Fact or fiction?

[Catsi]

It is the widely held view here (where I live) that dogs should not be allowed to mouth at all. Reason? Because when excited they can't control their mouths and it could lead to an accidental bite.

Is this really true?

One of our favourite games is 'find my hand'. Rightly or wrongly, we taught her from an early age what was acceptable mouthing and what wasn't.

I do not have a pushy, mouthy dog and I have never been bitten, accidentally or otherwise.

She understands context I think, because there are only certain situations that she will initiate this sort of play and only certain situations that I will initiate this sort of play. I don't have her playing tug and all of a sudden she wants to mouth me. She doesn't walk into the kitchen and start mouthing me. She doesn't jump up and mouth me on a walk.

So is it safe to say that if you are very consistent, your dog will understand the rules of the game? My girl understands 'gentle' commands (from puppyhood), 'leave it' for pauses in the game and 'that'll do' which is really my off switch for all training. And I have never been hurt by her. My parents play this game too, as does one of my brothers. My other brother and sister have no interest in this game when they visit, so don't play it. She never expects them to either. (My siblings are all adults too, btw).

So what is the general view here? Does this play encourage inappropriate behaviour? My girl is fear aggressive, never bitten, but has the potential to. I don't think she would bite because we play this particular game. I truly believe that she knows the difference between play and aggression. And why wouldn't she, dogs have been doing this for centuries?

 

[Maxy24]

I think playing like this actually teaches the dog to have incredible control of the jaws, reducing the chance of a damaging bite. Of course if there are no rules in the game, and the dog is allowed to bite as hard as he wants during the game it could lead to problems. But if the dog is only allowed to mouth gently during the games and the game stops when he bites too hard, he will learn exactly how hard he can use his jaws, and will become very aware of his bite pressure.

As for randomly coming up and mouthing, again it's a matter of rules. If you allow the dog to ask to play in this way, yes it could become a problem. This is the type of game that you must initiate or else yes, he could come up and mouth to try and get you to play. I have no problem with allowing a dog to ask for a game of tug, or ball (so long as they learn a cue meaning "not right now" and stop, otherwise they'll get mighty annoying) but asking for rough play could be much more annoying or potentially a bigger problem if they ask someone other than yourself (like a visitor who freaks out because she thinks the dog is being aggressive, not playful).

So I see no problem with the game so long as there are rules to keep from inappropriate solicitation and play biting that actually does damage. You mentioned your dog is fear aggressive, if it is a fear of strangers then don't let visitors play roughly with the dog, you may have trouble telling if the dog is play growling or seriously growling at them, plus the person could do something during the play that the dog suddenly finds intimidating and may bite. if the dog tends to be hand shy then rough play could suddenly scare the dog and cause a bite. I didn't know the context of your dog's fear so just wanted to mention those things.

 

[Lizmo]

IMO, it's up to the owners. You know your dog best. If your dog is bitting your hand uncrontrolably, then yeah, it's best to stop that game. If it's a game you've played for years and your dogs know the rules and obey the commands when given (like a 'gentle') then it's probably fine.

Some like it, some don't. Some find it promotes control, some don't. Just personally opinion, IMHO. hehe

 

[Criosphynx]

I think its a valuable tool in teaching the dog how hard is too hard to bite. If there are rules and its not a problem, I don't see an issue with it.

 

[Catsi]

Ok, so not everyone would like the idea (but then, when do we all 100% when it comes to our dogs lol).

But from the responses it is not the foolhardy no- no that some people would have me believe. I was a little worried about posting this, thinking I may very well be flamed, but I needed to know and I have a tough skin. I'll admit to being a little relieved though, because it is one of my favourite games.

I completely understand the importance of the rules in this game. I have rules for many games, like tug, fetch so it common sense that I need clear rules for our mouthing game.

I wouldn't let a stranger play this game, even if she did warm up to them quickly. I have pretty strict rules for my dog and for visitors who want to interact, if not I just manage it another way (separation). I wouldn't want a visitor in my home to feel uncomfortable with my dog (playing or not) and I wouldn't want my dog to feel confused either. I basically do not want to put her in a position where she feels she needs to bite. She isn't one to initiate play whenever, wherever and with whomever, so I think we have it covered in this regard.

Do you all feel it is very important to always initiate this game? It sounds weird, but we always play this on the bed or the lounge. No other place, it's just how it worked out - I don't think it was intentional. About 85% of the time I initiate, but there are occasions where she is in a cheeky mood and may make the funny noises that are associated with the game and she may jump on me in order to start the game. No mouthing at that point, but I know what she wants. Do I play or do I not?

 

[Ratboy]

I've had a couple of dogs that used to lightly chew on my hand, and they never had any problem controlling it. The one used to do the same thing on my cat's head, and he loved it, and would jam his head into the dog's open mouth. He would come out with a head full of drool, and usually would shake his head and stick it right back in. The dog could have killed him at any time, but he was always very gentle with him. Both dogs would come up and just nudge my hand and if I put it out palm up, they would mouth it, if it was palm down, they would usually lick it and then leave.

I don't have any scars on my hands from the dogs, but the cat probably put a hundred of them on my hands and arms He played ROUGH. A twenty five pound cat can do a lot of damage just having fun.

 

[Dekka]

If you look up bite inhibition, teaching dogs to be gentle is much safer than 'no bite' (though some people will continue on to no bite, which is fine) But dogs need to know that humans are 'delicate' that way if they are hurt, scared etc and they do bite, there is a much less chance they will do damage.

 

[Maura]

I think the no mouthing is a simple safety rule many people incorporate to avoid a worst case scenario. Some people play too rough with a puppy/dog, not encouraging a gentle mouth, but only encouraging teeth. I met a young girl yesterday whose father played roughly with a chow/rottie/shepherd mix puppy and by age three the dog was put down because he could not differentiate between acceptable mouthing and hard mouthing/biting. A real shame, but I think it is safer to simply have people NOT play teeth games. Granted the guy was an idiot, and people on this forum are much more dog savvy.

I think anyone who is concerned enough about their puppy/dog to do a minor amount of research into bite inhibition, teeth games, etc., aren't going to make the same mistake.

 

[Cheetah]

I always teach bite inhibition first, and THEN advance to no mouthing. Much safer IMO than just no biting ever.

 

[ihartgonzo]

I play biteyhands all of the time with my dogs, my friends' dogs, and all of the puppies I watch and help raise. Dogs LOVE playing biteyhands, and it is the best way to teach a puppy to be gentle with their teeth on skin, by far. It also teaches a puppy that hands on their face/body applying all different types of pressure are a positive, fun thing.

I think it's important that the person always initiates biteyhands (and play in general, imo) and ends it. I do not want my dogs mouthing me whenever they feel like it. Definitely not on a walk... one of my pet peeves is dogs who mouth your hands on walks. D: So annoying.

 

[Mjjean]

I own a Pit and an Amreican Bulldog. These are large and powerful breeds that already have a negative press image and that many people fear. Last year a Pit was shot and killed in Texas because a cop passing by thought it was attacking its owner when they were really engaging in play that involved mouthing. I have had neighbors tell me that I should get rid of them because they are dangerous even though they have never even barked at people passing by or shown any animal aggression. I also have children and they have friends who come over.

For me, I decided to end all play when doggie teeth touch skin when raising my AB and my brother did the same when raising the Pit that I now own. Neither of them mouths at all as adults. We also don't engage in roughhouse type play. The play rules are no teeth, no jumping, no roughness and all play ends when they get overexcited. It just seemed a better safe than sorry type thing.

 

[Tankstar]

I let Blaze mouth my hand in play, if I intiate it. Such as putting my hand in his mouth and grabbing his jaw. I know my dog though and KNOW how he will respond. He then goes on with grabbing my hand, as I wave it all around. its a game. as soon as I say "OK" it ends. simple as that.

I think it depends on owner and the dog. You need to know your dog.

I wouldnt do it to just any dog, ever. I do it to my friends chi, as I have known him since 8 weeks and he is now 9. I see him almost daily, and know his attitude and play style, thats how he plase and Im fine with it. again i start and end it.