Stomach tacking

[PWCorgi]

I've never seen one done in person, only videos, so I'm not sure on the exact details. There are some good ones on YouTube, if you're not squeamish.

I am highly squeamish. I almost passed out from just SMELLING blood after Frodo's dental. I also got dizzy and had to sit down after just looking at Daisy's sprained leg. So no, there will be no video watching

Thanks for the deets though! So really, are there any significant risks? Other than lineage and bloat, are there any good arguments AGAINST this?

 

[Shai]

Thanks for the deets though! So really, are there any significant risks? Other than lineage and bloat, are there any good arguments AGAINST this?

Well one would be putting the dog under for the procedure. Which is why people tend to pair it with an s/n or some other procedure rather than as a stand-alone unless the dog is particularly and overwhelmingly prone to bloat.

 

[release the hounds]

Would you consider this preemptively to bloat?

I was at a new vet today with Sloan and the vet mentioned that a lot of military malinois have been opt'd to tack the stomach for torsion prevention with their high level of activity. He said it's relatively painless, they have trouble keeping the dog down after it, because now it's done with a scope and not an incision.

Is this something you would consider doing?

no, i absolutely wouldn't put a dog thru a surgery, just in case. I hate putting them under for anything that isn't life threatening. a guy just lost his dog because they put him under to take an xray, dog never woke up.

I'll take my chances on bloat.

 

[SaraB]

It was sooo cool watching the laproscopic procedure. They fed the camera down into his stomach, turned off the lights in the surgery suite and turned on a light at the end of the camera. You were able to see the light shining through his stomach. They used that to mark the spot where the incision would appear. From there they fed a really big suture hook through the abdomen wall into the stomach and proceeded to tack the stomach in place. Very cool, very quick, no problems.

Our friend had the same procedure done by the same vet on his 11 month old dane (the same age Titan was). His dane had a lot more growing to do though and ended up dropping his chest after the procedure. This moved his stomach out of it's original location. When he bloated, he actually did end up with a torsion because his small intestine was able to loop over his stomach. This is why it's better to wait until the dog is mostly mature and their chest has already dropped.

ETA: There are a lot more risks with the traditional procedure all tied in with recovery. Many dogs end up vomiting quite a bit for a while afterwards.

 

[SpringerLover]

I actually got to be surgery tech for a few cases of bloat where we did a pexy. And I think there were 1-2 with a spay while I worked there.

Definitely not common, and a co-worker ended up losing her springer to bloat which is kind of terrifying.

 

[sassafras]

Thanks for the deets though! So really, are there any significant risks? Other than lineage and bloat, are there any good arguments AGAINST this?

Anesthesia risks aside, I suppose in theory some adhesions could form at the site of tacking, but I'm sort of pulling that out of my rear and I'm not sure in that location that it would really have any ill effects anyway. I suppose the tack could fail or tear, but the worst that would happen then is that it wouldn't work.

The one thing the surgeons told me was to be sure anyone who ever does any abdominal x-rays of him for any reason in the future knows he's had the procedure so they don't misinterpret the position of the stomach if it doesn't look typical.

 

[yoko]

Thanks for the deets though! So really, are there any significant risks? Other than lineage and bloat, are there any good arguments AGAINST this?

I don't know how much of an argument it is but like I said earlier it makes me really nervous because I think people would have it done and then forget about bloat totally.

It keeps the stomach from twisting but they can still bloat up. It can still make it hard to breath so it may not be easier to move a bloated dog and the blood flow to the stomach is severely reduced when it bloats even without volvulus.

I think that a lot of people, not necessarily here but people in general, would think that the operation made their dog 'bloat proof'. It's already something that can/does kill dogs pretty quickly and even without the twisting it is something that needs to have vet attention immediately.

I may be overreacting about it but I just don't want to see 'bloat proof dogs' being advertised and people thinking just because the stomach has been tacked they don't have to worry about it.

 

[Red Chrome]

In a breeding dog or prospect. I feel it is wrong. There are some studies that suggest bloat is genetic in some cases. So in a breeding animal it is pertinent to know that they are prone to it. IMO. There is a GSD breeder who has a well known stud known for throwing bloat and his stomach isbtacked.

 

[Southpaw]

In a breed heavily prone to bloat, I might consider doing it during a speuter.

When Juno had her weird stomach obstruction, if she had needed surgery the vet recommended that we have the stomach tacking done at that time as well. Which I thought was weird because it never came up when she got spayed. But I wouldn't have had it done because I don't really consider boxers "high risk" when it comes to GDV.

 

[Saeleofu]

But I wouldn't have had it done because I don't really consider boxers "high risk" when it comes to GDV.

Boxers do bloat fairly commonly though - large and deep-chested. If I were to have to have Gavroche opened up for anything, I'd get it done. I'd probably do so with Logan too, since collies are also large and deep chested (Logan does have a deeper chest relative to the width than Gavorche does, but I've seen some very deep and narrow boxers, too).

How old was Juno when she was spayed? If she was still a young, growing pup then tacking wouldn't be as effective as it would be after she's done growing. If she was very young when she was spayed, that may be why it was brought up later but not then.

 

[Dizzy]

What are the stats on getting bloat - just how common is it?

 

[SaraB]

In a breeding dog or prospect. I feel it is wrong. There are some studies that suggest bloat is genetic in some cases. So in a breeding animal it is pertinent to know that they are prone to it. IMO. There is a GSD breeder who has a well known stud known for throwing bloat and his stomach isbtacked.

Tacking does not prevent bloat, it prevents torsion which occurs as a result from bloating. There for you would still know if a dog was prone to bloat or not.

 

[SaraB]

What are the stats on getting bloat - just how common is it?

Depends on the breed and the lines within the breed. I heard some random statistic somewhere saying that 50% of great danes bloat at least once. Once they bloat they are more likely to bloat in the future. Not sure if that is a real stat or not but I believe it. Danes bloat a lot.

 

[SevenSins]

In a breeding dog or prospect. I feel it is wrong. There are some studies that suggest bloat is genetic in some cases. So in a breeding animal it is pertinent to know that they are prone to it. IMO. There is a GSD breeder who has a well known stud known for throwing bloat and his stomach isbtacked.

But as previously mentioned, gastropexy doesn't prevent bloat. If the dog is going to bloat, it's going to bloat and you're going to know it. All it does it prevent the torsion that would otherwise kill the dog within a few minutes and buy you time to have it treated.

That said, the next large molosser I get will be done regardless of whether I intend to breed or not.

 

[Laurelin]

Can someone explain bloat to me? I've never had to worry about it. What breeds are really prone to it?

 

[CharlieDog]

I would have it done if I was going to put either of my two deep chested highly althletic idiots under for any reason. Fortunately the vet is doing their two year old hip xrays without putting them out, provided they behave

I'd be more likely to do it with Knox than Indy, she's not as deep chested as Knox is, but I think there's still the risk there, because she's more of a nutter than he is

 

[yoko]

Can someone explain bloat to me? I've never had to worry about it. What breeds are really prone to it?

Pretty much any breed that has a really deep chest and a small waist like great danes or grey hounds. Any dog can bloat but ones that are 'built' like that are the ones you have to worry about. Yoshi is a great example but she's so furry it's hard to see her real shape. Her waist is so small I have to be careful she isn't laying on her back against a recliner because her waist fits under the unreclined chair so you have to check before sitting down.

When they bloat their stomachs fill with gas. That alone restricts blood flow to the stomach and other organs and can make it hard to breath. When the stomach twists it restricts blood flow more. If you don't catch it twist or not stuff starts dying because it's not getting enough blood the dog can go into shock and die.

 

[Danefied]

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?....89712014669.83163.86628419669&type=1&theater

someone please let me know if this doesn’t come up, I’ll put on photobucket and re-post. Its a good visual

 

[Southpaw]

Boxers do bloat fairly commonly though - large and deep-chested. If I were to have to have Gavroche opened up for anything, I'd get it done. I'd probably do so with Logan too, since collies are also large and deep chested (Logan does have a deeper chest relative to the width than Gavorche does, but I've seen some very deep and narrow boxers, too).

How old was Juno when she was spayed? If she was still a young, growing pup then tacking wouldn't be as effective as it would be after she's done growing. If she was very young when she was spayed, that may be why it was brought up later but not then.

She was 6 mos. I know they have the build for bloating but compared to other breeds the incidence really isn't that high in them. If she's going to bloat regardless....well, she's hardly ever alone so it likeky wouldn't go missed.

 

[sassafras]

Laurelin, this is a pretty good explanation of what physically happens with a couple of nice diagrams, although I don't agree that all of the risk factors they list are as cut and dried KNOWN to be risk factors as they make it sound. And FWIW around here I've seen it in standard poodles more than any other breed, hands down.


http://www.VeterinaryPartner.com/Content.plx?P=A&S=0&C=0&A=672