Yea, most places dont have titles its just 1st place that counts so your running against say 350 dogs in your class then you need a 1st there not qualifiy or anything so everyhting is down to speed. I personaly think this is why the US never does well in world events cause there use to training for diffrent things to the rest of the world.
Agility Tips
- Thread starter Mirg8101992
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T
Wow..what a difference in agility!
I personally fear for those dogs. If they aren't taught accuracy and safe ways to approach obstacles,.. there is a big chance for danger and injuries.
I guess there are no contact rules? Dogs don't have to hit a zone on the contact obstacles for safety reasons?
Note: Here in America, everyone imaginable competes in agility. People with basset hounds, pugs, newfoundlands, st bernards, and I've even seen a great dane. Many many people here in america, including myself, only do it for the pure pleasure of being a team with my dog. There IS alot of competitiveness, but just your random person goes out with their older pet and start agility. I think that Is what is so great about american agility competitions. It really does encourage a good owner/pet team.
I personally fear for those dogs. If they aren't taught accuracy and safe ways to approach obstacles,.. there is a big chance for danger and injuries.
I guess there are no contact rules? Dogs don't have to hit a zone on the contact obstacles for safety reasons?
Note: Here in America, everyone imaginable competes in agility. People with basset hounds, pugs, newfoundlands, st bernards, and I've even seen a great dane. Many many people here in america, including myself, only do it for the pure pleasure of being a team with my dog. There IS alot of competitiveness, but just your random person goes out with their older pet and start agility. I think that Is what is so great about american agility competitions. It really does encourage a good owner/pet team.
So, there are no classes separating the novice dogs from the advanced ones?
My Border Collie is my first serious (MACH-level or higher, hopefully!) agility dog and I'm just doing what works for us as a team. Speed isn't our problem - accuracy is - so while he is still young I am teaching him to take his time and do things right. Maybe it takes your dogs 2 minutes to learn how to run correctly, but mine is a speed demon and would just as soon leap off the top of the a-frame than be bothered with trivial things like contacts and uh, mortality.
Anyway, all dogs are different but regardless, I think it's a poor suggestion to tell a person with a PUPPY to "forget accuracy" in training. Like IliamnasQuest said, it's a balance of accuracy and speed, with both being equal in importance. If you teach a puppy to just blow through the course, knock bars and miss contacts, you are going to be SCREWED when the pup matures and you try to compete. Jmo, of course!
My Border Collie is my first serious (MACH-level or higher, hopefully!) agility dog and I'm just doing what works for us as a team. Speed isn't our problem - accuracy is - so while he is still young I am teaching him to take his time and do things right. Maybe it takes your dogs 2 minutes to learn how to run correctly, but mine is a speed demon and would just as soon leap off the top of the a-frame than be bothered with trivial things like contacts and uh, mortality.
Anyway, all dogs are different but regardless, I think it's a poor suggestion to tell a person with a PUPPY to "forget accuracy" in training. Like IliamnasQuest said, it's a balance of accuracy and speed, with both being equal in importance. If you teach a puppy to just blow through the course, knock bars and miss contacts, you are going to be SCREWED when the pup matures and you try to compete. Jmo, of course!
Yes there are classes seperating dogs but to be a diffrent level its only 1st places that matter there is no urm points or anything like that just first places.
Its not a poor suggestion to tell some one to forget accuracy i train prob 300 dogs a week to do agility think i sit there making them do stupid things on contacts think not. Its about putting in v slight accuracy after you have maximum speed and when you put accuracy talking 1.4-1.6 second dog walks not stopped 2.3 second things that are usless.
Its not a poor suggestion to tell some one to forget accuracy i train prob 300 dogs a week to do agility think i sit there making them do stupid things on contacts think not. Its about putting in v slight accuracy after you have maximum speed and when you put accuracy talking 1.4-1.6 second dog walks not stopped 2.3 second things that are usless.
Ah, okay. I was under the impression that all dogs were just lumped in together in one competition!
Different strokes for different folks What you view as stupid will save my dog from a lot of penalties for missing contacts, and the time that it costs him to be accurate can be made up for in his ground speed and tight turns.
Btw - you ARE risking your dog's safety if you want to teach a pup to run at full speed on contact obstacles without first teaching the pup to be comfortable with doing it at its own speed and doing it CORRECTLY. What do you do if a dog falls off, or jumps right over a a contact zone and winds up hurting itself?
Different strokes for different folks
What you view as stupid will save my dog from a lot of penalties for missing contacts, and the time that it costs him to be accurate can be made up for in his ground speed and tight turns.Btw - you ARE risking your dog's safety if you want to teach a pup to run at full speed on contact obstacles without first teaching the pup to be comfortable with doing it at its own speed and doing it CORRECTLY. What do you do if a dog falls off, or jumps right over a a contact zone and winds up hurting itself?
T
Perhaps US agility is different than UK agility, just as we have already discovered?
I've seen one too many dogs be injured because of their owners pushing WAY too hard for speed, speed, speed. Heck, even when the owners DO try to keep the dog's safety in mind and put emphasis on accuracy and safety, dogs still get hurt. One of my favorite dogs that is a regular at my clubs trials got injured this weekend. It is always sad... I sure hope it isn't serious. That dog was a fun, happy, agility-loving dog.
I've seen one too many dogs be injured because of their owners pushing WAY too hard for speed, speed, speed. Heck, even when the owners DO try to keep the dog's safety in mind and put emphasis on accuracy and safety, dogs still get hurt. One of my favorite dogs that is a regular at my clubs trials got injured this weekend. It is always sad... I sure hope it isn't serious. That dog was a fun, happy, agility-loving dog.
RD said:
Ah, okay. I was under the impression that all dogs were just lumped in together in one competition!
Different strokes for different folks What you view as stupid will save my dog from a lot of penalties for missing contacts, and the time that it costs him to be accurate can be made up for in his ground speed and tight turns.
Btw - you ARE risking your dog's safety if you want to teach a pup to run at full speed on contact obstacles without first teaching the pup to be comfortable with doing it at its own speed and doing it CORRECTLY. What do you do if a dog falls off, or jumps right over a a contact zone and winds up hurting itself?
Different strokes for different folks
What you view as stupid will save my dog from a lot of penalties for missing contacts, and the time that it costs him to be accurate can be made up for in his ground speed and tight turns.Btw - you ARE risking your dog's safety if you want to teach a pup to run at full speed on contact obstacles without first teaching the pup to be comfortable with doing it at its own speed and doing it CORRECTLY. What do you do if a dog falls off, or jumps right over a a contact zone and winds up hurting itself?
The reason i said was i dont start any agility training until 10 months was due to not training puppys agility at all.
T
If that is the way you choose to train, yes, I'd agree not to train a puppy like that.
But, over here the general agility competitors population do encourage early training with puppies, even though that training may only consist of teaching the puppy to walk on low planks, step through a ladder to encourage hind end coordination, play on a wobbly board to encourage confidence when not on solid, non-moving ground, or just teaching the puppy how to enjoy agility tunnels. Might as well get an early start on educating your puppy about how *fun* agility is.
But, over here the general agility competitors population do encourage early training with puppies, even though that training may only consist of teaching the puppy to walk on low planks, step through a ladder to encourage hind end coordination, play on a wobbly board to encourage confidence when not on solid, non-moving ground, or just teaching the puppy how to enjoy agility tunnels. Might as well get an early start on educating your puppy about how *fun* agility is.
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Hmmm ..
I did some searching on UK agility.
This is what I found. There are different levels of agility and you change levels as you earn points - after so many points you have to go to the next level.
If there are 5 dogs or less per class, no prizes are given. Under 50 dogs, prize is given to first place only. 50 to 100 dogs, first and second places are given, and over 100 dogs means first, second AND third places are given.
Dogs earn titles such as CAP (Champion of Agility Performance).
I also found this, from The Kennel Club (UK):
"Types of Agility Test: There are only four types of Agility Test. Agility Matches are restricted to members of the show society only. Entry to Limited Agility Tests is restricted to members of the show society, or competitors from a certain area, or, limited to certain breeds, or, sizes of dog. Open Agility Tests, are just that, open to all who wish to take part. Finally Championship Agility can now be scheduled with a special Championship Class which is divided into three separate rounds. The winner and 2nd placed dogs being awarded and Agility Certificate and a Reserve Agility Certificate. "
So to say that only first place means anything, or that they don't earn titles, is not accurate.
What I've found overall, from talking to people who compete in the UK and places like Australia, is that the USA rules for agility (in all the venues I know of) are much more "user friendly" and allow dogs of various breeds and structures to progress and earn titles. There is a much higher level of reward to both dog and handler under the rules in the US. You don't have to own a border collie or an agility breed in order to earn titles. I sure don't think there's anything wrong with that! I'm much more impressed with a good working dog of a non-traditional breed then I am watching just another border collie zoom through a course. I know what it takes to train those non-traditional breeds (having put six agility titles on chows so far).
I think it's pretty obvious to most people that anyone who says it takes "five minutes" to put accuracy on a dog is exaggerating a considerable amount. You can't let a dog run willy-nilly for months and then put accuracy on in just a few minutes. There has to be some control and accuracy throughout the training. As most people who have done any amount of agility training knows, if you're running an excitable dog full blast through contact obstacles and you're not paying ANY attention to accuracy, you're going to have a dog leaping off the obstacles and missing contacts altogether. Once you allow that to happen, you've got some problems in going back and teaching those contacts. It's a matter of practicality.
I've never had a problem with accuracy in my dogs, and in fact my first two chows never learned any sort of a stop on contacts. They weren't the type of dog that would leap off a contact and my concern with them was speed - so I pushed them right through and never had them stop. My shepherds were taught contacts but speed was never a problem. They were faster than I was by far! *L*
So it depends on the dog when it comes to the amount of emphasis put on accuracy. But they all need to learn it at some point.
Melanie and the gang in Alaska
I did some searching on UK agility.
This is what I found. There are different levels of agility and you change levels as you earn points - after so many points you have to go to the next level.
If there are 5 dogs or less per class, no prizes are given. Under 50 dogs, prize is given to first place only. 50 to 100 dogs, first and second places are given, and over 100 dogs means first, second AND third places are given.
Dogs earn titles such as CAP (Champion of Agility Performance).
I also found this, from The Kennel Club (UK):
"Types of Agility Test: There are only four types of Agility Test. Agility Matches are restricted to members of the show society only. Entry to Limited Agility Tests is restricted to members of the show society, or competitors from a certain area, or, limited to certain breeds, or, sizes of dog. Open Agility Tests, are just that, open to all who wish to take part. Finally Championship Agility can now be scheduled with a special Championship Class which is divided into three separate rounds. The winner and 2nd placed dogs being awarded and Agility Certificate and a Reserve Agility Certificate. "
So to say that only first place means anything, or that they don't earn titles, is not accurate.
What I've found overall, from talking to people who compete in the UK and places like Australia, is that the USA rules for agility (in all the venues I know of) are much more "user friendly" and allow dogs of various breeds and structures to progress and earn titles. There is a much higher level of reward to both dog and handler under the rules in the US. You don't have to own a border collie or an agility breed in order to earn titles. I sure don't think there's anything wrong with that! I'm much more impressed with a good working dog of a non-traditional breed then I am watching just another border collie zoom through a course. I know what it takes to train those non-traditional breeds (having put six agility titles on chows so far).
I think it's pretty obvious to most people that anyone who says it takes "five minutes" to put accuracy on a dog is exaggerating a considerable amount. You can't let a dog run willy-nilly for months and then put accuracy on in just a few minutes. There has to be some control and accuracy throughout the training. As most people who have done any amount of agility training knows, if you're running an excitable dog full blast through contact obstacles and you're not paying ANY attention to accuracy, you're going to have a dog leaping off the obstacles and missing contacts altogether. Once you allow that to happen, you've got some problems in going back and teaching those contacts. It's a matter of practicality.
I've never had a problem with accuracy in my dogs, and in fact my first two chows never learned any sort of a stop on contacts. They weren't the type of dog that would leap off a contact and my concern with them was speed - so I pushed them right through and never had them stop. My shepherds were taught contacts but speed was never a problem. They were faster than I was by far! *L*
So it depends on the dog when it comes to the amount of emphasis put on accuracy. But they all need to learn it at some point.
Melanie and the gang in Alaska
tessa_s212 said:
If that is the way you choose to train, yes, I'd agree not to train a puppy like that.
But, over here the general agility competitors population do encourage early training with puppies, even though that training may only consist of teaching the puppy to walk on low planks, step through a ladder to encourage hind end coordination, play on a wobbly board to encourage confidence when not on solid, non-moving ground, or just teaching the puppy how to enjoy agility tunnels. Might as well get an early start on educating your puppy about how *fun* agility is.
But, over here the general agility competitors population do encourage early training with puppies, even though that training may only consist of teaching the puppy to walk on low planks, step through a ladder to encourage hind end coordination, play on a wobbly board to encourage confidence when not on solid, non-moving ground, or just teaching the puppy how to enjoy agility tunnels. Might as well get an early start on educating your puppy about how *fun* agility is.
For someone training a puppy- the idea of completely ignoring contact zones is a poor idea. In my opinion, completely ignoring training of contact zones is a poor idea for *any* dog, but to each their own.
Like RD, I train two speed demons whose idea of mortality is that it exists only for those things that THEY kill. Tai and Kimi (in their opinions), are immortal. It's this kind of attitude, not to mention raw animal SPEED that makes such a small dog such a fabulous hunter. (I've seen Shibas catch birds in flight, and many of my breeder's own dogs have successfully tracked and hunted wild boar in Japan).
However, it is this kind of attitude that also makes it imperative for me to teach contact zones religiously. I KNEW I was never going to have a problem motivating these animals to run at top speed. (Ask Tessa, who has had her own experience with Shibas- they really can fly). I also knew that I WOULD have a problem motivating them not to fly off of the top of the A frame. It comes down to understanding YOUR dog as an *individual.*
I trained contact zones first, and my result is that I have incredibly fast dogs, who are NOT slow by ANY means, they are simply accurate. When we're running a course, they're up and excited- they absolutely thrill to speed, and I've yet to see either one zoom up an A-frame, and then carefully pick his way down the contact zone, LOL. They simply refrain from diving off of the side of the frame or the dog walk (which is what they WOULD have done, had I not been such a stickler. Once again, I know my breed, and I know my own animals. This makes it easy to know what to emphasize when training them.
At any rate, no matter what, safety will always be number one when it comes to my dogs. There is no point in having a fast dog that can never run an agility course again because you've broken down his joints.
Like RD, I train two speed demons whose idea of mortality is that it exists only for those things that THEY kill. Tai and Kimi (in their opinions), are immortal. It's this kind of attitude, not to mention raw animal SPEED that makes such a small dog such a fabulous hunter. (I've seen Shibas catch birds in flight, and many of my breeder's own dogs have successfully tracked and hunted wild boar in Japan).
However, it is this kind of attitude that also makes it imperative for me to teach contact zones religiously. I KNEW I was never going to have a problem motivating these animals to run at top speed. (Ask Tessa, who has had her own experience with Shibas- they really can fly). I also knew that I WOULD have a problem motivating them not to fly off of the top of the A frame. It comes down to understanding YOUR dog as an *individual.*
I trained contact zones first, and my result is that I have incredibly fast dogs, who are NOT slow by ANY means, they are simply accurate. When we're running a course, they're up and excited- they absolutely thrill to speed, and I've yet to see either one zoom up an A-frame, and then carefully pick his way down the contact zone, LOL. They simply refrain from diving off of the side of the frame or the dog walk (which is what they WOULD have done, had I not been such a stickler. Once again, I know my breed, and I know my own animals. This makes it easy to know what to emphasize when training them.
At any rate, no matter what, safety will always be number one when it comes to my dogs. There is no point in having a fast dog that can never run an agility course again because you've broken down his joints.