Pitbulls and Other Dogs or Cats

sonny

New Member
Joined
Dec 31, 2005
Messages
84
Likes
0
Points
0
#61
Hey lewis, I just wanted to make it clear I am not against you .I know what you and Amstaffer are saying,i know of many, many APBT and Amstaffs that are exactly like you describe .Its just I see it like.....If everybody who owns a pitbull, used basic common sense as a general rule of thumb, you can indeed avoid problem.,Its kind of like wearing your seat belt ...you don't plan on crashing do you? if you ride a motorcycle you wear a helmet, right? ETC,ETC. I think you have good intentions, and by all means don't take this as me coming down on you.I realize the sense of urgency you display, when you talk about genocide.And such words are used to show that urgency. But you must keep things in perspective .Personally I don't think they are going to come to our houses take our dog and kill it.(like to see them try, it will never happen) they already put down many pitbulls that come to shelters in most states and cities in the US .The laws already are severe for the common citizen to own these dogs (if they bite someone) but they're usually not the problem. I was reading some 60 million dogs in this country ,and only 10 fatal dog attacks annually? I don't think this country's that screwed up to take such measures as to exterminate all the breeds they propose to be banned ,And to single out a inherently non human aggressive dog out over man stoppers such as #### ( dont want to bring the heat on the others) that's ludicrous they have there head up there a##, heck more people die from car crashes ,than all the dog attacks combined. Drunk drivers, humans killing humans ETC .We don't see bars being banned do we? Or how come my car can do 150 mph and the speed limit is 55 mph ETC,ETC.We all know cigarettes kill you right.... Not to compare the value of a human life to a dog, but its more like stating a fact. Hell I'm going to go out on a limb here and I will say ,I bet more people in the US. die from complications resulting from a common cold than pitbull attacks annually .So keep the positive attitude you display, but keep things like your pitbulls and most others are super friendly and not normally aggressive out of public view..You know some knuckle head will read it bring his pitbull ...ok ( poorly socialized pitbull ) to a dog park and WHAM headlines and another dead dog! That's not good for anybody.;) QUOTE=lewis]All dogs can be aggressive, but not all of them are being banned.
Why? Why only pit bulls?
You saying these dogs have the physical ability to maim and kill another animal very quickly - sure, nobody says they do not, and it's the owner's responsibility to train his dog to behave. These dogs are not killing machines. They can be friendly, sweet - REALLY !
And listen, what I said was my own opinion, I have started this topic just to see people's respond. I do still think that it is a myth that ALL pitbulls are aggressive. And I fail to understand why people are so picky to word choice - everybody seem to care about word choice but not the problem itself! I think it's wrong.
I myself own 4 cats - and to be honest I am afraid of big potentially dangerous dogs.. but not as much as to want them to be put to sleep. you know?[/QUOTE]
 

MyDogsLoveMe

My pets love me they do
Joined
Jul 5, 2005
Messages
1,238
Likes
0
Points
0
Age
57
Location
Utah
#62
Here is a pic of my most vicious dog Nalla


And again


Nah j/k she is a baby but like any dog big or small one thing can set them off. I watch her, dont let her run (she is still jumping my fence) and overall just love em both
 

Amstaffer

Active Member
Joined
May 13, 2005
Messages
3,276
Likes
0
Points
36
Location
Milwaukee WI
#66
I would love to see any reply PETA has for that letter. I lost any respect I had for PETA when I found out they want to kill Pit Bulls. Shows even animal lovers can be brainwashed against an animal.

I found Ingrid Newkirk's (PETA Leader) email if you what to tell her how wrong she is on BSLs you can send her your thoughts.
 
Last edited:

pitbulliest

Active Member
Joined
Jun 24, 2004
Messages
1,112
Likes
0
Points
36
Age
39
Location
Toronto, Canada
#67
casablanca1 said:
Banning certain animals or types of animals isn't evil - it may be wrong or stupid or ineffective, I'm not arguing for it. But it's not evil.
Depending on your definition of evil...don't be surprised that people are comparing BSL to genocide..when here in Ontario, any innocent pit bull puppy born after November 27th is to be killed. That is very comparable to genocide...you have to admit.

I think killing or trying to exterminate a breed of dog because of ignorance and lack of knowledge is pretty darn evil....or maybe completely idiotic would be a better term?

Either way, I hope you understand why some people feel the way they do about this issue; although I do agree with you about the fact that it is very important to state facts instead of passionate opinions, and to be calm and rational while attempting to do so...lying or making up who knows what in order to make things lean your way; well, that will never better the situation, but make it worse and make you look like a total baboon..
 

TroyF

New Member
Joined
Jan 7, 2006
Messages
78
Likes
0
Points
0
Age
54
Location
Surrey, British Columbia
#68
I really wish I'd joined this board a few weeks earlier. What a great discussion on a subject I'm really passionate about myself.

First off and most important, I have to say that Saladin is absolutely gorgeous (and I'm not a fan of cropping). Secondly; I adopted an eight year old neutered male from a troubled friend. I've known the dog since a puppy and had some influence on his training over the years mainly in the sense that I stressed how important responsibility was with this particular breed. He's can't be trusted with other male dogs period. He can't be trusted with any small white "fluffy" dogs and he doesn't want to just chase them. He's surprised me once in a controlled setting with a female black lab, until meeting her I thought there was no chance that he'd go after a female. Generally I can let him play with larger females in a supervised play area. I can stop his aggression with a command but I fear running into another fighting breed and having a hell of a time getting them apart. Based on my experience dealing with the breed in general (not just my fellow) I would not take a bull breed to an off leash park. I certainly don't condemn Amstaffer for doing so but I do think he's playing some form of a game of chance that I don't know what the odds are :) .

I honestly don't believe that any of you would have a very good success rate in telling any of the pitter breeds apart especially amstaffs vs. APBT. Yes sure englishstaffies are generally smaller but whatever. Pitters are pitters are pitters. They are usually big ol' love sluts and they're usually dog aggressive. They're best suited to intelligent, experienced dog owners (I'm an exception to this rule) who don't mind getting their excersise in out of the way places.

Friends here in my area have a staffbull and had as well an Australlian Cattle Dog. The healer was extremely well trained (search and rescue/evidence search/attack trained) and also one of the biggest jerks you could ever hope to meet. He was two years older than the staffy. Owners were both trainers and one a respected and published animal behaviouralist. The dogs had always got along. First sign of trouble was a quick disagreement in the back of a pick up, the owners were both on hand and the fight was stopped after a bite (17 stitches to the healer's leg). Fight was blamed on the healer and excused as a close confinement problem and looked to avoid this in future. Second trouble was much more serious. Dogs left on their own for the day (usual) and owner came home to blood and fur thourghout the house. Both dogs were badly beat up but both survived. Extreme steps were then taken and neither was left unattended again...until an error in judgement. They went on a long (three hour hike) with both dogs. They stopped for a quick bite to eat and felt that dogs were exhausted enough to be left alone. The healer had to be put down that evening.

I guess the point to the above story is that the owners were experts in the field (despite the obvious mistakes made), the dogs were well socialized, the dogs behaviours were understood and yet the outcome was devestating. This little staffy is still with them and is a very social old fellow, he's well trained and with supervision never causes any fights but he's still dog aggressive and if the right stimulants are present he's a risk.

I think all pit bull breeds are potentially dog aggressive. I think females pose less of risk than males. I think Amstaffer's female will never cause a problem if she hasn't already and I think his male could at any time and it sounds like he's aware and is taking steps (I hope).

In my former life I was a dog loving drug dealer. I saw some horrific treatment of the animals and I saw some that you wouldn't want to even think of petting. The sad part is that even with all the mistreatment I saw, most of them were still friendly.

Breed specific bans suck.
 

Amstaffer

Active Member
Joined
May 13, 2005
Messages
3,276
Likes
0
Points
36
Location
Milwaukee WI
#69
TroyF said:
The sad part is that even with all the mistreatment I saw, most of them were still friendly.

.
I (volunteering with the Humane society) have seen the same thing. This breed forgives human like no other. They will continue to love humans who treat them in ways that would make you lose your lunch. They almost have a Shakespearean Tragic love affair with Humans.
 

bubbatd

Moderator
Joined
Nov 28, 2004
Messages
64,812
Likes
1
Points
0
Age
91
#71
Troy... I appreciate your post and I think you do care about the poor pits that are discrimeated against. I personally love all dogs, but will always stick to dogs I can rely on. My next door neighbor has a female pitt that would kill my Golden, and yet would be friendly towards me.... at 72 , I won't take the chance !! She's on a 6 ft. chain that could pull a mac truck, attached to a dog house. I would love to feed her, love on her, water her.... but I can't take the chance. I don't believe in banning the breed, but I think the breeders are the ones to watch. These pups have to go into the right hands.
 

TroyF

New Member
Joined
Jan 7, 2006
Messages
78
Likes
0
Points
0
Age
54
Location
Surrey, British Columbia
#72
Bubbatd, I couldn't agree more but would add that although the pitbull is more likely to be dog aggressive living under poor conditions the chances of other large dogs living in the same conditions being a problem to people would be way higher in my opinion. And Bubba, I've met pitters that you wouldn't go near no matter what age you are and it wasn't an accident they turned out that way. Sad.

So maybe stupid people bans should be in effect.

As for dogs you can rely on, I also agree. I took my pitbull in because I knew him and felt for the owners parents. I often say to people that when choosing a bull breed for a pet you take on ten times more responsibility than your average common breed (I'm not talking Anatollian shepherds) but I will say that you as the owner could rely on it.
 

Amstaffer

Active Member
Joined
May 13, 2005
Messages
3,276
Likes
0
Points
36
Location
Milwaukee WI
#73
bubbatd said:
She's on a 6 ft. chain that could pull a mac truck, attached to a dog house. .
Thats the dogs problem! Anyone who chains a pitbull or rott outside is ignorant and just asking for trouble. Anytime you chain (short not big long run wires) a dog outside, it teases their mind (people and animals walk by and they can't interact) and drives them crazy. You do this to any dog and it is cruel and will create problems, if you do it to a dog as strong as a Rott or Pit the problem will be magnified. If you can't keep your Pit bull in the house with you, I don't think you should have a pit bull....IMHO.
 

MyDogsLoveMe

My pets love me they do
Joined
Jul 5, 2005
Messages
1,238
Likes
0
Points
0
Age
57
Location
Utah
#74
Amstaffer said:
Thats the dogs problem! Anyone who chains a pitbull or rott outside is ignorant and just asking for trouble. Anytime you chain (short not big long run wires) a dog outside, it teases their mind (people and animals walk by and they can't interact) and drives them crazy. You do this to any dog and it is cruel and will create problems, if you do it to a dog as strong as a Rott or Pit the problem will be magnified. If you can't keep your Pit bull in the house with you, I don't think you should have a pit bull....IMHO.
Am though I have to disagree to a point on this. I have a pit who is 2 now. I have raised her since she was 7 weeks old. The problem I have with Nalla is that she is a jumper...she will jump my 8 foot outside fence without blinking. Now I have to chain her up when I let her outside, when I dont within a matter of minutes she is up and over the fence. I have not yet had any problems with her and other people or animals but I would be the ignorant one is I chose to ignore that and let her run wild. I would be the irresponsible dog owner because basically if I dont hook her to her chain and let her just jump the fence I am looking to have a lawsuit slapped on me if she does get into a situation where she attacks another animal or person.

Doesnt matter how much time I spend training her. I have a huge backyard with ample room for her to run, but thats just not enough for her. Am I to give her away because of this, no....and I wont. She is fixed now and I am hoping that over time she will gain some weight and will make it harder for her to jump and then I wont have to chain her up....Please dont make the assumption that chaining is a bad thing because it really isnt....It keeps her safe from harm and keeps others potentially safe also.

Here is Nalla She is not short and stocky like a typical pit she is more tall and slender like her mom and half her litter mates.

 

mojozen

bullie lover
Joined
Nov 1, 2005
Messages
1,517
Likes
0
Points
0
Location
Madison, wi
#75
MyDogsLoveMe said:
Am though I have to disagree to a point on this. I have a pit who is 2 now. I have raised her since she was 7 weeks old. The problem I have with Nalla is that she is a jumper...she will jump my 8 foot outside fence without blinking. Now I have to chain her up when I let her outside, when I dont within a matter of minutes she is up and over the fence. I have not yet had any problems with her and other people or animals but I would be the ignorant one is I chose to ignore that and let her run wild. I would be the irresponsible dog owner because basically if I dont hook her to her chain and let her just jump the fence I am looking to have a lawsuit slapped on me if she does get into a situation where she attacks another animal or person.
My question is - do you leave Nalla chained up all the time - 24/7 all kinds of weather? I think that's more a problem than someone who just chains up their dog for a jaunt outside.
 

MyDogsLoveMe

My pets love me they do
Joined
Jul 5, 2005
Messages
1,238
Likes
0
Points
0
Age
57
Location
Utah
#76
Oh good heavens no, but from how I was reading the post by AMSTAFF I took it as if you chain them up at all. Maybe I misunderstood the post (which is a possibility) I do feel bad when I have to and this summer we are going to put up a very big dog run so that I dont have to chain her. I am hoping though by this summer she will be plump and I wont have to do that
 

Amstaffer

Active Member
Joined
May 13, 2005
Messages
3,276
Likes
0
Points
36
Location
Milwaukee WI
#77
MyDogsLoveMe said:
Am though I have to disagree to a point on this. I have a pit who is 2 now. I have raised her since she was 7 weeks old. The problem I have with Nalla is that she is a jumper...she will jump my 8 foot outside fence without blinking. Now I have to chain her up when I let her outside
First you chain her behind a fence and only while she does her "business" so this is better than the case I was commenting on. It sounds like you put on the chain and go "Do the dishes or chain the oil" and then come get her and take her in the house, if that is what you do; I don't have a problem with that.

I just hate it when I see a Pit chained in plain sight (this teases them) and never get off the chain. A life like that is torture for them. I think that is worse than just shooting them in the head.

I have a fenced in back yard but when I take my dogs out I stay with them and when I exercise them I take them to some open areas where I can let them run. I also just plain walk them.
 

MyDogsLoveMe

My pets love me they do
Joined
Jul 5, 2005
Messages
1,238
Likes
0
Points
0
Age
57
Location
Utah
#78
Like I stated I think I may have misunderstood your post. I do leave her out for a while especially in the summer, in the winter it is long enough to do her business and then she is back in. I try at times to stay out with her but she is like a greyhound (she is extremely fast) and I look and look again and there she goes up over the fence. I dont like to see animals chained 24-7 as I feel if you need to do that then why have an animal. To each his/her own what they do is their choice.
 

sonny

New Member
Joined
Dec 31, 2005
Messages
84
Likes
0
Points
0
#79
Its kind of funny this topic just popped up....i just recently have had a problem with my pitbull getting under my chain link fence,i have a new neighbor that has a little female staffy puppy(about 16 weeks)....I thought it would be a good idea to socialize them,so I invited them over.I was very pleased to see how gentle and cautious my dog was not to hurt her..Anyway it seems like it was a bad idea because now every time I let him out in the yard,he goes right for the neighbors house...ugh, lets just say chasing him around my neighbors house in my spongbob boxers pissed me off ...lol,I laugh now but I was smoking mad...big stick mad...So now I chain him to a truck tire, its heavy enough to keep him in the yard but light enough for him to move around..And he's getting so dam muscular he's scary looking..Im going to stretch a cable along the bottom of the fence to keep him from getting under,along with some more training ,I also just bought a remote training collar .I know lots of people don't like them ,but I feel its for his own good, I live on a main road and he's not going to be hurt or killed. If someone does do the chaining to a tire or rim make sure you use a harness, and make sure the chain is shorter than your fence, you still need to watch him ,but its good if your getting ready for work ,You can chain him to a tire in a fenced yard, go brush teeth or whatever, then when your done and hopefully he took care of his business. Put him in the house and off to work..
 
Last edited:

Amstaffer

Active Member
Joined
May 13, 2005
Messages
3,276
Likes
0
Points
36
Location
Milwaukee WI
#80
sonny said:
,You can chain him to a tire in a fenced yard, go brush teeth or whatever, then when your done and hopefully he took care of his business. Put him in the house and off to work..
This is the most important part....everybody thinking about chaining read that part again!
 

Members online

Top