Proin--Killer of Dogs!! (Incontinence Drug)

I haven’t posted here in a really long time, but I thought this was important enough to finally post. I have a dog on PROIN. She had a major incontinence problem from the time I brought her home basically. I took her all across the state, traveling many many hours to find different vets, to get a diagnosis, to find out what was wrong with her. I cleaned my bedding every day, bought waterproof mattress pads, found “comfortable†diapers (even paying a fortune to have some specially made for her because the plastic ones in the store were uncomfortable for her). I was resigned to do this the rest of her life, I was fine with it, I told the vet that she wasn’t going to be put on any medication.

AND THEN, the infections started, even with bathing her EVERY SINGLE DAY, there were times when I wasn’t home that she would pee on herself and sit in it and that causes infections. She was spending more time on antibiotics then she was off of them. When the infections came, the peeing got worse, she was uncomfortable, didn’t ever want to settle down because every time she did, she peed.

TRUE incontinence like this can’t be modified with diet and potty schedule. She had wee wee pads available 24/7. We tried withholding water. Nothing helped. She fell asleep, she PEED. It was as simple as that.

I took her to a top specialist, they explained all the risks of PROIN, she talked to me for a long time. We decided that we needed to at least give it a try, that we at least needed to give her a short reprieve from all the infections, from the antibiotics, from the lack of sleep.

She has been on PROIN for a little over 2 months, she is a different dog. She sleeps soundly all night, she used to get up all night long because she was wet and uncomfortable. She hasn’t had an infection once in that time.

The specialist and I are keeping an eye on her, she is going to be rechecked in a month’s time to make sure she is doing okay on the medicine and we are going to discuss where we want to go from here.

Medical care whether it is for you, your kid, your dog, is a two way street. If you blindly follow anything they say you are asking for trouble. People need to take a more pro-active stance in the care of their pets. Research on your own, ask your vet questions if something makes you uncomfortable. If you don’t feel you are getting the proper answers or information, FIND A NEW VET. You should always ask the vet how any new drug will interact with any other drug they are on, or any medical conditions they have. You should be asking for yearly bloodwork to see if any medical conditions are starting to become evident. Yes, maybe a great vet will ask these questions on their own but it is really our responsibility to be a great pet owner regardless of the vet.

When I see someone saying people like doberluv or elegy don’t love their dogs or are just mad because they didn’t turn out to be the “doll†they wanted, I don’t know whether to laugh or be mad, I guess its kind of funny because most kids in the world would be lucky to be treated as good as Lyric or Luce.

It’s easy to say that incontinence is just an inconvenience but unless you have lived it and seen what it does to the DOG, you really can’t talk about it, because you really don’t know.

Almost everything you put in your mouth, or on your skin, or breath in, or any activity you participate in yourself or with your dog can cause issues, it’s as simple as that. YOU (along with advice from your vet) need to balance the positives with the negatives and do what is right for you and your pet, whether you are talking about giving them PROIN, sending them to daycare, participating in agility, feeding them Beneful, etc.

On a side note, it is much more convincing when you make an argument with personal experience to back it up and not a bunch of second hand information copy and pasted from someone else and a bunch of scare tactics about KILLER DRUGS!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Treatment of incontinence is usually simple and effective. There are many different ways of treating incontinence, and the choice may depend on the cause. Phenylpropanolamine (PPA), a decongestant that helps to tighten the sphincter muscle, is the most commonly used treatment for incontinence in both male and female dogs.
Spay incontinence can also be treated with estrogen supplements, usually in the form of DES (diethylstilbestrol), but estradiol, a more natural form of estrogen, can be used. Neutered males with hormonally-caused incontinence may respond to monthly testosterone injections, though these can also lead to urine marking and aggressive behavior.

TRUE incontinence like this can’t be modified with diet and potty schedule. She had wee wee pads available 24/7. We tried withholding water. Nothing helped. She fell asleep, she PEED. It was as simple as that.

I understand what you are saying, however, I think that a vet NOT being forthcoming is actually quite harmful fo the dog. For example: My vet gives me Rimadyl for my dog's pain but gives no other info. Susie at training class asks how the vet visit went and I tell her that the vet gave Fido something called Rimadyl. "OMG, Rimadyl!?!?!" Susie says, "That stuff can KILL your dog!!!!!!" So, a bit freaked, the second I get home I google it, and what do I find? "RIMADYL KILLED MY DOG!!!!!!!!" results. Now I'm really freaked out and really upset at the vet for giving my dog a drug that will "kill" him. I stop giving the drug and maybe stop trusting that vet. Everyone loses.

If the vet had just sat me down and explained that while there are rare side effects they are doing blood work to minimize the risk and these are the things to watch for in case there is a problem, I would be armed with the infor, much calmer, and would trust the vet much more than if I had just been given the meds without any addition info.

All dogs should undergo a thorough history and physical examination before initiation of NSAID therapy. Appropriate laboratory tests to establish hematological and serum biochemical baseline data prior to, and periodically during, administration of any NSAID should be considered. Owners should be advised to observe for signs of potential drug toxicity (see Information for Dog Owners, Adverse Reactions, Animal Safety and Post-Approval Experience).

How many vets actually do that?

So, a bit freaked, the second I get home I google it, and what do I find? "RIMADYL KILLED MY DOG!!!!!!!!" results. Now I'm really freaked out and really upset at the vet for giving my dog a drug that will "kill" him. I stop giving the drug and maybe stop trusting that vet. Everyone loses.

I know I know, you're going to say "but we didn't know how evil and bad PROIN was because the vet didn't give us the sheet" - you could have looked it up before giving it to your dog. Shoulda, woulda, coulda. This isn't the drug manufacturers fault, but your own for your or your vets ignorance. The company that made the drug gives a sheet with it with a list of possible side effects. If you didn't research it, how are you blaming the drug for it? Oh wait, because you don't want to take responsibility for your own mistakes.

Better question: how many clients would actually pay for that? :wall::wall::wall:

People think you're already ripping them off by prescribing meds (vs writing scripts for pharmacies, which we'll do if requested). Tack on bloodwork and they're like 'whoooa' even if you tell them why. Why? Because it's not for a thyroid test or anything they can relate to human medicine (that they'd have to get bloodwork done for) so they think you're taking them for a ride.

Quote:
How many vets actually do that?

Better question: how many clients would actually pay for that?

People think you're already ripping them off by prescribing meds (vs writing scripts for pharmacies, which we'll do if requested). Tack on bloodwork and they're like 'whoooa' even if you tell them why. Why? Because it's not for a thyroid test or anything they can relate to human medicine (that they'd have to get bloodwork done for) so they think you're taking them for a ride.

Where can I get more information: Your pharmacist has additional information about Proin written for health professionals that you may read.

What to tell/ask veterinarian before giving medication?

Talk to your veterinarian about:

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When will your pet need to be rechecked
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What tests may need to be performed prior to and during treatment with this drug
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What are the risks and benefits of using this drug



Tell your veterinarian about:

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If your pet has experienced side-effects on other drugs/products
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If your pet has experienced digestive upset now or ever
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If your pet has experienced liver or kidney disease now or ever
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If your pet has experienced any other medical problems or allergies now or ever
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All medicines and supplements that you are giving your pet or plan to give your pet, including those you can get without a prescription. Your veterinarian may want to check that all of your pet’s medicines can be given together.
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If your pet is pregnant or nursing or if you plan to breed your pet

Potential side effects:

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Phenylpropanolamine was taken off the human market in 1999 because it caused extreme high blood pressure and strokes in some humans. There have been no reports of these effects in animals when used at normal doses.
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Since it is a stimulant, your pet may experience restlessness, irritability, urine retention, high blood pressure, rapid heart rate and loss of appetite
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If your pet shows any of these symptoms or you notice anything else unusual, contact your veterinarian

My vet however should have it along with his supply of the drug. My vet's job is to discuss the risks and benefits of meds with me, not the other way around. My vet should be giving me a copy of the fact sheet.

I agree with that, don't get me wrong. But if you don't get it from your vet, then somethings wrong. You shouldn't HAVE to ask about it, but if you don't get it, you should - or not give the med to your pet. Common sense isn't that common. Most people won't blindly take a medication (and subsequently those that do ignore the fact sheet from the pharmacist anyway) so why should you blindly give it to your pet?

Prescribing information straight from Rimadyl's website:https://www.rimadyl.com/docs/pi.pdf

How many vets actually do that? :wall::wall::wall:

I agree CP, that's what I could find, and the site says to get it from a pharmacist...but there's enough information on there from reputable sites to make me go "Hmmm, maybe I should think about giving this to my pet or taking it myself" - I mean, it took one simple google search to find a BASIC sheet that sounds dangerous enough for me to want to ask a pharmacist for a complete list of the horrible stuff a drug can do to you. Maybe that's just me.

I hate the scare tactics as well. First off, I'm not trying to be too blunt, but if anything, your vet or yourself is more to blame than your "killer" drug. You both admit that your dogs had underlying conditions.If you are referring to me---My dog has never been on Proin--no need(so far) The only thing my dog had was Rimadyl and one pill was given while dog was being neutered (given without my knowledge) and the 2nd one was prescribed which I gave at home. He reacted to this med so I threw the other 2 pills in the garbage. He had full bloodwork done before he was neutered--immediately before they neutered him. There were no underlying conditions at all! (Just to set the record straight!) So that is YOUR or your vets responsibility to do bloodwork prior to this to eliminate things like that. I know I know, you're going to say "but we didn't know how evil and bad PROIN was because the vet didn't give us the sheet" - you could have looked it up before giving it to your dog. Shoulda, woulda, coulda. This isn't the drug manufacturers fault, but your own for your or your vets ignorance. The company that made the drug gives a sheet with it with a list of possible side effects. If you didn't research it, how are you blaming the drug for it? Oh wait, because you don't want to take responsibility for your own mistakes.I resent that last statement and especially since it doesn't even apply!!

You called this mass spamming and garbage!!! I do not consider that this is spamming or garbage in any way! You have your opinion and I have mine. And from a few of the replies I have seen--not everyone thinks like you do--Thank God! If just one dog that would of died because of Proin did not receive it because of this thread on Proin---I will be grateful and this 'spam' (as YOU call it,NOT ME) will be worth everything, including the 'abuse' from some of the members in this forum when all I am trying to do is help dogs! Spam -my a*s!!

i think that's awfully harsh. you've never had a dog with this problem, have you? because it's really not any fun.

No I have not had this problem and just from cleaning up a few accidents now and then---It would not be any fun, right! But my dog(s) are the same to me as my children and I would not subject them to something that I consider very unsafe. I would try to find a safer method or use doggie diapers or/and put up with it. And definitely would not put them to sleep either. Would I murder my children!!!? Ironic sort of--Babies wet diapers but would you put them to sleep because you did not like putting up with pee and diapers? And then --the wedding vows--In sickness and in health (Hope I remembered that right)---Would you put your spouse to sleep if he was sick because you didn't want to deal with it?!

Well, that would depend. Am I his beneficiary? Is he loaded? Is he of no use anymore around the house?

Well, that would depend. Am I his beneficiary? Is he loaded? Is he of no use anymore around the house?

Well, thanks for your information and "evidence" of this drug. I'm sure we'll all take it into consideration. I hope you've enjoyed this forum and hope you find many more forums to visit.