The Unthinkable has happened...

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#81
Sorry, I am going to be unpopular here but....... one way or the other, the dog has to go. It has bitten your daughter's FACE. I am a dog lover but I love my children more and I am sure you are the same. How will you feel if it happens again? How can you EVER trust the dog around your children again? Next time (and I bet you dollars to doughnuts there will be a next time) it might be her throat. Sorry to be so doom and gloomy but for goodness sake, child versus animal? No contest. However much you love your dog, people are more important, always. Especially children.
 

Barb04

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#82
I wish you and Carey all the best with the trainer. Please keep us updated on how she's doing.
 

B33CPE

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#83
Calamity Kate said:
Sorry, I am going to be unpopular here but....... one way or the other, the dog has to go. It has bitten your daughter's FACE. I am a dog lover but I love my children more and I am sure you are the same. How will you feel if it happens again? How can you EVER trust the dog around your children again? Next time (and I bet you dollars to doughnuts there will be a next time) it might be her throat. Sorry to be so doom and gloomy but for goodness sake, child versus animal? No contest. However much you love your dog, people are more important, always. Especially children.

More people need to be like you, kids get killed by dogs because their parents keep dogs that are known to be aggressive. whether it was a "kill" bite or a "warning" bite doesnt matter a bite is a bite.
 

gapeach

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#84
Noone understands the fact that my child does come first, I am a stay at home mom, trust be my daughter's interests come before anything else. However as I have stated many times before Carey has always been a wonderful dog, especially with children. She is not people aggressive, she loves everyone she meets. We will be working with a behavior trainer on fixing the resource guarding and getting her back in her place in our family. It was a food issue, we do not allow Maggie in the room with Carey while she eats anymore. It's not child versus animal, it's modifying the behavior. You do not know my dog she loves Maggie with all her heart and was treating her as a lower member of our pack, not as a someone to hurt. The two are much more supervised now (they were supervised before also) The food was the issue, not her wanting to attack my child.
 

Carolyn

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#87
Hiya Gapeach how are things going? I don't think anyone is meaning to upset you. I know this must be a horrible heart wrenching time, and very stressful on all of you.

It's just everyone has their own thoughts of what they would do in this situation. I too would not be keeping this dog, she would be euthanased if she were mine. But thats the thing, she isn't mine. We all respect the fact that it's your family and your dog, and you and your family must do what you think is best.

Just try to bear in mind though that we all care, about dogs and people too, especially children :) I don't believe it's downing you in the slightest, rather peoples strong emotions on such an issue. Asking advice on issues like this can bring very strong heated emotions.

All I'm saying is just remember we are all here to help, and because someone has a differing view or choice on what they would do, doesn't mean they are trying to upset you on purpose :)

I wish you all the best, and hope you will keep us updated on your progress, no matter WHAT the end result has to be

Carolyn
 

B33CPE

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#88
Hi Gapeach, i have posted on this thread before and i just wanted to say that i never meant to upset you. It just really angers me when a child gets killed or badly hurt by a dog because the parents are irresponsible, and I think that you are totally being responsible. Good luck.
 

Nerual

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#89
I am not posting this with the intent to push you in any direction regarding Carey, I just want to share with you the story of my beloved dog Mia.

I first saw Mia at the local animal shelter's Adopt-a-Thon weekend where I was volunteering with my 4-H group. She was a beautiful 4 year old, 97 pound St. Bernard/Collie Mix. I fell in love with her and after talking with her owner for over 2 hours I decided that she would fit right into my family and I took her home. Over the next few weeks it became apparent that Mia had severe aggression issues with other dogs, but I had always believed that if you adopt a dog, you adopt all of their issues too. If you would have asked my opinion before I got Mia, I would have told you that I would never put a dog to sleep unless they were in extreme physical pain.

We immediately started working with a trainer on Mia's aggression issues, and although it was always one step foreward and two steps back, she was always devoted to my family including my 3 year old sister, and loved everybody regardless of size or age.

Then, one day I was taking her on a walk and we saw one of my little sister's friends who had met Mia on many previous occasions. But this time was different, the boy bent down in her face and started to growl like a dog and before I could pull Mia back she lunged at his face. Although she did not bite down hard, he had marks above his eyelid and under his chin (if she had bit down, he would have no face left). At this point in my heart I knew that something was wrong, but I was in denial and blamed it on the boy growling like a dog and told myself that Mia didn't mean it (please do not flame me for this, I know now that I was completely and utterly wrong to think this).
Then a few months ago, she started to periodically snap at my little sister (now 5), but I told myself that it was her fault for bothering Mia and would make excuses for her. At this point Mia could not be trusted around any people and when we had visitors she was locked in my room. Then about 3 weeks ago Mia almost dragged my mom off of the front porch trying to get at a little boy who was just walking by and minding his own business.

After this I knew that it was time to put Mia down. It was the hardest decision that I ever had to make, Mia was my constant companion and my main support system when my Dad passed away from lung cancer. But I knew that she was a dangerous dog and that I didn't have the right to put other people and their pets lives at danger. So last week we took her to the vets and put her to the sleep (she was in all her glory at the vets with all the attention she was getting, so at least I know she was happy at the end). I truly believe that there was something wrong with Mia in the head, when she would go after people and other dogs, there was nothing in her eyes and there was no response to anything I said or did.

Even though I am only 16, I know in my heart that it was the right thing to do, no matter how much my 17 year old sister tells me that what I did was wrong and that I gave up on Mia. I gave her 2 years, and by this point I knew it was not going to get any better. I am starting the healing process, but I can not help but feel anger towards Mia's first owner, we talked for over 2 hours and she never mentioned anything about Mia's aggression issues.

I am sorry for such a long post, but I wanted to share Mia's story with you. I would also appreciate it if I don't get any posts telling me everything that I did was wrong, I get enough of that from my sister.

Lauren
 
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RedyreRottweilers

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#90
Lauren, you had to make a very hard decision at a young age.

Regardless of what led up to it, it shows quite a bit of character that you were able to do what had to be done, and also that YOU LEARNED FROM IT.

I will light a candle for your little lost one. Rest assured that she is no longer tortured by the demons inside her that made her behave as she did.
 

Doberluv

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#91
Lauren, you did what any responsible person would do. It was the right thing to do. This dog was a repeat offender. You did what had to be done. Peoples' lives and safety must come first. My heart goes out to you at this hard and painful time.

I don't know how it will be with Carey...if this was a one time thing or not. She may be fine with good behavior modification techniques. But then again....I don't know....I never had a dog who needed that. As I've said, the dogs I had with my babies were completely Ok with them digging their hands in their food, taking a bone out of their mouth, accidentally hurting them occasionally....it didn't matter. Their nature was so sweet and tolerant 100% of the time. If I had a dog who bit my child, I'd not want to risk another bite again. I'm afraid I'd never trust the dog again. But like the others said, I do support you in your efforts to rehabilitate her. And she has been a great dog up to that point. And hope for the very best outcome.
 
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#92
Gapeach - I appreciate your points and believe me, I feel for you and your situation and have no wish to upset you.

However, I think Nerual's story above speaks volumes.

It also worries me when I read or hear of people saying things like you said in your post..... "You do not know my dog she loves Maggie with all her heart and was treating her as a lower member of our pack, not as a someone to hurt."

I'm sorry hun, but dogs do not love people with all their hearts. They do not possess human emotions as we understand them. I know a lot of people will jump on me for this, but anthropomorphising animals often leads to accidents. When she bit your child's face, she didn't think of whether it would hurt her or not, she was acting on instinct and instinct is a very difficult thing to override, however good the training.

I would also remind you that you posted this on a public forum, and getting defensive when you receive an opinion you don't want to hear is a little unfair.

I truly hope all goes well for you all, and that none of your family ever gets hurt again xxxx
 
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RedyreRottweilers

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#93
I have kept my trap shut on this topic because of my anger associated with it.

I spent several days agonizing over the impending death of this dog.

Only to be told, on the morning she was to be euth'd, after I'd written condolence notes and shed a tear or two, that it was not carried out. I was ANGRY when I realized that I had felt these upsetting emotions for no reason, and that the child in this home was still in danger.

It should be noted the ticker in the bottom of GaPeach's signature indicates that another child is on the way.

I would not on a cold day in July trust this dog in my home with an infant for one second. I would bet my house that this dog bites again.

I hope my worries are in vain, but if this were my dog it would not have had a second chance to bite any child, much less my own.
 
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#94
<I hope my worries are in vain, but if this were my dog it would not have had a second chance to bite any child, much less my own.>

Well put.

The thing is, Gapeach, how serious a bite would it have to be, for you to do what you had originally decided to do? For instance, if the child's cheek had been ripped, or maybe her lip? Or her eye injured beyond repair? Because the point is, it was LUCK that none of these things happened. The dog did not think "I love this child, I will not cause TOO much damage, I shall just issue a warning". It could just as easily have been much worse. I'm sorry, but a bite is a bite is a bite. I honestly hope all us pessimists (some would say "realists") are wrong, and that your dog never bites again but what it comes down to is - is it worth the risk?
 

JennSLK

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#95
Personaly I would rehome her in a non child house hold. I would not want to risk my child getting killed
 
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RedyreRottweilers

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#96
Jenn, that is not a good solution.

I don't feel you can EVER completely insulate a dog from children.

There is also liability involved in placing a dog who has a bite history.
 

bubbatd

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#97
This is so sad ---------- even re-homing will not take away the chance of an attack . It's no life for a dog, nor the owner.
 

mrose_s

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#99
gapeach said:
We struggled with the decision of putting her to sleep
I personally, think u have made the right decision, she has food agression, this is a fact. The bite was provoked and she wasnt aiming for Maggie's face ill bet, but it was probably at the right height. like an arm on an adult.
It doesnt sound like an overly agressive attack, it was a natural dog behaviour.
 

mrose_s

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Calamity Kate said:
.

It also worries me when I read or hear of people saying things like you said in your post..... "You do not know my dog she loves Maggie with all her heart and was treating her as a lower member of our pack, not as a someone to hurt."

I'm sorry hun, but dogs do not love people with all their hearts. They do not possess human emotions as we understand them. I know a lot of people will jump on me for this, but anthropomorphising animals often leads to accidents.
im not going to "jump on you" but wanted to point out my own opinion. which is that animals, particularily dogs, are a lot more human than we excpect (or to put it a better way, we are a lot more dog)
I have seen dogs be bored, happy, joyful, sad, sorry, guilty i have seen them smile, laugh, grieve speak, learn, play and most importantly love. I do believe that a dog can feel complete love for a person, an unjudgemental and amazingly sensitive love. And i do feel sorry if you have never felt that your pet, whether it be a dog, cat, cow or horse loves you with all their heart.

love is more than loyalty, loyalty will keep a dog by your side as you struggle through life, love will keep your dog by your side as a car speeds towards ure poor frail body.
 

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