENT/DIANAR2/bullbait.jpg
http://www.umich.edu/~ece/student_projects/trial/images/escapebull.gif
http://www.elizabethan-era.org.uk/images/bull-bear-baiting.gif
http://www.dogbreedinfo.com/images8/DorsetOldTymeBulldogge31.jpg
This picture has one dog on a bear, however, the bear is tied to a wall, and being held onto by another person:
http://www.homesteadbullhunde.com/pages/images/bear-baiting-1795.gif

It must be no secret why some baiting breeds get along with other dogs then?

Don't overlook the other aggressive breed groups: Nordic breeds, sight and scent hounds, terriers and many breeds in the working dog group. While they are not all dog aggressive, most breeds in these groups have small animal aggression, and many will not hesitate to rip up a cat if given the chance, or at least chase it and attempt to do what it feels like doing.

So that means spitz breeds are untrustworthy, hounds are untrustworthy, working breeds and terriers are untrustworthy. According to your lumping strategy.
And don't forget the nippy toy breeds, notorious for biting children and adults alike. Couldn't let them get away with that.

What it all comes down to is the pit bull owner is responsible for the dog bans. Others are not to blame when another persons dog gets loose and kills other animals. The owners are responsible. Many are too busy trying to tell people how to breed their pit bull, complaining about the color and size of another persons pit bull, telling everyone how bad they are and how bad their dog is, trying to tell others they should not have a pit bull, and telling others their pit bull is of low quality.
The media is not to blame for reporting the news. The person with the dead dog or dead animals are not to blame. The person who was attacked is not to blame. The blame is entirely the responsibility of the pit bull owners.
Maybe one day saving the breed will be more important than all the complaining and blaming others.
Dog aggression, people aggression, and animal aggression is not the real problems. The problem is the owners. If they take responsibility for their dogs and take reasonable care of their dogs there is not a problem. If they would choose a dog small enough or one with out the strength and bite to damage other people and animals there would not be a problem.
When they choose a dog with the power, bite, and size to do damage they are now the problem.
Pit bulls are not the problem, people are the problem. The only way to control some people is to take away what is causing the problems.

Again one of my rescue friends had a pom that was killed by a couple yorkies and a toy poodle. Were those dogs put to sleep or deemed dangerous? NO!

Had a dogge de bordoux (sp?) pick a pit puppy up by it's head and caused severe brain damage to the pup. Was the bordoux deemed dangerous? NO!

My Dalmatians severly hate my foster pit bull. Know what he does when they attacked him? He stands there and takes it. He doesnt fight back at all. What a vicious, aggressive animal. Jet got out of the fence once as well. Know where I found him? In the neighbor's yard playing with his 2 pit bulls who are chained 24/7. What happened when he saw me? DId he attack? Nope-he came running to me with a happy grin on his face. Yup, all 3 are super aggressive. What evil monsters.

It's annoying too because I hear the same thing about Dalmatians (which might I ad are also banned places)

Yes it is the owners fault, but why should everyone be punished for the idiotcy of one person? Doesnt sound fair to me.

Had a trained K9 Belgium Manlinois attack it's handler (went for the throat) was that dog euthanized? NO! Deemed dangerous? NO! Well what happened to it then-it was sold to another police agency.

I will never dispute that ANY dog of ANY breed who is aggressive toward people should be euthanized. If a dog aggressive dog of ANY breed gets out and attacks another dog/cat/whatever yes it should be euthanized.

Hm...Wonder if this dog was euthanized & deemed dangerous? Oh wait the answer is in the article of course it wasnt!

"http://cbs2chicago.com/topstories/lo...113124809.html


'Toy' Dog Attacks 80-Pound Pit Bull
(STNG) WAUKEGAN The owner of a 10-pound "toy" dog was cited over the weekend when her dog attacked an 80-pound pit bull.

Garry Laffredi was walking his 2-year-old pit bull Capone near his apartment complex Thursday when a neighbor's Pomeranian came running at them and attacked the dog.

"(Capone's) not a bad guy. He's real friendly. He's people friendly," Laffredi said. "He loves other dogs. (But) this little Pomeranian ran out and starts biting him on the foot."

Pomeranians, which are classified as Toy dogs by the American Kennel Club, can be as small as three pounds and resemble a fox in appearance, generally having a bushy orange coat and pointed ears.

Laffredi said the Pomeranian bit Capone's foot hard enough "to draw blood" also managed to nick Capone on the top of the head as he tried to pull the pit bull away on a leash.

Eventually, Laffredi said, Capone "grabbed the dog and more or less set him off to the side" before the two dogs were separated.

It was not the first time Laffredi had a run-in with the 10-pound dog.

He was bit in the hand two weeks ago by the Pomeranian but chose not to report it, he said.

Waukegan animal warden Tina Fragassi said she was not surprised when her office fielded the report about Thursday's attack.

"They stand their ground, those little dogs," she said.

The Pomeranian's owner, who declined to comment, was cited with failure to prevent a dog bite, owning a dog running at large, not possessing a dog license, and not having updated rabies shots.

Each citation comes with a $25 fine, Fragassi said"

Oh and I have met dog aggressive Collies/collie mixes.

Ask our shelter manager (BTW thanks I do go to my shelter every single week and do rescue orientated stuff almost every day-hence my name) which breed is the most dog aggressive/human aggressive in our city. I guarentee you he wont say pit bulls.

Just had a catahoula X euthanized for killing a cat. Have another COLLIE mix in there who will be euthanized for killing a cat.

Don't let it bother you.

That's just her style and philosophy in life.

In other words,

whether they are humans or dogs, everyone is presumed guilty of the crime/ accusation until the ratings prove otherwise.

She represents mob mentality at its worst.

And you know the worst part, her audience eats it up so quickly.

To the rest of us, she just looks like a complete moron, but her fans obviously idolize her.

No dog breed is for everyone, not even labs & golden retrievers.

I would suggest to any of my friends if they want a dog to go to the shelter and take their children along. I would definantly warn them against Dalmatians or German shepherds since Dalmatians are stubborn and German shepherds are herders. I would warn them against any herding breed (collies included) if they had small children. I wouldnt hesitate for a second to recommend a pit or pit mix as long as the person is dedicated to training, socializing and caring for the dog. And if they have done their research. If they arent dedicated, they dont need ANY dog, not even a lab.

I cant tell you how many people have told me horror stories about their or their friend/family's aggressive Dalmatians. And honestly I would trust Jet (pit bull foster) with children before I would trust either of my Dalmatians (competly MY fault though, I never had them around children). I can guarentee you that Jet wouldnt ever bite a child, but I couldnt guarentee that for my Dals, they are very uncomfortable around children, especially my female, and she very well might nip if the child made her nervous. If the child cornered her, I couldnt say she would never bite. (not aggressively but out of fear)

Jet just loves everyone. His only problem would be accidently knocking a child down.





Also Re: Nancy Grace. I have heard that some lady who was on her show committed suicide because Nancy Grace was so nasty to her. (Said the woman killed her own child who was missing) That is horrible and I hope that Ms. Grace cant sleep at night knowing the horrible thing she did. I also heard the family of the lady who killed herself is suing Nancy Grace. She seems like a pretty awful, hateful, mean woman to me. (Has nothing to do with the pit bull thing) And I sure hope that someone takes her off the air for good! You cant go around treating people like she treats them forever. She acts like everyone is stupid and she is so smart. What comes around goes around.

Just got back from the dog park this afternoon. One of my neighbors was there and she tells me that the pit bull that I spoke about in a recent previous post that belongs to another neighbor, that has already bitten 2 dogs at the dog park , started a fight with another dog last evening. This happened while the mother of the teenager that owns the dog was walking it around the condo complex. She reached down to pull her dog back, and the dog turned around and bit her in the hand :yikes: .....

I have been telling this rather stupid 16 year old for months that he needed to train this dog while it was young , and he hasn't done squat, and now the dog has turned into the PIA that I predicted it would. I hear that the mom was really upset about this turn of events, so I have a feeling that this dog won't be around much longer.......

It sounds to me like you have some really strange issues going on. Next thing you will be telling me is that Smokey looks like Osama Bin Laden and you can actually see horns starting to sprout out of her ears,,,,,,......:lol-sign: :lol-sign:

Yeah you are right. Improper training. Had it been a GSD it would act in the same way. People have to train their dogs reguardless of breed. I can spew out hundreds of stories of labs, dobermans, german shepherds, pomeranians, exc biting as well.

Heck, I was feeding a fellow rescuer's dogs for her while she was gone and her DOXIE attacked me. Thankfully she had baby gates up and I jumped over one real quick or I would have had some nasty bites. Up for adoption.

Same lady also has a cocker spaniel who tried to bite her and has already bitten a child. Up for adoption.

Another dog who has been returned to the shelter twice, a GERMAN SHEPHERD MIX was returned both times for biting a child. Second time, child had a very nasty bite on it's FACE. Did the dog get euthanized? NO. Deemed dangerous? NO. What happened to it? It is now in a foster home waiting for it's new family (who it will most likely bite). They blamed the owners (owner's children) for the dog biting even though she had done it twice. Said the owners were mean and abused the dog. Yeah..I am sure they got angry at the dog when it bit their kid, I would too. At least the foster home was warned.

Another dog at the shelter, a Rottweiller mix, is extremly, extremly, extremly dog aggressive. Very protective over it's "person". Was it euthanized? NO! It was adopted out, lets wait and see how that turns out. Hopefully no one will get seriously hurt by said dog. Hopefully they were warned.

We took 8 dogs to an adoption event. Unknowingly to us, 6 of them were dog aggressive. Only 2 dogs were dog friendly. A pit mix and a lab mix. 3 dog aggressive dogs were shepherd mixes, one was a flat coat retriever mix, 2 were lab mixes (one a senior lab mix). Go figure, huh? Evil pit bull mix was the best behaved out of the bunch.

Believe what you want about Smokey. Not my buisness.