How do you qualify homes for your puppies?

[PWCorgi]

Exactly how identifying is a DL#?

Sometimes your SS# is used as the ID number on DLs.

 

[PWCorgi]

OT:

I like to give my puppy buyers a choice of when to neuter the dog. It says the dog must be neutered by 12 months of age, and shall not under any circumstances ever have a litter before that time. Since all the recent research done about early neuter, I feel that doing juvenile neuters on an entire litter could be dangerous, so I won't do that.

A lot of people I have talked to wait until the dog is 2 years old until they s/n. If a potential owner who passed all other criteria and was a great fit asked, would you be against letting them wait until the dog was 2 years old? Just wondering.

 

[Saje]

You can have my phone number. You can have my e-mail. You can have my address. You can have that info for a couple of contacts, such as my parents, who can find me. You can't have my SSN, or my DL#. Its not because I don't trust you, but because those are NOT your business. Period. Unless you have a reason to run a credit check on me, you don't need them. And buying a puppy should not be grounds for a credit check. IF you really want to make sure I have enough money, I'll give you a redacted bank statement.

I don't mean to be rude, but I am so dang tired of everyone and their cousin thinking they are entitled to very private information. Yes, a puppy is a life long relationship. I've been engaged to Mike for 7 years, and he doesn't know my SSN and I don't know his. If my fiance doesn't know my SNN, then you don't need to know either.

If a breeder requires my social security number or driver's license number to get a puppy, I'll RUN away--not walk. I am willing to give addresses, phone numbers, answer numerous questions, provide references and more. But while I love dogs, I have yet to see a puppy worth risking my identify, financial assets and credit security for.

The only places I give that info to are trustworthy places that legitimately need it. For example, businesses or organizations that keep their numbers stored and are prepared for accepting the responsibility and liability of having such things.

But an individual? No way in heck. And the thought that an individual breeder would potentially have the social security numbers of numerous people is very frightening to me. What if they're visited by a not-so-savory relative who goes through the files? What if they're robbed? Or what if they just have a moment of carelessness, and accidentally throw an unshredded copy of that info into the trash?

Breeders have been placing puppies responsibly for decades without needing such personal info. But if that's the trend that breeders are going towards, I guess I'm going to stick with found strays like Voodoo, or rescues that don't require that info.

:hail:

 

[OutlineACDs]

OT:



A lot of people I have talked to wait until the dog is 2 years old until they s/n. If a potential owner who passed all other criteria and was a great fit asked, would you be against letting them wait until the dog was 2 years old? Just wondering.

No, I wouldn't. In fact, my last litter just turned two, and one of the males I sold as a pet is not yet neutered. He was sold to someone I trust and I gave her the option of waiting a little longer. I have a medium sized breed, and for the most part don't see a problem neutering at 6-12 months. If I had one that I kept as a pet only, I would spay after the first cycle. I would probably wait longer on a male. I just really hate dealing with heat cycles. That's a personal preference though.

 

[PWCorgi]

Okay, thanks

 

[adojrts]

I would like to comment on the s/n, I agree that a pup doesn't have to be done at an early age but all the more reason for me to 'keep an eye' the situation. I have also had several people request keeping the option open on breeding. I will agree as long as we change the contract to a breeding quality contract instead of a pet quality contract, the first thing to consider is WHY they want to breed, 2nd as an adult is this dog breeding stock or not. Then what have they done with the dog? Any titles? And nothing is bred until they are willing to do all the genetic testing. All that has to be done before I would consider giving the ok, for a breeding to take place. And that has nothing to do with me, it has to do with protecting a breed and the resulting litters.

 

[OutlineACDs]

I would like to comment on the s/n, I agree that a pup doesn't have to be done at an early age but all the more reason for me to 'keep an eye' the situation. I have also had several people request keeping the option open on breeding. I will agree as long as we change the contract to a breeding quality contract instead of a pet quality contract, the first thing to consider is WHY they want to breed, 2nd as an adult is this dog breeding stock or not. Then what have they done with the dog? Any titles? And nothing is bred until they are willing to do all the genetic testing. All that has to be done before I would consider giving the ok, for a breeding to take place. And that has nothing to do with me, it has to do with protecting a breed and the resulting litters.

In this case, I imagine you would have stayed on as co-owner though? That's what I would do. If I sold a dog to a home that wanted to wait it out and possibly breed later, I would stay on as co-owner with the understanding I would evaluate the dog and discuss all aspects of breeding at a later date pending titles, etc. IF at that time the dog was fit to breed, they would go on with health testing and I could help with choosing a stud dog and helping them along with breeding plans.

 

[Miakoda]

:hail:

I 2nd that.

If you feel the need to have that kind of personal info to "verify" that the person you are selling a dog to is the right person, maybe you ought to step back and reevaluate the kinds of the people you sell to. Or better yet, why not keep the dogs with ONLY people you know well.

Again, I know we've been through this and I'm in the rare minority here, but I don't believe in breeding to sell to any Joe Shmoe who wants a dog from me. I keep my dogs to myself, my family, and to those within my core APBT world that I know. I won't just sell a dog to someone who makes a lot of promises even if they do seem to be great people. Don't even bother asking.

 

[adojrts]

In this case, I imagine you would have stayed on as co-owner though? That's what I would do. If I sold a dog to a home that wanted to wait it out and possibly breed later, I would stay on as co-owner with the understanding I would evaluate the dog and discuss all aspects of breeding at a later date pending titles, etc. IF at that time the dog was fit to breed, they would go on with health testing and I could help with choosing a stud dog and helping them along with breeding plans.

That is correct, I remain a co-owner until said dog is approved for breeding or is s/n'd. And we would also have to discuss the difference between the price that was paid as a pet quality puppy and what is now a breeding quality puppy that they want to breed..............typically I would want pick of the litter. Or at the very least first right of refusal lol.

 

[Saje]

Ok I have to say that anyone who gives up their SSN is foolish. It's an opinion but I strongly believe that. Especially since it's been admitted on a public forum that these people have (or will have) a collection of SSN on file in their homes/offices. That worth breaking into their home just for that.

Why? Because once you have a social security number (social insurance number (SIN) here) you can:

- order credit cards in any name using that number. the names do not have to match up.
- set up telephone accounts, cable accounts, internet accounts... hook up utilities
- get a car
- get ID. Get a new birth certificate. Get a new driver's license.
- work under someone else's SS so you dont pay taxes...
- report you dead and collect your life insurance
- open bank accounts
- get payday loans
- etc.

THAT is why you do NOT give you SS or driver's license number to anyone you don't have to.

AND if you give your Driver's license number people can order a "lost" SS card.

And from what I understand in the US you can even buy houses with SS numbers.

I would not buy from a breeder that asked for that. I don't condemn Red or anyone who does that. Everyone knows she wants to care for her pups. It's up to the buyer to beware.

I've written stories on this and talked to people who do this. I know what they can do and I think it's awfully foolish of people to give out their SSN for something like this.

Sorry, but I had to say it so that people would stop and think. Not just about puppies but anytime their SSN is asked for. It's VERY had to fix it too once the damage is done.

Stop and think.

 

[Buddy'sParents]

:hail: :hail:

Thanks for the post, Saje!

 

[Renee750il]

I don't know how to break it to you guys, but a SS# isn't all that hard to get . . . . I've done it countless times helping my fugitive recovery guys. Legally. Without breaking into anything or hacking anything.

 

[OutlineACDs]

^^^That was kind of my point about the friend who got her identity stolen in a restaurant. It didn't take much info for the guy to get everything. Luckily, he just wanted to pay his cable bill and a few other things, but it could have turned bad.

 

[Renee750il]

Yah, and the scary part is no one told me how to do it. I figured it out, and rarely used exactly the same routes to get the info I needed.

I can see where a credit check would be a good tool for a serious breeder. It gives you a good picture of where someone's priorities are - tangibly - and whether or not they are being candid.

 

[HoundedByHounds]

Just because something is easy to do...doesn't mean I want to make it easier...LOL.

 

[Buddy'sParents]

Yeah, that. ^

 

[HoundedByHounds]

TALKING and taking the time and seeing a potential puppy buyer, as a person not a dollar sign, or a number, ior a credit score, or someone handy to watch "your" dog for you because you can't keep them all on your property...*eyeroll*

I'm sorry I see no need to make placing a puppy like pulling teeth. A simple enforceable contract and your gut are all you need.

 

[PoodleMommy]

Yah, and the scary part is no one told me how to do it. I figured it out, and rarely used exactly the same routes to get the info I needed.

I can see where a credit check would be a good tool for a serious breeder. It gives you a good picture of where someone's priorities are - tangibly - and whether or not they are being candid.

I am still against giving my social security number but at least the reason Red and others have given about wanting to located dogs in the future is legitimate... but doing a credit check?! that is seriously none of a breeders business... if they call my vet and make sure I do what is needed and call my groomer and make sure they come regularly... why do they need to know what I do with MY money?

 

[HoundedByHounds]

don't credit checks actually ding your credit? Imagine talking with a few breeders and them all running your credit to see if you make the cut...LOL. Well, now I don't...thanks.

 

[Buddy'sParents]

don't credit checks actually ding your credit? Imagine talking with a few breeders and them all running your credit to see if you make the cut...LOL. Well, now I don't...thanks.

I hadn't even allowed myself to think that far.... you're right. Besides, my finances are none of the breeder's business. They don't need to know about my car payments or my student loans... bah! The whole idea is truly sickening, think of all the detrimental effects something like this could have. *shakes head* No way.