"Find It"! Need some training tips/ideas.

[makka619]

Does anyone here teach find it?

I have gotten a treat rubbed the scent on my hand, hidden it in view of my pup, walked back to him, put my hand up to his nose and waved it forward while saying "find it".

Any other ideas for expanding on this. I don't know what I am after, just want to see what everyone else has done.

Today, I did it with keys. Started training the word 'keys'. Then I put the keys in sight, amongst his toys, came back said "keys". He went, picked out the keys, brought them back.

He is a Beagle. I was wondering can they find keys if they are on a bench, out of sight? What should I train him to do if he knows where they are but can't reach them to bring them back? If I can train him to find them like this, will I need to do it with all of the items he finds, so he never retrieves?

Anyone?

 

[BarkingM*d]

If you are trying to teach some basic scent work, putting keys in a pile of toys (all with scent) and asking the dog to ignore his favourite toys and retrieve a bunch of keys is a neat trick, but I don't think is quite what you are after...

You are close to describing an exercise we used to do in one of our classes. I think it a morph of a UK obedience exercise. We had a 10m x 10m square marked in the corners with flags, and sent the dogs into the square to find and retrieve one article, and then sent them back for a second.

Start by using wooden articles (or honky nuts). These retain scent better than metal objects and dogs tend to prefer the feel of them in their mouths.

Get the dog to first hold/give the article, then retrieve it from a throw, and from the ground ie. put the dog in a sit, wait and place the article 3ft in front and ask the dog to fetch. When you are competently retrieving the article from around 8ft get a friend to place the article a short way from your dog when he is not looking. Cue the command “find it” your dog will probably sight and retrieve the article as that is what we have just been doing anyway. If you have problems here walk forward towards the article and point it out to the dog, returning to your original position for the retrieve. The dog should quickly cotton on what is expected and as the article is placed further away should start using his nose to find the article. Once you are reliably finding and retrieving one article from anywhere in the square you can expand the exercise by introducing a decoy, or adding a second article to find after the first.

 

[makka619]

Thanks Barking Mad this sounds like what I was after.

Honkey nuts hehe, never heard of them but I will look into them or something a little more comfortable to hold.

Just to clarify do you tell the dog "find it" and give them a scent of what they are to find? Or are they just used to retrieving the same object that they associate find it.

Do you ever teach the dog the name of objects and say "find keys" for example..? I was hoping to teach names of some objects, so the dog can find them when they are hidden and lost and know what to look for without having a scent to tell them.

 

[BarkingM*d]

Honkey nuts hehe, never heard of them but I will look into them or something a little more comfortable to hold.

Large gum nuts (from a Marri tree). They're a nice size/shape, and blend into the ground so the dog has to use that nose.

Just to clarify do you tell the dog "find it" and give them a scent of what they are to find? Or are they just used to retrieving the same object that they associate find it.

As you are back chaining the exercise from the retrieve you have the association with the article (and your scent which is actually what you are asking the dog to use). If the dog can’t see the thing most will naturally use their nose to find it. You can cue "find it" to the dog when the nose is down and he is working.

Do you ever teach the dog the name of objects and say "find keys" for example..? I was hoping to teach names of some objects, so the dog can find them when they are hidden and lost and know what to look for without having a scent to tell them.

I have only ever asked my dogs to find human (my) scent so the objects may change but from the dog’s point of view it’s the same exercise.

I do remember reading an article somewhere about a really smart border collie that could identify and retrieve any of about 20 of his toys by name...

 

[Lizmo]

I tought Lizzie "Find It" too!

Here is what I did .......

First I would have a treat....Have Lizzie in a "Sit Stay". Then I would trow the treat about maybe 5-10 feet away from me/her. Then I would give her release work..."okay" and then she would run to the treat to get it...Now right before or as she is running and sniffing to find the treat I would "Point my hand and finger in the direction of the treat and where I wanted her to go and get it"...while saying "Find It Lizzie"!

Now I would do this about 30- 40 times before adding distance to this!

Hope it helps!!

BTW-I am now able to use toys with Lizzie and say like if you throw a toy and they did not see where it went but you showed them the toy so they know what they are looking for....You can say "Find It" and they should be able to sniff on the ground and find the scent and go Find It!

 

[makka619]

Thanks Barking M*d. I am going to see if I can somehow get my hands on Honkey Nuts, they sound like just the right thing to use. I see they are from W.A.! Good news I thought they might be from another country!! I will ask around, should easily be able to get a friend to send a few.

 

[makka619]

I tought Lizzie "Find It" too!

Here is what I did .......

First I would have a treat....Have Lizzie in a "Sit Stay". Then I would trow the treat about maybe 5-10 feet away from me/her. Then I would give her release work..."okay" and then she would run to the treat to get it...Now right before or as she is running and sniffing to find the treat I would "Point my hand and finger in the direction of the treat and where I wanted her to go and get it"...while saying "Find It Lizzie"!

Now I would do this about 30- 40 times before adding distance to this!

Hope it helps!!

BTW-I am now able to use toys with Lizzie and say like if you throw a toy and they did not see where it went but you showed them the toy so they know what they are looking for....You can say "Find It" and they should be able to sniff on the ground and find the scent and go Find It!

Thanks for this Lizmo.

Do you mean you showed them the toy before or after you threw it? Say it was before, and they didn't see you throw it, do you just mean you say find it and they understand what it is to look for.

 

[Julie]

Since Rocket was trained in narc detection.....and we have training aids,
I started Charlie on narc detection too. Lol He is great at it.
He already knows what "Find the ??" means.
He knows three things so far. "Find the bird" (when dove hunting)
"Find the mouse" (I hate mice running in my house) he caught on quickly to find them and alert.) It is really true.
And the last thing: "Find the dope" (which is actually just a rolled towel that smells of marijuanna)And this is his favorite, he has found it everytime and alerts by scratching. My husband mentioned that he could get Charlie certified in narc detection (if he does as well finding other drugs too) Then he could be used as a backup for the dept.

I am thinking of starting tracking (for people) with him as he catches on quickly and I could get him certified in April if he is up to par.

And he does actually know what I am asking him to find by saying the different words.

Good Luck......It is so much fun teaching things like this, and a beagle has a great nose!

 

[makka619]

Yay that is an inspiring post Julie. I would love to be able to get Gordy into doing some detection work of some sort, I think he would really enjoy it. How does that work? Can anyone apply and put them through a couse/exam? I really have no idea about that and how you get into those sort of programs.

 

[Julie]

I think anyone can get into tracking, but I believe you have to be a law enforcement officer to cert in narc detection....... I think. Lol
I believe I am taking Charlie with Rocket when Rocket goes for certs in April.
So I can get a better understanding in handling my own dog and not just watching the officers and others handling theirs.
I know there are some tracking people that cert with WVPCA along with the officers. That is just for WV though. I am not sure about other places.

 

[makka619]

Ah I see. Think I will just stick to training it for home game/excercise.

 

[BarkingM*d]

He already knows what "Find the ??" means.
He knows three things so far. "Find the bird" (when dove hunting)
"Find the mouse" (I hate mice running in my house) he caught on quickly to find them and alert.) It is really true.
And the last thing: "Find the dope" (which is actually just a rolled towel that smells of marijuanna)And this is his favorite, he has found it everytime and alerts by scratching.

And he does actually know what I am asking him to find by saying the different words.

Hi Julie, the things you have described all require scent work but are quite situational… Do you ask your dogs to discriminate in a formal setting? eg. have say a dove and dope hidden in an area and ask the dog to indicate one or other article depending on command?

I thought generally where scent work was concerned you only trained for a single set of scents be it explosive/drug/quarantine/people/cadaver etc..

I think anyone can get into tracking, but I believe you have to be a law enforcement officer to cert in narc detection....... I think.

Any dog registered with the ANKC can compete in tracking trials (including associates) and there are lots of tracking clubs around Australia. There is a link to the rules/regulations for ANKC tracking here which will give you an idea of what is required. When you reach a certain level I think you can get involved in SES, and get your dog certified for SES searches.

I have only ever done very basic scenting exercises with my dogs, but tracking is something I plan to have go at when we are too old and decrepit to compete in Agility... LOL. I’ve got a heap of articles on tracking/theory of scent if you would like a copy.

 

[Julie]

Hi Julie, the things you have described all require scent work but are quite situational… Do you ask your dogs to discriminate in a formal setting? eg. have say a dove and dope hidden in an area and ask the dog to indicate one or other article depending on command?

I thought generally where scent work was concerned you only trained for a single set of scents be it explosive/drug/quarantine/people/cadaver etc..


Any dog registered with the ANKC can compete in tracking trials (including associates) and there are lots of tracking clubs around Australia. There is a link to the rules/regulations for ANKC tracking here which will give you an idea of what is required. When you reach a certain level I think you can get involved in SES, and get your dog certified for SES searches.

I have only ever done very basic scenting exercises with my dogs, but tracking is something I plan to have go at when we are too old and decrepit to compete in Agility... LOL. I’ve got a heap of articles on tracking/theory of scent if you would like a copy.

Yes everything is scent work. I personally believe a dog can distingush between several commands and follow thru and find the specific scent. As I said Rocket is certified in tracking, narc detec, apprehension, and handler protection. There are two different commands we use for tracking and narc detection. In tracking she is looking for the human scent she was imprinted on at the start of the track. In narc detection she is searching for many smells that are all narcotics. Given the command she tracks for people or searches for narcs.

I am going to do a test.....Lol
Since I just killed a mouse, and I have the scented rag........I will let you know the outcome. I wish I had a dove........But the test will be between the mouse and the scented rag.

And since I am just starting out with Charlie, I really am just winging it. Lol
Yes I would love to read.....

Be back later with some results.:yikes:

 

[Julie]

I wish I could get this on video......
Charlie was set up in the kitchen with a dead mouse, and the marijuania scented rag. I asked him to find the mouse........he did.
Then I asked him to find the dope.........he did.
I repeated this scenerio three times not changing the places of the scents.
He was outside about 5 minutes inbetween. He found each thing I asked of him without fail........

I am going to continue my "experiments" in different areas.........but for now he seems to distingush between the two scents with the command I give.

Dogs are soooo smart!

And this is so interesting.

 

[makka619]

Wow that is awesome Julie. Well done! Does Charlie try to eat the mouse??! Keep us updated with all of your experiments. I really love this stuff.

I wouldn't mind learning more about tracking. Barking, if that information you have is web sites I would love to take a look too. Or if you know of any sites that would be really helpful to give me a clearer understanding of it and techniques that would be great.

 

[Julie]

I hid the mouse in a cardboard box inside of a bucket under my table.:yikes:
And yea, Charlie did get to the mouse and picked it up....... But I told him "out" and he dropped it immeditately. And I gave him his tennis ball for a job well done and some pettings and "good dogs". He was very happy.

 

[BarkingM*d]

Yes, dogs are very smart! Well done... I'm impressed. It answers my question fairly conclusively.

The fascinating thing about scent work is you are placing your trust in the dog because they are the only one in the team with the equipment to do the task.

It would be an interesting to build on your experiment and get a friend to lay out half a dozen boxes in a row and place the mouse/drugs in one of each with yourself and the dog out of sight. When you are issuing the command you will also be blind to the locations so rely totally on the dog. If for each iteration of the test the boxes are shuffled the locations of the loaded boxes will always be unknown to the two of you.

I guess that is getting close to a true to life exercise for a drug detector dog. Asking him to find drugs and ignore dead mouse, but quite outstanding if by simply changing the command you can get him to ignore the drugs, and find the dead mouse.

 

[Julie]

that would be a great test.
Lol, But I don't have the mouse anymore........I HAD to dispose of it.:yikes:
And really I hope I don't get another one for along time.

We use boxes for the demonstrations that hubby does with Rocket for the schools.

Charlie is really new to the marijuanna scent anyway. So even though he seems to be very promising... I think I will continue to work him on that. Because I do want to add other drug "smells" later. I would love to get a video of him finding that rag it really impresses me that after only a few days of fooling around with it he can find it everytime (actually he did it the first day everytime). I also have the kids or hubby hide it so I don't know where it is at. I really need to find a few places to practice that is unfamilar to Charlie and see how that turns out.

Then later I would like to start on tracking and have him doing that before certs in april. I hope I can keep up... Lol

Thanks....it's been fun!

 

[DanL]

Julie, we're starting Gunnar in narc detection. My trainer is a K9 cop who is certified for training it and is interested in testing him out. Since he knows he's obedient, he said thats half the battle. We've started the towel stuff, just no drugs in it yet, more to get him used to it- playing with it, hiding it from him, etc. He goes crazy when I break it out. I've done "search" stuff with him a lot, both indoors and outdoors, with toys and sticks. I'll put him in a down/stay, and then hide the object somewhere in the house where he can't see, or outside on the other side of the yard out of his sight. I go back to him, release him and tell him "search". He can find whatever I hid in literally seconds. Sometimes a minute or 2 if I really hide it.

With the towel I started hiding it in the couch cushions, in the kitchen cabinets, etc. I take him along and show him around the room until we get to where the object is, and he'll stop and either stick his nose in the couch to get it, or with the cabinets, he sat and barked.

As far as the original question, I can't even remember how we started doing it, I think what happened was I threw a stick into our stick pile in the yard, and he ran after it and retrieved the same stick I threw. I was amazed he found the exact stick in a pile of hundreds, so we started playing that game with him and went from there.

 

[Julie]

For those interested, I made a video of Charlie finding his towel (with marijuanna scent on it). Don't laugh at my lousy attempt at video editing LOL. I am new at that too. The DVD I made is so much better because I had to reduce the quality to get this thing uploaded.....Yes I have dialup .
My camcorder is not digital either, Add that to my christmas wish list too. I still think you can see how much he loves doing this.

Sorry for the crappy quality!

Charlie Training

You can still hear his nose "working" even after my editing attempts.