Crate Rant!

[frostfell]

Maybe I'd feel differently if I saw a dog actually crated 22 hours a day.

Sadly, I know people like this breaks my heart because its such a vicious cycle. when she lets them out theyre so frantic to stretch their legs that they knock people over, break ****, bounce off the walls, so she cant even handle them so back in the crate they go. all day, all night, all the time. they get 2 potty breaks a day and when the weather is nice they get to be in a 5x5 kennel outside..... huzzah

 

[Emily]

wait what? your dog spends 23 hours and 40 minutes a day in the crate and is only outside it for 20 minutes?

Yeah... that was sarcasm.

 

[PWCorgi]

wait what? your dog spends 23 hours and 40 minutes a day in the crate and is only outside it for 20 minutes?

Yes. Is that bad? She seems fine! She gets out longer on days that we train or when we go to the park.

 

[Emily]

Yes. Is that bad? She seems fine! She gets out longer on days that we train or when we go to the park.

You're so bad.... :rofl1:

 

[Beanie]

Yes. Is that bad? She seems fine! She gets out longer on days that we train or when we go to the park.

Like 40 minutes on the weekends then? That's totally fine.

 

[Opal]

Krissy, I don't know you or your situation but from what you've described (in my opinion), you're using a crate optimally for your circumstances. The day-to-day you described, implies to me that the time you spend with your dogs is quality interaction. The energy and mischievousness, you say is NOT a result of being kept in a crate for too long and I absolutely believe you. My dogs are high energy too, despite my efforts to wear them out through training and exercise. And they're goofy buggers sometimes too, they're dogs!


Emily, I have nothing against people who use crates. I have a huge problem with people who overuse them at the expense of their dog, specifically puppies, in this context. I'm not a vet. Vet's freak me out and seem all too eager at making me broke at least once a year. Just because I'm not a vet, doesn't mean I can't recognize a dog who is physically unhealthy. Right now, one of my dogs is crated. They have been crated for an hour, give or take. I'm about to put my coat on and go for a hike. Obviously, I would be a gigantic hypocrite if I didn't readily admit that crates definitely make life easier for dog owners and certainly can be used as a training aid (for a whole bunch of stuff, not even related to resting in a crate!). You mentioned you were totally baffled at what I was ranting about, I have a feeling I may have "missed the mark", with many of the posters in this thread. However, this person seemed to "catch my drift" and summed it up nicely:

I've been uncomfortable with how long people keep puppies, especially really young ones, in crates. Like 8 week old puppies being in one for nine hours straight. And that case was not a case of an ignorant dog owner. I just don't think that can be healthy. Like any tool, it can be abused. It can also be incredibly handy and work fine.

Oko and frostfell, I'm SO SORRY that you know EXACTLY what I'm talking about.....

 

[Emily]

Emily, I have nothing against people who use crates. I have a huge problem with people who overuse them at the expense of their dog, specifically puppies, in this context. I'm not a vet. Vet's freak me out and seem all too eager at making me broke at least once a year. Just because I'm not a vet, doesn't mean I can't recognize a dog who is physically unhealthy. Right now, one of my dogs is crated. They have been crated for an hour, give or take. I'm about to put my coat on and go for a hike. Obviously, I would be a gigantic hypocrite if I didn't readily admit that crates definitely make life easier for dog owners and certainly can be used as a training aid (for a whole bunch of stuff, not even related to resting in a crate!). You mentioned you were totally baffled at what I was ranting about, I have a feeling I may have "missed the mark", with many of the posters in this thread. However, this person seemed to "catch my drift" and summed it up nicely:

Sorry, you're confusing me with another poster. I never asked if you were a vet nor did I mention being "baffled."

 

[Red Chrome]

Sadly, I know people like this breaks my heart because its such a vicious cycle. when she lets them out theyre so frantic to stretch their legs that they knock people over, break ****, bounce off the walls, so she cant even handle them so back in the crate they go. all day, all night, all the time. they get 2 potty breaks a day and when the weather is nice they get to be in a 5x5 kennel outside..... huzzah

Isn't this the breeder of your dog that does this? Didn't you place 2 dogs with her?

 

[frostfell]

Isn't this the breeder of your dog that does this? Didn't you place 2 dogs with her?

do you have Alzheimers or short term memory loss or something? this is possibly the sixth time you have asked me this exact question, and each time i answer it

 

[Fran101]

Hey, you've got your opinion.
Frankly, in my opinion.. I'd rather see this new trend of people keeping their dogs/puppies in crate, A MILLION TIMES OVER, than I would of people keeping their dogs/puppies in the yard 24/7 (a much more common way of dealing with dogs)

my heart does not ache for dogs/puppies that spend 10 hours a day in a crate, dogs are adaptable,people do what they can. At least when they come home.. the dog is let out, the dog is inside and safe, they spend time with the dog.. they have to I mean, it's in their house.

If you think the alternative to people crating their unruly dogs/puppies are people quitting their jobs and putting the training hours in and everyone lives happily ever after you are very much mistaken.. I've seen the alternative 90% of the time, it's the dog in a yard forgotten, or a dog in a shelter.

Like any tool, crates can be used or misused. But at least people are trying, dogs/puppies are INSIDE and safe.


My 2 cents.

 

[Red Chrome]

do you have Alzheimers or short term memory loss or something? this is possibly the sixth time you have asked me this exact question, and each time i answer it

I was just checking, making sure I was thinking of the right person. It is sad, especially when a breeder provides the person with puppies and then they are crated their whole life only to make more puppies!!! Yay, BYBs are awesome!!! *drenched in sarcasm*

 

[SpringerLover]

Yes. Is that bad? She seems fine! She gets out longer on days that we train or when we go to the park.

I thought it was a rule that on weekends, she had to have 30 minutes out. You're SHORTING HER TEN WHOLE MINUTES!

 

[Opal]

Sorry, you're confusing me with another poster. I never asked if you were a vet nor did I mention being "baffled."

You're right, I'm sorry
I should have double checked. I have a terrible time with names IRL too.

 

[Emily]

You're right, I'm sorry
I should have double checked. I have a terrible time with names IRL too.

No prob, it happens.

 

[Beanie]

Sorry, you're confusing me with another poster. I never asked if you were a vet nor did I mention being "baffled."

She confused you with like three different posters LOL.

 

[Dogs6]

I was the person you hate. My 10 week old puppy was crated pretty much 23 hours a day. She hated it and we hated it but it was necessary. She injured her leg and needed strict crate rest. No amount of toys with her would keep her calm. She was the psycho puppy who would launch herself at anything and off anything, which is how she got the injury in the first place!

However now she's 2 years old, never crated, has very nice muscle tone and shows no symptoms of sensory deprivation. Maybe before judging these people as horrible owners you should make sure theres not a genuine reason that they have their puppies on lock down. They probably feel bad enough as it is. I know I did when I had to listen to my puppy screaming in frustration when the other dogs where out playing.

 

[Opal]

I was the person you hate. My 10 week old puppy was crated pretty much 23 hours a day. She hated it and we hated it but it was necessary. She injured her leg and needed strict crate rest. No amount of toys with her would keep her calm. She was the psycho puppy who would launch herself at anything and off anything, which is how she got the injury in the first place!

However now she's 2 years old, never crated, has very nice muscle tone and shows no symptoms of sensory deprivation. Maybe before judging these people as horrible owners you should make sure theres not a genuine reason that they have their puppies on lock down. They probably feel bad enough as it is. I know I did when I had to listen to my puppy screaming in frustration when the other dogs where out playing.

You're right!!!
Oh my sweet goodness, yes, yes YES!
If you were advised by your vet to keep your dog crated, while it recovered, then you were obviously NOT keeping her crated, simply because it was easier then training her. I am referring to people who keep their dogs crated the majority of the day, for all of their young lives, only because it's easier then spending time with them. I maintain, that cannot be healthy for a young puppy's development.

To be honest, I'm kind of surprised at the amount of people who are unfamiliar with this kind of circumstance. The problem does exist.

Is it really that inconceivable, that a growing number of people are inappropriately using this tool at the expense of their pets? Have we not seen that trend before, in regards to training equipment? Should we do nothing until it's a more obvious problem? What is an appropriate way to use a crate, more importantly, at which point can we agree that a crate is being misused?

 

[Opal]

She confused you with like three different posters LOL.

I'm sure if I ever have a couple thousand posts under my belt, I'll be more familiar with the regulars and less inclined to mush you all together. Sorry if it bothered you!

I'll try to use the quote button more often....

 

[BostonBanker]

To be honest, I'm kind of surprised at the amount of people who are unfamiliar with this kind of circumstance. The problem does exist.

Is it really that inconceivable, that a growing number of people are inappropriately using this tool at the expense of their pets? Have we not seen that trend before, in regards to training equipment? Should we do nothing until it's a more obvious problem? What is an appropriate way to use a crate, more importantly, at which point can we agree that a crate is being misused?

I think for me (and again, no, I really have never seen or even heard of the issue), I can see where it may be a concern, but it is so far down my list of worries about how people raise dogs that it quite simply takes a back seat. I worry about people who are alpha rolling their puppies. I worry about people who make their puppies suffer the rude onslaught of every dog at the dog park because they were told to "socialize" it. I worry about people who think rewarding their young dog's nervousness around strangers is "teaching him to be protective". I worry about people who don't take their puppies out at all until they are older because they worry about vaccinations, and I worry about people who don't vaccinate at all because they heard the hype and went overboard without researching. I worry about people who get the wrong dog because it is cool or it is popular or it is pretty, and you just know both the people and dogs are going to suffer. I worry, like Fran mentioned, about the people who get a dog and it lives outside with minimal contact. I worry about people who get dogs for sports and then rotate through them every year because they aren't up to snuff. I worry about people who hear "neutering is bad" and won't do it, but are completely unprepared for owning an intact dog.

It isn't that I think anyone should keep a puppy in a crate all the time with no contact for the sake of ease. If that person shows up in my life, I'd absolutely work to change how they lived with their dog. I just can't get myself very wound up about it when I personally don't see it happening. Especially when I do definitely see the opposite problem happening, with people not properly confining their dogs for their own safety.

 

[Opal]

Thank you for the thoughtful post.
I agree with you, wholeheartedly, on pretty much everything.
I also agree that it does sit fairly low on the priority list when it comes to educating pet-owners who don't know any better. But I believe in a few years, pet professionals will take note of this growing issue as we see more and more dogs become the subjects of over-crating.