starting a Kennel !
- Thread starter gilles
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Mina is a completely different person, not a sock puppet.
Anyway, I hope gilles takes the advice given. Part of the reason I wrote out such lengthy replies is because:
1. Some countries have very different standards of dog care and what is considered cruel or neglectful. If he's living in a place with legal dog fighting, it sounds like one of those places. If he sees himself as having saved his dog from a life of dogs fighting and is for reals, then he has the potential to change how he sees dogs in general and possibly influence other people in his community for their benefit. That will never happen if people jump on him and yell troll.
2. There are a lot of lurkers on chaz. So, even if gilles ignores all the advice offered, if just one lurker goes away knowing more about the subject then it is a worthwhile thread.
Anyway, I hope gilles takes the advice given. Part of the reason I wrote out such lengthy replies is because:
1. Some countries have very different standards of dog care and what is considered cruel or neglectful. If he's living in a place with legal dog fighting, it sounds like one of those places. If he sees himself as having saved his dog from a life of dogs fighting and is for reals, then he has the potential to change how he sees dogs in general and possibly influence other people in his community for their benefit. That will never happen if people jump on him and yell troll.
2. There are a lot of lurkers on chaz. So, even if gilles ignores all the advice offered, if just one lurker goes away knowing more about the subject then it is a worthwhile thread.
I don't believe he is a troll. I believe he is who he says he is - an individual living in Lebanon with this belief that his CAO is big and tough and awesome and surely could make him a tidy little hobby business. This is a shining example of a culture clash, and it's important to take a step back and realize this before rushing in with torches.
I've been to enough places with this kind of belief when it comes to dogs to believe that he is entirely real and firm in his beliefs. It's a better service to give him a reasonable counter-argument, like Romy and others, than to discount him as a troll.
All of that said, I also agree that gilles starting a kennel is a very bad idea, for the reasons already posted. They have elaborated it better than I.
I've been to enough places with this kind of belief when it comes to dogs to believe that he is entirely real and firm in his beliefs. It's a better service to give him a reasonable counter-argument, like Romy and others, than to discount him as a troll.
All of that said, I also agree that gilles starting a kennel is a very bad idea, for the reasons already posted. They have elaborated it better than I.
Ding ding ding for Allie and Romy.
And really, Mina's been a member for 3 years, why woudl this pop up now? uh no.
I'm always surprised how few people on PC dog forums seem to a) recognize that someone is not from N. America and b) understand that in most of the world a dog is not that special. It's just a dog. In a lot of places they live on the street and breed randomly, like pigeons or something. I've never been to Lebanon (I didn't even know gilles was from there) so these are just general comments.
I'd guess that most of the world simply does not see a problem with breeding 1 kind of dog or breeding 5 kinds of dog nor with breeding a litter and selling them to people who want to buy them. Kind of like how most Americans wouldn't care if I kept 5 different breeds of chicken and let them raise chicks with the purpose of selling them. "Well then you aren't focusing all your resources on breeding Blue Laced Red Wyandottes!!" Yeah and? "Well you haven't proven them to be top quality with an objective evaluation by a certified judge at a poultry show!!" Yeah and? I take good care of them, their lineage is supposed to be good, they look nice in my opinion with my knowledge, I don't lie about them and people seem to be happy with the chicks, so...?
That's how a lot of people see raising dogs. Now they may like their dogs a whole lot more than most people like their chickens but the heavy moral component on many dog-related topics that people emphasize so heavily here is lacking in many places. The idea that is OK to make money with animal x but immoral to make money with animal y is not a universal sentiment.
He could be a troll. I mean, he could just think that Americans are irrational about dogs and get a bit of a kick out of the drama... but whether he anticipates and enjoys the response or not, I think his opinions and ideas are probably pretty honest.
So, exactly like Allie said... if your way is right, brush up on your rhetoric skills and have at it... assuming the moral high ground causes pointless drama and can be pretty rude.
And really, Mina's been a member for 3 years, why woudl this pop up now? uh no.
I'm always surprised how few people on PC dog forums seem to a) recognize that someone is not from N. America and b) understand that in most of the world a dog is not that special. It's just a dog. In a lot of places they live on the street and breed randomly, like pigeons or something. I've never been to Lebanon (I didn't even know gilles was from there) so these are just general comments.
I'd guess that most of the world simply does not see a problem with breeding 1 kind of dog or breeding 5 kinds of dog nor with breeding a litter and selling them to people who want to buy them. Kind of like how most Americans wouldn't care if I kept 5 different breeds of chicken and let them raise chicks with the purpose of selling them. "Well then you aren't focusing all your resources on breeding Blue Laced Red Wyandottes!!" Yeah and? "Well you haven't proven them to be top quality with an objective evaluation by a certified judge at a poultry show!!" Yeah and? I take good care of them, their lineage is supposed to be good, they look nice in my opinion with my knowledge, I don't lie about them and people seem to be happy with the chicks, so...?
That's how a lot of people see raising dogs. Now they may like their dogs a whole lot more than most people like their chickens but the heavy moral component on many dog-related topics that people emphasize so heavily here is lacking in many places. The idea that is OK to make money with animal x but immoral to make money with animal y is not a universal sentiment.
He could be a troll. I mean, he could just think that Americans are irrational about dogs and get a bit of a kick out of the drama... but whether he anticipates and enjoys the response or not, I think his opinions and ideas are probably pretty honest.
So, exactly like Allie said... if your way is right, brush up on your rhetoric skills and have at it... assuming the moral high ground causes pointless drama and can be pretty rude.
first i am not a troll since now i know what it is
i just joined this forum for the love of dogs only and also to learn .
i am a university professor who is working actively in his country against dog fighting and dog cruelty and already financially supported organizations against dog cruelty extensively more than most of the members who are just talking to talk....for example go on Beta lebanon website and i can give you my name and ask about my contributions..(and thats only part of it)..so before you claim you are responsible dog lovers and criticize me , you have to learn who i am....i work for my goals, work and sacrifice show love and sympathy not just words and claims... i dont just sit on my butt and criticize,
As for the Kennel since you are so against: where did you all get your dogs from?????????? descended from heaven???? you just went to a petshop or a Kennel right? who told you that your kennel is better than mine????????????????????????????? are all your dogs from a champion bloodline?????????????
you think i am not qualified to have a kennel???? i am a scientist for god's sake with patents and scientific articles and years of achievements i think i am smart enough and have the assets to have my own kennel well more qualified that the kennels where you got your dogs from..... i just can't believe your attitude , i thought i will be offered positive advice and comments,... besides very few here i think many of you are either jealous or human beings with a lack of culture who just can't seem to accept any other different culture.
that said i will be glad to leave this forum,,, and i challenge anybody in this forum to prove that anything i claimed is wrong...so go troll yourselves
i just joined this forum for the love of dogs only and also to learn .
i am a university professor who is working actively in his country against dog fighting and dog cruelty and already financially supported organizations against dog cruelty extensively more than most of the members who are just talking to talk....for example go on Beta lebanon website and i can give you my name and ask about my contributions..(and thats only part of it)..so before you claim you are responsible dog lovers and criticize me , you have to learn who i am....i work for my goals, work and sacrifice show love and sympathy not just words and claims... i dont just sit on my butt and criticize,
As for the Kennel since you are so against: where did you all get your dogs from?????????? descended from heaven???? you just went to a petshop or a Kennel right? who told you that your kennel is better than mine????????????????????????????? are all your dogs from a champion bloodline?????????????
you think i am not qualified to have a kennel???? i am a scientist for god's sake with patents and scientific articles and years of achievements i think i am smart enough and have the assets to have my own kennel well more qualified that the kennels where you got your dogs from..... i just can't believe your attitude , i thought i will be offered positive advice and comments,... besides very few here i think many of you are either jealous or human beings with a lack of culture who just can't seem to accept any other different culture.
that said i will be glad to leave this forum,,, and i challenge anybody in this forum to prove that anything i claimed is wrong...so go troll yourselves
I stayed quiet for nearly all of this. Simply because of the cultural differences that I am not well versed in. However this is where I feel I need to step in.
Now, I appreciate that you're seeking to do things right Gilles, but there are many things that do indeed need to be covered before the thought of breeding or starting the kennel goes through your mind.
And if you're equating a good breeder to a pet store puppy, and using the terms "champion bloodlines." You've got much to learn about breeding responsibly and reputably.
No, my dogs were not purchased from a pet store. Why? Because pet stores are often supplied by puppy mills and poor breeders. People that over breed and do not show, prove, temperament test, or test the genetics of their dogs. As a scientist I'm certain you can appreciate at the very least the need for temperament and genetic testing.
And yes, there are reputable kennel breeders out there. Not all breeders use kennels as their way of keeping the dogs - many people only own a handful of dogs and keep them in their home. But in breeds such as hounds where the dogs are actively used for sport, it's not uncommon to have a kennel of proven hunting/working/etc. dogs. But again, these dogs are bred for a purpose aside from making money or providing "family pets"
The term "champion bloodlines" is also something that is really only used by less-than great breeders. Theoretically my mongrel dogs could all have champion bloodlines somewhere back there. What matters is that the direct sire and dam of the litter are champions.
Now, I appreciate that you're seeking to do things right Gilles, but there are many things that do indeed need to be covered before the thought of breeding or starting the kennel goes through your mind.
And if you're equating a good breeder to a pet store puppy, and using the terms "champion bloodlines." You've got much to learn about breeding responsibly and reputably.
No, my dogs were not purchased from a pet store. Why? Because pet stores are often supplied by puppy mills and poor breeders. People that over breed and do not show, prove, temperament test, or test the genetics of their dogs. As a scientist I'm certain you can appreciate at the very least the need for temperament and genetic testing.
And yes, there are reputable kennel breeders out there. Not all breeders use kennels as their way of keeping the dogs - many people only own a handful of dogs and keep them in their home. But in breeds such as hounds where the dogs are actively used for sport, it's not uncommon to have a kennel of proven hunting/working/etc. dogs. But again, these dogs are bred for a purpose aside from making money or providing "family pets"
The term "champion bloodlines" is also something that is really only used by less-than great breeders. Theoretically my mongrel dogs could all have champion bloodlines somewhere back there. What matters is that the direct sire and dam of the litter are champions.
first i am not familiar with the technical words used in the breeding medium so i could have been misunderstood.
also i totally agree with you that a dog could be a perfect pet even as a mongrel, mongrels are usually healthy and smart and often cuter than pure breeds. in fact CAO s are not a man made breed they are the aboriginal dogs of central asia originated from kazakhistan ..basically mongrels if you want that evolved after thousands of years of natural breeding.
Also our facility will be located in my property on a2500 ft altitude hill surrounded by pine woods and overlooking the Mediterranean sea a heavenly location that i will be showing on our website. right now we are still working on formalities and technicalities. the facility call it a kennel or whatever will be located near my summer house 5 minutes away and 15 minutes away from a vet hospital run by a friend who is a vet/surgeon graduated from Paris France and with more than 20 years of experience. Our dogs will have a private yard each and a common yard and the kennels specs and condition will exceed any standard US Kennel. we are a team: my partner who trains and has the contacts and will be at all times with the dogs, a professional trainer, a Vet , an ex breeder from south africa who will only assist, and a worker, i will be the manager of the operation. there will be a set schedule for each dog, time to train, time to play etc.. and lots lots of care and love...they are our children.
i am not a fool and before i do something i usually do my homework perfectly..after all i am a professor. i welcome any positive advice and idea , that is why i am posting here. As for negative criticism i believe it is driven by ignorance
also i totally agree with you that a dog could be a perfect pet even as a mongrel, mongrels are usually healthy and smart and often cuter than pure breeds. in fact CAO s are not a man made breed they are the aboriginal dogs of central asia originated from kazakhistan ..basically mongrels if you want that evolved after thousands of years of natural breeding.
Also our facility will be located in my property on a2500 ft altitude hill surrounded by pine woods and overlooking the Mediterranean sea a heavenly location that i will be showing on our website. right now we are still working on formalities and technicalities. the facility call it a kennel or whatever will be located near my summer house 5 minutes away and 15 minutes away from a vet hospital run by a friend who is a vet/surgeon graduated from Paris France and with more than 20 years of experience. Our dogs will have a private yard each and a common yard and the kennels specs and condition will exceed any standard US Kennel. we are a team: my partner who trains and has the contacts and will be at all times with the dogs, a professional trainer, a Vet , an ex breeder from south africa who will only assist, and a worker, i will be the manager of the operation. there will be a set schedule for each dog, time to train, time to play etc.. and lots lots of care and love...they are our children.
i am not a fool and before i do something i usually do my homework perfectly..after all i am a professor. i welcome any positive advice and idea , that is why i am posting here. As for negative criticism i believe it is driven by ignorance
I read this last night and kind of thought out a response with time.
I don't know you. I don't know your history. However, I did read through the entire thread and the fact that you are "inexperienced" really stuck out to me. I completely understand that you have friends who have experience with the breed. That's great! How long have they been involved? Who did they learn from? Have they been mentored by someone reputable to know what to look for in lines, temperament, and structure? If so, that's great! I hope you are then able to learn from him/her! If not, I truly think you should take a step back and really evaluate your breeding plans. How do you know what your breed is supposed to be like if you've only spent time around certain lines or a small amount of dogs?
Also, what is your breeding plan? What do you hope for your dogs to achieve other than getting away from dog fighting? I don't know much about the types of dogs you are planning to work with, but I do know they are guardian breeds. Do you want them to be used for that purpose? How do you plan to screen potential buyers for your pups? What types of socialization will you do with puppies to prepare them for a successful adulthood?
Do you plan on titling/showing them? Proving them in some way to show they are breed worthy outside of just thinking their heritage and looks are something to be proud of (which they may very well be! but how will you know unless you've experienced much of what the breed is thought to be working towards?) I think my BYB bred Boxer is gorgeous... but I highly doubt she could get a Ch and her drive is less than stellar.
Inexperience in dogs does not suit a breeding program IMO, even if you do plan on doing a co-op kennel. I would highly recommend owning a few of the breeds you are getting involved with for a good 10 years or so and immersing yourself into the breed and the circuits surrounding them. That will be the only way to know whether or not you've got a dog who is worthy of being bred. Also, level of education and family rearing will not make you an expert on dogs. I'm sorry if you feel that people were talking down to you. Everyone here has a passion for dogs and unfortunately bad breeding is something that happens way too often and we want to try to prevent that from happening further. The only way to learn about dogs is to read, and then go out and get EXPERIENCE. Take training classes (preferably positive reinforcement), learn about dog behavior, work with a reputable breeder and let them mentor you on what proper breeding practices should look like.
^^all came from a person who may be interested in breeding herself one day. I'm so extremely new to my breed that I don't know even 10% of what I should in order to do this right. I've begun to immerse myself in the breed, I'm trying to learn about proper structures and what drive/temperament best suits what people need today, but also stay true to the working dog of my breed. I would want to breed dogs who could at least get a Ch title as well as do performance and then go out and work a cow. There are issues in my breed (both health and temperament) that need work and I'm not prepared at this point to face them. It will be a lot of work and time, but it's doable. I hope that you are able to see that and work towards being a reputable breeder.
I don't know you. I don't know your history. However, I did read through the entire thread and the fact that you are "inexperienced" really stuck out to me. I completely understand that you have friends who have experience with the breed. That's great! How long have they been involved? Who did they learn from? Have they been mentored by someone reputable to know what to look for in lines, temperament, and structure? If so, that's great! I hope you are then able to learn from him/her! If not, I truly think you should take a step back and really evaluate your breeding plans. How do you know what your breed is supposed to be like if you've only spent time around certain lines or a small amount of dogs?
Also, what is your breeding plan? What do you hope for your dogs to achieve other than getting away from dog fighting? I don't know much about the types of dogs you are planning to work with, but I do know they are guardian breeds. Do you want them to be used for that purpose? How do you plan to screen potential buyers for your pups? What types of socialization will you do with puppies to prepare them for a successful adulthood?
Do you plan on titling/showing them? Proving them in some way to show they are breed worthy outside of just thinking their heritage and looks are something to be proud of (which they may very well be! but how will you know unless you've experienced much of what the breed is thought to be working towards?) I think my BYB bred Boxer is gorgeous... but I highly doubt she could get a Ch and her drive is less than stellar.
Inexperience in dogs does not suit a breeding program IMO, even if you do plan on doing a co-op kennel. I would highly recommend owning a few of the breeds you are getting involved with for a good 10 years or so and immersing yourself into the breed and the circuits surrounding them. That will be the only way to know whether or not you've got a dog who is worthy of being bred. Also, level of education and family rearing will not make you an expert on dogs. I'm sorry if you feel that people were talking down to you. Everyone here has a passion for dogs and unfortunately bad breeding is something that happens way too often and we want to try to prevent that from happening further. The only way to learn about dogs is to read, and then go out and get EXPERIENCE. Take training classes (preferably positive reinforcement), learn about dog behavior, work with a reputable breeder and let them mentor you on what proper breeding practices should look like.
^^all came from a person who may be interested in breeding herself one day. I'm so extremely new to my breed that I don't know even 10% of what I should in order to do this right. I've begun to immerse myself in the breed, I'm trying to learn about proper structures and what drive/temperament best suits what people need today, but also stay true to the working dog of my breed. I would want to breed dogs who could at least get a Ch title as well as do performance and then go out and work a cow. There are issues in my breed (both health and temperament) that need work and I'm not prepared at this point to face them. It will be a lot of work and time, but it's doable. I hope that you are able to see that and work towards being a reputable breeder.
How can you know what the standard conditions are of a US kennel?
My problem is that no matter how wonderful the view is, how spacious the kennels and play yards, you are still housing a lot of dogs that specifically are breeds that need a job to be happy.
They also bond very, very deeply with their families. A rottweiler or an akita would be much happier living in a hovel with their own little family to watch over than locked away in a beautiful palace with someone that comes and works with them for some scheduled training and petting.
A CAO or CAS would be much happier as well with their own families, or sitting in the center of a flock of sheep to look after. In a kennel, there is no job for them to do. They are intelligent, sensitive animals and it will affect them.
How well do you think Volka would have turned out so far if he'd grown up in a kennel environment instead of your home? How happy and social do you think he would be?
In North America, and possibly parts of Europe, it is very common for breeders to place potential breeding dogs on co ownerships. Since dogs need to be intact to be shown, we look at how many dogs we are able to handle in our own homes, and place the others with people who want to buy a dog to show or compete in performance venues. Many dogs that are placed intact are on contacts that allow the breeder the option of using the dog in their breeding program at some point.
This way, puppies that we want to keep in our breeding programs don't have to live in a kennel environment. They each get to have their own family and live the fulfilling life of a companion dog. They are also with someone who will show and compete with them, so we can see if they are going to be a dog worthy of breeding with some day. It also means we are free to keep the parents in our care instead of disposing of them after they are done producing puppies, because females live many years after they are done with their last litter.
Of my dog's last litter, one puppy went to a geneticist studying polar bears in Alaska. Another is in training to be a service dog for their owner. Another went to live in a 7 million dollar mansion in San Juan Capistrano (I'm jealous of her. lol) Another is owned by a professional show handler. The others are either with other breeders or being companions in people's homes, and I have access to the males we decided to keep intact. I am really glad they have their own families and people, instead of live in a kennel.
Is something like that an option where you live? If you were able to place your males on co owership contracts that would provide more time for you to devote to your females, and making they get the necessary time and attention for their mental well being.
In North America people with large kennels that produce more than one breed of dog are called puppy mills. Because of the cost of maintaining and producing dogs, they are often neglected and the dogs are often killed when they can no longer have puppies. They only get minimum care and little interaction with people. Also because of the cost of health testing, most of their dogs are not health tested because it reduces their profits. Many also do not vaccinate, and it's common for puppies from such places to be taken from their mothers too young and be sold sick. That is also where pet store puppies come from as well. I would never buy a puppy from a pet store here.
My problem is that no matter how wonderful the view is, how spacious the kennels and play yards, you are still housing a lot of dogs that specifically are breeds that need a job to be happy.
They also bond very, very deeply with their families. A rottweiler or an akita would be much happier living in a hovel with their own little family to watch over than locked away in a beautiful palace with someone that comes and works with them for some scheduled training and petting.
A CAO or CAS would be much happier as well with their own families, or sitting in the center of a flock of sheep to look after. In a kennel, there is no job for them to do. They are intelligent, sensitive animals and it will affect them.
How well do you think Volka would have turned out so far if he'd grown up in a kennel environment instead of your home? How happy and social do you think he would be?
In North America, and possibly parts of Europe, it is very common for breeders to place potential breeding dogs on co ownerships. Since dogs need to be intact to be shown, we look at how many dogs we are able to handle in our own homes, and place the others with people who want to buy a dog to show or compete in performance venues. Many dogs that are placed intact are on contacts that allow the breeder the option of using the dog in their breeding program at some point.
This way, puppies that we want to keep in our breeding programs don't have to live in a kennel environment. They each get to have their own family and live the fulfilling life of a companion dog. They are also with someone who will show and compete with them, so we can see if they are going to be a dog worthy of breeding with some day. It also means we are free to keep the parents in our care instead of disposing of them after they are done producing puppies, because females live many years after they are done with their last litter.
Of my dog's last litter, one puppy went to a geneticist studying polar bears in Alaska. Another is in training to be a service dog for their owner. Another went to live in a 7 million dollar mansion in San Juan Capistrano (I'm jealous of her. lol) Another is owned by a professional show handler. The others are either with other breeders or being companions in people's homes, and I have access to the males we decided to keep intact. I am really glad they have their own families and people, instead of live in a kennel.
Is something like that an option where you live? If you were able to place your males on co owership contracts that would provide more time for you to devote to your females, and making they get the necessary time and attention for their mental well being.
In North America people with large kennels that produce more than one breed of dog are called puppy mills. Because of the cost of maintaining and producing dogs, they are often neglected and the dogs are often killed when they can no longer have puppies. They only get minimum care and little interaction with people. Also because of the cost of health testing, most of their dogs are not health tested because it reduces their profits. Many also do not vaccinate, and it's common for puppies from such places to be taken from their mothers too young and be sold sick. That is also where pet store puppies come from as well. I would never buy a puppy from a pet store here.
Fwiw all three of my dogs are the results of people who were breeding because they were marketable and the people who got them no longer wanted them. One was just over a year old, one was 7-8 months old (they couldn't even remember his birthday) and the third is a pup from another dog that the owner returned to the 'breeder' at 9 months old, a friend got her from them for free and she ended up being pregnant.
These are all very common things over here and a good portion of the reason we question people who want to jump into breeding.
These are all very common things over here and a good portion of the reason we question people who want to jump into breeding.
Romy you just described exactly what we are planning on doing, give them a family environment...the dogs we already have live in a house like kings surrounded by kids and family, and that what we are to our dogs , family.! how do i know what US kennels are....i am also an american citizen by the way i lived in The Us for 10yearsstudied and taught there and my wife is from Houston. so i travel often to the US and i don't live in a tent and we don't have a desert lol! actually the only desert and camel i have seen were in the US lol.
Meepitsmegan: i might be inexperienced but i assure u i am a quick learner! and as of experts i am assisted by the best: Vet, Trainer, Breeder all of them are highly qualified with years of experience and achievements. i repeat and repeat again all aspects of the matter is well studied and planned and still being studied ...we are not a bunch of teens playing here...and who knows perhaps one day one of you would want a dog from me ... it would be a gift lol but it won be ruffiangirl or djetzel coz they just dont like AGGRESSIVE DOGS lol just kidding!
Meepitsmegan: i might be inexperienced but i assure u i am a quick learner! and as of experts i am assisted by the best: Vet, Trainer, Breeder all of them are highly qualified with years of experience and achievements. i repeat and repeat again all aspects of the matter is well studied and planned and still being studied ...we are not a bunch of teens playing here...and who knows perhaps one day one of you would want a dog from me ... it would be a gift lol but it won be ruffiangirl or djetzel coz they just dont like AGGRESSIVE DOGS lol just kidding!
I don't mind aggressive dogs at all. I have owned plenty.
I mind people making plans before learning anything.
You know nothing about conformation, genetics, or training, and if you have these plans, I find it highly unlikely that any of your business partners know what they are doing, either. Just because they have been doing it for 20 years, doesn't mean they were doing it well or right.
Good "kennels" in the US are primarily with dogs actually owned in the breeders' homes, and they very infrequently breed two dogs they own. The chances of the two dogs being compatible conformationally and temperamentally is very slim, so you will very likely find that large percentage of the dogs you raise will NOT be breed worthy, and or will not be suitable to breed with the dogs you already have. You will have to pay stud fees or find a suitable bitch from another program to make an educated pairing for breeding.
I mind people making plans before learning anything.
You know nothing about conformation, genetics, or training, and if you have these plans, I find it highly unlikely that any of your business partners know what they are doing, either. Just because they have been doing it for 20 years, doesn't mean they were doing it well or right.
Good "kennels" in the US are primarily with dogs actually owned in the breeders' homes, and they very infrequently breed two dogs they own. The chances of the two dogs being compatible conformationally and temperamentally is very slim, so you will very likely find that large percentage of the dogs you raise will NOT be breed worthy, and or will not be suitable to breed with the dogs you already have. You will have to pay stud fees or find a suitable bitch from another program to make an educated pairing for breeding.
