Is it wrong to leave a dog alone?

[gaddylovesdogs]

This post is probably going to set some people off...that is not my intention, I'm just sick of how snooty, judgemental, and flat out rude people here can become (I am not pointing my finger at anyone when saying this). This is my last post in this thread. I'm not going to go on and on with a foolish fight.

Well - you can tell me I know nothing of crating, and i am on my high horse - but I do know a thing or 2 - for the record. I considered crating, read up about it, BOUGHT a crate.

Then I actually THOUGHT about it, and thought what a miserable existance it must be.

I'm sorry, but I bet 99% of the dog owning population who crate do not actually need to do it - it's just so the dog fits into their life easier.

It's like owning a toy - a TV - a convinent bit of fun....

If you aren't capable of removing dangerous items from your home, or locking cupboards - I worry for when you have kids.... Seriously.

Dogs might be happy sleeping in a crate - I don't dispute that fact - what I am concerned about it forcing a dog to sleep in a box, that it can't get out of, whether it has a kong/chew in or not, for 8 hours a day PLUS.

You can justify it all you like - but it's black and white - cruel.

Once again I see something that people do to satisfy themselves. If you're dog is destroying your house, you should look at those issues - not BOX it to solve the problem and save your house.

You can't assume your dog isn't going to like it. You aren't your dog.
Whether people need to use a crate or not...if they do it responsibly, what's the big deal?

No, when using a crate responsibly, it's not like a toy or TV. You still take great care of the dog, but if need be, the dog is crated. Just because someone crates their dog does not mean they treat the dog like a toy that.

I think most people do dog-proof as much as possible. They hide safe items and such. But what about a dog that chews at cupboards? Or pees all over the floor? Or barks at everything that passes what? What about THAT?

Again; responsibilty. IMO, if you are responsible, you DON'T crate your dog for hours and then again. Some people do, and they may love and take care of their dogs, but IMO there is such a thing as overcrating.

Nothing is black and white. There are grey areas. In YOUR OPINION, it's cruel. Just becuase it's your opinion does mean you're right.
There are various reasons for crating...not completely housetrained....needs to be confined due to surgery.....destroys things. Many people do try to solve the issues, but it's very hard to solve an issue that happens when you're not there. Crating a dog for a few hours is not cruel if it is done responsibly and the dog receives plenty of exercise and human contact.

3) Right I see - so - how about a baby gate for the stair (thats dog proofing).. ensure these things don't happen.. People seems to manage quite well.
What about dogs that can jump over a baby gate? Or a dog that can open the door and get outside? What about that?

4) I think crating a dog for 8 hours or more is cruel. You won't change my mind or make me think you are somehow on the moral high ground because you think I am condescending.

In all honesty - why do I care whether you think I am on a pedestal or not?

I don't want to get personal - I haven't singled anyone out - but if we're going down the "holier than thou" route - you should hear some of the things I hear about people's attitudes on here.. Which is AMAZING seeing as I am only on here part time as it is.....

How am I painting a bad picture of myself exactly? By sticking up for what I believe in?? Perhaps I am more similar to you than you care to imagine.

I have not ONCE said we live in a perfect world.. I accept people have to leave their dogs - christ - I said I have and do.

Again, for the umpteenth time - I have an issue with crating for 8 hours plus.

It is in MY eyes cruel.

You can tell me I am wrong and condescending till the cows come home - frankly - I didn't come here to be your best friend, and I couldn't care one bit.

The fact is - all I have done is stated how I feel - it's YOU people (tessa included) who feel the need to address posts to me personally, call me condescending, and what not.

No one is saying don't state your opinion. What we have a problem with is that you state your opinion in a very rude, snobby, stuck-up, condescending manner. You can deny it all you want, but it's not going to help you any. I really find it quite funny when people say they are "open-minded," and "polite" when really, they are stating their opinion, not listening to what other people have to say...not even CONSIDERING what other people have to say.... Last time I checked, that was called rude and close-minded. People are responding to you personally because you are attacking those who crate and prancing around on your very high horse.

I am always civil, I will always be polite, but I won't feel bad because you don't agree with me.

My reply to this is above.

I just wonder what you think people do and manage in places (such as australia and europe etc) where crating is mostly frowned upon?

We manage, and we don't do this?

There are always other means to get round a problem. I just wonder why noone who crates wants to consider this?

This is another thing I'm getting sick of - the prejudice against different countries and prejudice against different parts of countries.
If you manage, that's great. Each culture is different. Each person is different. And a thing to remember - just because some Americans crate doesn't all do. You're grouping a very large country into one.

Again; you are lumping us all together. Just because someone crates does not mean they didn't or don't try to find a different way to get around the problem, whatever that may be.

 

[PixieSticksandTricks]

Just anouther point I want to make about crating. My brother never crated his dogs. And when his apartment was broken into one of his dogs ran away (but was found) and the puppy either ran away or was stolen. Also the crate prevents the dogs from accidently getting out of the house if a family member visits during the day.

Like my sister comes by our house once or twice in the morning while my mom and I are at work and school. If she didn't know that Tucker or Maggiemay were running loose in the house they may accidently get out and run off (this happened with one of the cats). So crating them keeps the chanes of that more slim.

 

[Bobsk8]

They probably just throw them outside, and leave them there. Then that leads to other behavioral problems, and it's just a chain reaction.

Or they leave them in the house, and they destory everything, and then are punished or given away because they don't want to deal with the issues, and aren't willing to crate?? Just my thought...

I doubt if crateless dogs are the disasters that you are portraying. I think crating is more popular in the US, because people in this country are many times looking for the quick and easy solution to a problem. Rather than spending hours and hours training a dog, throwing it in a crate is a quick alternative. The first time I saw a dog confined to a crate, I thought it was the most bizarre thing I had ever seen . To me it's like hours and hours of time out every day for the animal. I realize that people are going to disagree with my opinion, but nevertheless, that is what I think.... I would try everything under the sun, before I would lock up any dog I had in a crate day after day!

 

[ACDsandAussies4me]

Please read all of this post before you start slamming me I totally believe in crating dogs..I will get to why here in a few...I must add that I respect everyones opions on how they feel about crating, whether it be good or bad thoughts towards it...I do know however that there are people out there that abuse the use of crates and I am sure some of you are going to think I am one of those, I do not agree with abusing dogs by makeing them spend their entire life in a crate...However ( this is where I will get slammed) I sometimes leave my dogs in there crates for 12 hours, not often but it happens..Most of the time they are in there for 9 hours..My dogs are all from the herding group, very active dogs...I do not feel this is hurting them in anyway...They are very well behaved dogs and they get plenty of excersie when I am home and they are out of the crates...All 4 of my dogs can be trusted to run the house by themselves, they do not destroy nor do they mess in the house...
Now for the reason I do this...People who do not believe in crating their dogs I hope you listen carefully....Years ago I had a hound type dog, he was 6 years old and nuetured, very lazy dog...One day I had to run to the store to get some stuff and I let him out of the house as usual to do his buisness...He took his sweet old time walking around and sniffing stuff, did his buisness..I brought him back in the house and left for town...Remember this was a well behaved 6 year old hound that I had since he was 8 weeks old..Never had any problems with him destroying things...When I came home I got the shock of my life...He had chewed through a wall and then started chewing the electrical wires that were in the wall...I was gone a whole 30 minutes and came home to a dead dog...There was no way to "puppy proof" for this...There was no reason to even assume he would do anything like this..I can not even to this day figure out why he did it...IF he had been in a crate while I was gone he never could have done this...I might still have him...So you all can tell me I am cruel for crating my dogs and I can tell you that no matter what you do you can not "puppy proof" for things a dog can and will get themselves into...If anyone has any other suggestions as to how I can keep a dog from chewing another wall open and eating electrical wiring, besides crating a dog, I will glad listen to your comments..
That said, Like I said I love my dogs enough to keep them safe, and if being in a crate more hours than i would like them to be is the way to do it then I am all for it...
Dianne

 

[Boemy]

I do feel crating is often overused. Most dogs can be trained to the point where they are respectful of your furniture and are not destructive when left alone in the house, IMO. As an adult, of course--I wouldn't expect a puppy to be an angel (or safe) when left alone in the entire house. But even then, crating isn't the only option.

My dog was never crated. As a puppy, we would block her in the kitchen when we left by putting up barriers at either doorway (in one case a baby gate and in the other case a card table on its side.) The kitchen was easy to clean when she had accidents. Once she was housetrained and trained not to chew on furniture, she had the run of the house.

I think training a dog to be comfortable in a crate is great, but putting a dog in there for hours on end is excessive and in many cases just for the owner's convenience.

Edit: To answer the original question, I don't see anything wrong with leaving a dog alone during work hours. We're an important part of our dogs' lives and they love to be with us and need attention and love from us, but I think most dogs can handle "alone time" too.

 

[PixieSticksandTricks]

Im cool with everyones opinions personally. As long as their not saying that im being cruel to my dogs by crating them.

 

[sparks19]

LOL well you know what they say about opinions.

I crated Teddy when he was under two years old because I didn't have a choice.

when we got him I didn't work. I lived with my husband in the US. I was home everyday all day. I do not drive therefore I do not go out alone, that and I don't know where I am going round these parts. We had a spare, completely empty room. That is where he stayed when we had to go out. He chewed the windowsill OFF. There were slivers of wood everywhere. But puppies will be puppies. He always had his crate. He would always go and lay in his crate if he was really tired or if he was not feeling well. it was his safe haven.


Then I suddenly had to move back to Canada.... without my husband. I moved into an apartment. A short time after my dad moved into the extra room in the apartment because he sold his house. NOW I have an ENTIRE house crammed into a two bedroom apartment that I can barely afford even with my dads help. Two sets of bills is not fun (we had an apartment in PA and my apartment in Canada). There are only so many drawers you can cram stuff into. There are only so many spaces on so many shelves to put things. My dad lived in that house for 12 + years. that is a lot of crap. There was absolutely NO possible way I could put EVERYTHING out of reach. Including all of my bedding (matress included), Tables, unplug everything in the apartment to prevent cord chewing.... etc etc. I tried leaving Teddy out of his crate while I worked full time. I went through 4 sets of bedding in as many days. I sprayed bitter apple on everything, didnt' work. I tried conditioning him to certain amounts of time alone. he was always good for an hour or two. After that he started to get bored and when he gets bored he uses that hound dog nose to its fullest extent and will find whatever he could to shred. One day I came home to a piece of bedding wrapped around his neck (not tightly thank the lord) and a glass figure that was on the highest shelf in the room. (well out of his reach I assumed as it was almost more than I could reach)

If I was worried about my house getting wrecked I wouldn't have gotten a d@mn dog. and to compare this situation to having children is insanity. I wouldn't leave a 4 or 5 year old child alone in a house or anywhere for that matter (I figure that is the equivalent age to Teddy at the time) I thought about having a dog walker for Teddy or a dog sitter or have someone come over but I didn't know anyone at the time that I trusted. I lived in an apartment full of university students.... one apartment that almost killed Teddy and I by throwing a metal lounge chair off the 16th floor balcony while Teddy was trying to go to the bathroom.

Crating was the best solution for him at the time. He was dangerous to himself when not in the crate. He got a delicioius kong full of hot dogs or something delicious. After the kong he presumably went right to sleep as my landlord (next door neighbour) said he was always quiet. When I would come home he would get an hour run and then come inside to eat after a couple of hours he got to go out for another hour run. He slept free in my bedroom although he doesn't like to share the bed so he had his very own recliner rocker.

I would rather be "cruel" by some standards then come home to find my dog is choked to death because he decided to tear up the matress fabric.

now that Teddy is over 2 years old and can act like an adult int he house alone he does not use the crate. he has free run of the house all day. He can be trusted now as he is not a curious puppy.

 

[Dulce Pit Bull]

I doubt if crateless dogs are the disasters that you are portraying. I think crating is more popular in the US, because people in this country are many times looking for the quick and easy solution to a problem. Rather than spending hours and hours training a dog, throwing it in a crate is a quick alternative. The first time I saw a dog confined to a crate, I thought it was the most bizarre thing I had ever seen . To me it's like hours and hours of time out every day for the animal. I realize that people are going to disagree with my opinion, but nevertheless, that is what I think.... I would try everything under the sun, before I would lock up any dog I had in a crate day after day!

I was actually being sarcastic I was trying to lighten the mood