puppy
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M
Feeding A Pup
I sure hope you have not taken on a problem. 8 weeks is much too young for a puppy of a medium sized breed to leave its mother. Is there ANY chance that the parents had any kind of testing...or is this a BYB pup?
Put the puppy on a good quality dry feed. If you have a Walmart near you, you can get Maxim puppy food. Mix it was some canned food. For an 8 week old collie I would suggest maybe 1 1/2 cups of dry food with 1/4 canned mixed with warm water so that the canned coats the dry. I would offer this 3 times a day. And also, sprinkle powdered milk over the whole dish of food (can you spell BRIBE? Rofl) At least a quarter cup of dry milk can be mixed in and sprinkled on each dish of food. DO NOT GIVE A PUPPY WHOLE MILK!!!!! You will end up with a pup with diarrhea like you won't believe!
Take the dog to the vet immediately for a worm check and general overall checkup. Did you get any guarantee with this pup---I am assuming you bought this pup. If so most states make sellers give a 48-72 hour health guarantee. Is there any chance that the parents had any kind of testing.....ESPECIALLY EYES!!!? Are there any white collies in this pup's background? OH YEAH.......you should have been given at least a 5 generation pedigree on this puppy.
I know that most likely you did not get any of the above. But if you did pay money for this pup, and did NOT, I sure hope you did not pay more than $50. And you can tell the person you got the pup from that I said so!!!!!!!
I have been involved in dogs for 30 years now. Did some breeding and showing. Produced several champions, even had a top producing female a couple years ago (Toy Manchester). So I do know what I am saying. I have learned much.......most of it the hard way, thru heartache and crappy luck.
If you would like to contact me directly via e-mail you may do so. The addy is [email protected] (you would never guess I own my own domain, would you, rofl.)
I sure hope you have not taken on a problem. 8 weeks is much too young for a puppy of a medium sized breed to leave its mother. Is there ANY chance that the parents had any kind of testing...or is this a BYB pup?
Put the puppy on a good quality dry feed. If you have a Walmart near you, you can get Maxim puppy food. Mix it was some canned food. For an 8 week old collie I would suggest maybe 1 1/2 cups of dry food with 1/4 canned mixed with warm water so that the canned coats the dry. I would offer this 3 times a day. And also, sprinkle powdered milk over the whole dish of food (can you spell BRIBE? Rofl) At least a quarter cup of dry milk can be mixed in and sprinkled on each dish of food. DO NOT GIVE A PUPPY WHOLE MILK!!!!! You will end up with a pup with diarrhea like you won't believe!
Take the dog to the vet immediately for a worm check and general overall checkup. Did you get any guarantee with this pup---I am assuming you bought this pup. If so most states make sellers give a 48-72 hour health guarantee. Is there any chance that the parents had any kind of testing.....ESPECIALLY EYES!!!? Are there any white collies in this pup's background? OH YEAH.......you should have been given at least a 5 generation pedigree on this puppy.
I know that most likely you did not get any of the above. But if you did pay money for this pup, and did NOT, I sure hope you did not pay more than $50. And you can tell the person you got the pup from that I said so!!!!!!!
I have been involved in dogs for 30 years now. Did some breeding and showing. Produced several champions, even had a top producing female a couple years ago (Toy Manchester). So I do know what I am saying. I have learned much.......most of it the hard way, thru heartache and crappy luck.
If you would like to contact me directly via e-mail you may do so. The addy is [email protected] (you would never guess I own my own domain, would you, rofl.)
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First of all, I'm a proffesional trainer and soon to be animal behaviourists, so I am totally aware of said things. This pup has a ten generation pedigree, no white collies, tested for CEA. Eight weeks old is the perfect time for every breed as it is the start of the all important socialisation window, something i would not miss!
thanks alot for the help though, and i admit that i'm not a vetrinarian, lol.
I would never dream of giving a pup milk, not unless i wanted my walls repainted!
thanks alot for the help though, and i admit that i'm not a vetrinarian, lol.
I would never dream of giving a pup milk, not unless i wanted my walls repainted!
M
Well, now, not to quibble, but the behavioral experts all agree that 8 weeks of age is the point at which the dam begins teaching her pups how to be DOGS, and how to interact with other dogs. By the age of 10-12 weeks the puppy is physically and emotionally ready to venture out to the real world. Just let us state that no reputable breeder will even consider letting a puppy go prior to at least 10 weeks of age.
How is the HD testing in the dogs in that pedigree? Also, how about vWD? I should perhaps state that I am a canine behaviorist and have been for 25+ years. Also of course a trainer---you have to be a trainer AND behaviorist to raise litters of pups. And unless you have raised a few litters, you cannot graduate to being a trainer/behaviorist, Rogation!
Fortunately the only disparity between us (age) is a moot point since you already have the pup. Oh......perhaps I should mention that I started out with Dobermans 30 years ago, so have had experience with large, medium and small beasts, and their stages of physical and mental development. An 8 week old Dobe is far too young mentally, physically and emotionally to leave the nest. The reason there are so many emotionally unstable, neurotic dogs is because people believe that magic number of "8 weeks". I am not quibbling with you, but putting that there for others who read the group.
Since neither of us knows the other, and since it is easy to make statements of fact on the internet that might be a bit embellished, (thank goodness for spell check, lol) could you give a hint as to what type of training you do (show conformation or obedience, field, agility, etc) How many dogs have you titled? How many litters of pups have you raised/socialized/trained?
I have somewhere 9 champion Whippets, either as breeder or co-breeder, 4 champion Manchesters, one of which was top producer of champions herself. One champion was the #5 top winning Manchester and #5 top winner all breeds in 1996.
Unfortunately I am and have always been poor, so have not been able to show as much as I would have liked to. But my contribution to the Toy Manchester is well recognized and acknowledged by those high up in the breed.
I ain't bragging.....(not much, anyway, lol)......just giving my CV in dogs, so you will know I ain't just blowing smoke. Besides I quit smoking about 8 years ago.
What kind of wormer was used on the pup? Pups should be wormed at 6 weeks and again at 8 weeks. Then I do mine again at 12 weeks. I should probably add that I have not had a litter for 6 1/2 years now. I must try to outlive the dogs I have, so do not want to add to that number.
Nice meeting you! Do they have Toy Manchesters where you are or do they have what they call English Toy Terriers??? Is it winter in Australia now? Here in Florida we are in the full sway of summer. 95 degree days and such.
Have a nice evening (I believe it is evening there, yes?) Regards, Carole
How is the HD testing in the dogs in that pedigree? Also, how about vWD? I should perhaps state that I am a canine behaviorist and have been for 25+ years. Also of course a trainer---you have to be a trainer AND behaviorist to raise litters of pups. And unless you have raised a few litters, you cannot graduate to being a trainer/behaviorist, Rogation!
Fortunately the only disparity between us (age) is a moot point since you already have the pup. Oh......perhaps I should mention that I started out with Dobermans 30 years ago, so have had experience with large, medium and small beasts, and their stages of physical and mental development. An 8 week old Dobe is far too young mentally, physically and emotionally to leave the nest. The reason there are so many emotionally unstable, neurotic dogs is because people believe that magic number of "8 weeks". I am not quibbling with you, but putting that there for others who read the group.
Since neither of us knows the other, and since it is easy to make statements of fact on the internet that might be a bit embellished, (thank goodness for spell check, lol) could you give a hint as to what type of training you do (show conformation or obedience, field, agility, etc) How many dogs have you titled? How many litters of pups have you raised/socialized/trained?
I have somewhere 9 champion Whippets, either as breeder or co-breeder, 4 champion Manchesters, one of which was top producer of champions herself. One champion was the #5 top winning Manchester and #5 top winner all breeds in 1996.
Unfortunately I am and have always been poor, so have not been able to show as much as I would have liked to. But my contribution to the Toy Manchester is well recognized and acknowledged by those high up in the breed.
I ain't bragging.....(not much, anyway, lol)......just giving my CV in dogs, so you will know I ain't just blowing smoke. Besides I quit smoking about 8 years ago.
What kind of wormer was used on the pup? Pups should be wormed at 6 weeks and again at 8 weeks. Then I do mine again at 12 weeks. I should probably add that I have not had a litter for 6 1/2 years now. I must try to outlive the dogs I have, so do not want to add to that number.
Nice meeting you! Do they have Toy Manchesters where you are or do they have what they call English Toy Terriers??? Is it winter in Australia now? Here in Florida we are in the full sway of summer. 95 degree days and such.
Have a nice evening (I believe it is evening there, yes?) Regards, Carole
Glad to meet another trainer! I've gotten numerous UDX titles with my border collies (lol, but they come with a CD). Here in Australia we are all taught eight weeks, I've never heard of leaving it till twelve!
Obviously you can tell i train for obedience, but i also do agility.I don't do any showing, though I may with this pup, although it doesn't much interest me.
I've also won titles in obedience and agility with my Kelpie, and much more recently a clients borzoi, lol, they can be trained!
I did train assistance dogs for a while. Things must be much different here in Australia. We certainly don't have to raise a single litter to be a behaviourist, albeit we observe the birth process and some litters for a while.
Obviously you can tell i train for obedience, but i also do agility.I don't do any showing, though I may with this pup, although it doesn't much interest me.
I've also won titles in obedience and agility with my Kelpie, and much more recently a clients borzoi, lol, they can be trained!
I did train assistance dogs for a while. Things must be much different here in Australia. We certainly don't have to raise a single litter to be a behaviourist, albeit we observe the birth process and some litters for a while.
M
UDX's!
Boy, my hat is off to you! Just getting one UDX is an honor to be proud of! But of course as you said, the BC is born with a CD, Rofl.
My statement regarding raising pups (litters) regards someone having hands on experience as a behaviorist as opposed to simply "book learning". The breeder of a litter of pups instills the behavior and attitude into those puppies from the time the sack is removed. If the breeder does a good job, then the future owners will never need a behaviorist. And of course a reputable breeder is available to pup buyers for the life of the pup. My problem was that I seldom could find someone worthy of owning one of my pups. Hence my large pack, lol.
If you think about it, it is the breeder who has the first opportunity to instill confidence and self esteem into their puppies. It is hard work, and very likely more work than any "behaviorist" would ever put into any dog.
Boy, I just had to take a break and cut my nails! It is amazing how fast our hair and nails grow when we want to keep them short!!!!!!! In my case the way I hold my fingers, I type right on the tip of the finger, and when the nail is too long it hurts! nothing to absorb the shock, lol.
I just thought of a point that might help you understand where us "12 weekers" are coming from. Maternal immunities do not leave the pup till at least 10 weeks of age. That means that the pups are vulnerable to parvo and other diseases, and that we cannot know for sure the status of their immunity. The mother's immunity blocks any shots from working, so you cannot be sure if a puppy 8-10 weeks has ANY immunity, since you don't know when maternal will leave, and the shots will become effective. So by keeping a pup and shooting it at 12 weeks, you know it will receive protection from the shot.
ALSO, show people have to keep the pups so that they can evaluate their conformation. ALSO, it is during the period of 6-10 weeks that pups are weaned by their mothers, and are taught proper good puppy behavior from a doggy point of view. One important thing is BITE INHIBITION. The momma and litter mates all teach the pups what is and is not acceptable as far as using teeth. This is very important to a puppy's proper social upbringing, and is later reinforced by the owner.
When I had pups, by the time they were 5 weeks old they knew not to put a tooth on me. Now, my stepmother was another story.......roflmfbo!!!!! She was NOT a behaviorist, human or dog. My little pups would chomp her with impunity! I told her a hundred times how to correct the little shish pots but she didn't listen. One of my pups got his name from chomping Helen----Gator, Rofl. And I mean we are talking little 3/4 pound pups, Rofl.
Over the years I have had nothing but praise from those who have met me and my dogs for the wonderful personality and sense of humor my dogs exhibit. My brats are my family, and I live, eat, and sleep with them. And it is such fun, and so rewarding raising a litter of pups and watching the world through their eyes and experiences! It truly makes you young at heart.
I have a dear friend who had a Cattle Dog once upon a time. Stubborn, thick headed, overly protective, etc. She was a happy person when he finally passed away from old age. According to those of us who have had Dobermans, anyone who can get an obedience title on a Dobe is a genuine trainer in the full sense of the word. Check around and see if you can find anyone who is trying to title a Dobe. They should have some hysterically funny stories to tell about being outdone by their dogs!!!
Another point of not being able to be a true behaviorist until having raised a couple litter of pups---it is like a veterinarian trying to advise a pet owner on what to feed their dogs. They don't know what the heck they are talking about unless they also happen to be a breeder! The true test of a dog food is not just if the dog likes it, but what the long term effect of feeding is. You cannot even begin to know until the dog in question is bred, and you have a chance to see the condition of the pups produced, their birth weight, etc. Of course this is meant to the females, lol. There have been dozens of foods over the years that have come along and touted to be miracle foods.....later it was found that there would be adverse effects on the thyroids of dogs, infertility, fading puppy syndrome etc. out of females fed these wondrous foods.
I hope you will have good luck with this pup, considering it is missing 1/2 of its proper training. Unless you are willing to get down on all fours, and grab it by the head when it uses its teeth too harshly on you, and shake it, roflmbo.
Guess I will try to get some sleep......it is 7:30AM here, and I have been up all night as usual. My sleeping schedule has been turned around for about 3 weeks. My first champion, Kelly, died two weeks ago. Had to put her to sleep.....cancer had spread to the lungs. I was up all night for about 10 days vaporizing her, and pounding her chest to clear her lungs. She also made me feed her by hand, lol. She was 12 years old, bless her heart. She was the one that was #5 for a while. She is on my website (she has a whole page to herself......her suicide attempt, Rofl.)
I guess it is evening in Australia, isn't it? If so, have a good night.
Carole
Boy, my hat is off to you! Just getting one UDX is an honor to be proud of! But of course as you said, the BC is born with a CD, Rofl.
My statement regarding raising pups (litters) regards someone having hands on experience as a behaviorist as opposed to simply "book learning". The breeder of a litter of pups instills the behavior and attitude into those puppies from the time the sack is removed. If the breeder does a good job, then the future owners will never need a behaviorist. And of course a reputable breeder is available to pup buyers for the life of the pup. My problem was that I seldom could find someone worthy of owning one of my pups. Hence my large pack, lol.
If you think about it, it is the breeder who has the first opportunity to instill confidence and self esteem into their puppies. It is hard work, and very likely more work than any "behaviorist" would ever put into any dog.
Boy, I just had to take a break and cut my nails! It is amazing how fast our hair and nails grow when we want to keep them short!!!!!!! In my case the way I hold my fingers, I type right on the tip of the finger, and when the nail is too long it hurts! nothing to absorb the shock, lol.
I just thought of a point that might help you understand where us "12 weekers" are coming from. Maternal immunities do not leave the pup till at least 10 weeks of age. That means that the pups are vulnerable to parvo and other diseases, and that we cannot know for sure the status of their immunity. The mother's immunity blocks any shots from working, so you cannot be sure if a puppy 8-10 weeks has ANY immunity, since you don't know when maternal will leave, and the shots will become effective. So by keeping a pup and shooting it at 12 weeks, you know it will receive protection from the shot.
ALSO, show people have to keep the pups so that they can evaluate their conformation. ALSO, it is during the period of 6-10 weeks that pups are weaned by their mothers, and are taught proper good puppy behavior from a doggy point of view. One important thing is BITE INHIBITION. The momma and litter mates all teach the pups what is and is not acceptable as far as using teeth. This is very important to a puppy's proper social upbringing, and is later reinforced by the owner.
When I had pups, by the time they were 5 weeks old they knew not to put a tooth on me. Now, my stepmother was another story.......roflmfbo!!!!! She was NOT a behaviorist, human or dog. My little pups would chomp her with impunity! I told her a hundred times how to correct the little shish pots but she didn't listen. One of my pups got his name from chomping Helen----Gator, Rofl. And I mean we are talking little 3/4 pound pups, Rofl.
Over the years I have had nothing but praise from those who have met me and my dogs for the wonderful personality and sense of humor my dogs exhibit. My brats are my family, and I live, eat, and sleep with them. And it is such fun, and so rewarding raising a litter of pups and watching the world through their eyes and experiences! It truly makes you young at heart.
I have a dear friend who had a Cattle Dog once upon a time. Stubborn, thick headed, overly protective, etc. She was a happy person when he finally passed away from old age. According to those of us who have had Dobermans, anyone who can get an obedience title on a Dobe is a genuine trainer in the full sense of the word. Check around and see if you can find anyone who is trying to title a Dobe. They should have some hysterically funny stories to tell about being outdone by their dogs!!!
Another point of not being able to be a true behaviorist until having raised a couple litter of pups---it is like a veterinarian trying to advise a pet owner on what to feed their dogs. They don't know what the heck they are talking about unless they also happen to be a breeder! The true test of a dog food is not just if the dog likes it, but what the long term effect of feeding is. You cannot even begin to know until the dog in question is bred, and you have a chance to see the condition of the pups produced, their birth weight, etc. Of course this is meant to the females, lol. There have been dozens of foods over the years that have come along and touted to be miracle foods.....later it was found that there would be adverse effects on the thyroids of dogs, infertility, fading puppy syndrome etc. out of females fed these wondrous foods.
I hope you will have good luck with this pup, considering it is missing 1/2 of its proper training. Unless you are willing to get down on all fours, and grab it by the head when it uses its teeth too harshly on you, and shake it, roflmbo.
Guess I will try to get some sleep......it is 7:30AM here, and I have been up all night as usual. My sleeping schedule has been turned around for about 3 weeks. My first champion, Kelly, died two weeks ago. Had to put her to sleep.....cancer had spread to the lungs. I was up all night for about 10 days vaporizing her, and pounding her chest to clear her lungs. She also made me feed her by hand, lol. She was 12 years old, bless her heart. She was the one that was #5 for a while. She is on my website (she has a whole page to herself......her suicide attempt, Rofl.)
I guess it is evening in Australia, isn't it? If so, have a good night.
Carole
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Okay, pup is doing terrifically. His tummy is completely normal and soft, but you should have seen how much poop came out of this little one! It was like a bunch of clowns getting out of one of those tiny cars!
I think that he ate something disagreeable when he was out for one of his farm jaunts (only bunch of rough collies i know from "working lines") Anyway, he's being the typical puppy now, getting into everything. I've never had a problem with bite inhibition in any of my dogs, all of which i got at eight weeks. I regularily play fight with them, doing the usual yelp and ignore if teeth are too harsh.
All of my pups have to have PERFECT bite inhibition as we perform at childrens parties.
My border collies and kelpie have been stepped on, pulled, pinched and prodded and never once shown an inch of tooth. But the immunity idea has got me wondering.
I'm always open to new information and i will talk to some people about it.
I've gotten a dobe to CDX before her owner decided it was taking too long (three months) and switched to an older forced based trainer. Needless to say we never saw her in the ring again.
Anyway, little Azlan is doing well. He's obviously not a border collie, but he's got sit (signal, no voice) and is starting to learn down. It's funny i have to change my methods slightly for every dog. Azlan is no exception. I have to move lures very slowly as he has trouble keeping up at my usual speed. But he learns quite fast and is now on an empty hand for sit and down.
I'm hoping to put a UD on him, i know at least one collie has acheived this, but i realise it will take quite a bit of practice. I don't think you even need to own a dog to be an animal behaviourist, usually we do a thesis on a wild animal, which is hardly book learning, though we do ALOT of that.
I think that he ate something disagreeable when he was out for one of his farm jaunts (only bunch of rough collies i know from "working lines") Anyway, he's being the typical puppy now, getting into everything. I've never had a problem with bite inhibition in any of my dogs, all of which i got at eight weeks. I regularily play fight with them, doing the usual yelp and ignore if teeth are too harsh.
All of my pups have to have PERFECT bite inhibition as we perform at childrens parties.
My border collies and kelpie have been stepped on, pulled, pinched and prodded and never once shown an inch of tooth. But the immunity idea has got me wondering.
I'm always open to new information and i will talk to some people about it.
I've gotten a dobe to CDX before her owner decided it was taking too long (three months) and switched to an older forced based trainer. Needless to say we never saw her in the ring again.
Anyway, little Azlan is doing well. He's obviously not a border collie, but he's got sit (signal, no voice) and is starting to learn down. It's funny i have to change my methods slightly for every dog. Azlan is no exception. I have to move lures very slowly as he has trouble keeping up at my usual speed. But he learns quite fast and is now on an empty hand for sit and down.
I'm hoping to put a UD on him, i know at least one collie has acheived this, but i realise it will take quite a bit of practice. I don't think you even need to own a dog to be an animal behaviourist, usually we do a thesis on a wild animal, which is hardly book learning, though we do ALOT of that.
I'm glad to hear Azlan is doing well! 
I was going to say he could have been a bit stressed from the new environment etc... I'm not sure. By the way, I'm from Australia too!
Just wanted to say that we got Harley at 5 weeks old (yes, I know that's really young), and there is nothing wrong with him at all.. He is extremely healthy and going strong at 9 1/2 years old.
I was going to say he could have been a bit stressed from the new environment etc... I'm not sure. By the way, I'm from Australia too!Just wanted to say that we got Harley at 5 weeks old (yes, I know that's really young), and there is nothing wrong with him at all.. He is extremely healthy and going strong at 9 1/2 years old.