What is your definition of a working dog?

[Saeleofu]

I see "working dog" tossed around SO MUCH, and I feel most of the time it's not used properly. Not to be confused with "working-line dog" of course.

To me, a working dog is a dog that has an actual job - service dogs, SAR dogs, police dogs, herding dogs that work as real herding dogs on a real farm, hunting dogs, etc (that's hardly an all-inclusive list, but you get the idea - the dog works/has a job, isn't just in it for sport/training...for example I consider Sara's dogs working dogs, since they...well...WORK, but dogs who play disc in the back yard just for fun aren't working dogs).

I've run into a lot of people who seem to think a "working dog" is anything that involves biting. Period. IPO training? Yup, my dog's a working dog! I just want to teach my dog to be an asshole to every person and dog around for funsies rather than actually training formally? Yup, working dog! I let my dog play with the flirt pole 3 hours a day but don't do anything else? Working dog, totally!

Still others think dog sports=work. Dock diving titles? Working dog. Herding titles (but not working on a farm or other applied herding)? Working dog. Obedience titles? Working dog. Rally titles? Working dog. Trick dog titles? TOTALLY a working dog? *sigh*

To me, if you do it for sport, the dog is NOT a working dog. It's a pet you have fun with. A dog doing hunting trials is doing it for sport. A dog you actually take with you when you go hunting because it's trained to help is a working dog. A dog that does IPO for sport is not a working dog, but a personal protection dog or a police dog of any sort is a working dog. A dog trained to open your fridge and get you a beer simply to impress your friends is not a working dog, but a service dog trained to do the exact same thing because you can't do it yourself is a working dog. Heck, even a therapy dog is a working dog by my definition!

So, what's your definition of "working dog?" Do you consider your dog(s) working dogs?

 

[Oko]

I liked the way Denise Fenzi put it-working dogs are dogs doing something that they were bred to instinctually do and find intrinsically rewarding.

 

[Picklepaige]

I agree with your definition of working dog. A working dog is...well...a dog that works

I too have noticed that some people into IPO and the like are always calling their dogs working dogs. I understand that IPO is a more difficult sport than most, but that still doesn't make it "work".

 

[Julee]

To me, a working dog is a dog that has an actual job - service dogs, SAR dogs, police dogs, herding dogs that work as real herding dogs on a real farm, hunting dogs, etc (that's hardly an all-inclusive list, but you get the idea - the dog works/has a job, isn't just in it for sport/training...for example I consider Sara's dogs working dogs, since they...well...WORK, but dogs who play disc in the back yard just for fun aren't working dogs).

My feelings as well. A PPD I would call a working dog, but not an IPO dog, for example.

ETA

I liked the way Denise Fenzi put it-working dogs are dogs doing something that they were bred to instinctually do.

I like that a lot, however I don't think it is a complete definition. Em is a working dog, even though she was not bred for the work.

If I used Bloo to retrieve game, I'd call her a working dog, even though her breed wasn't bred to do it.

 

[Saeleofu]

I liked the way Denise Fenzi put it-working dogs are dogs doing something that they were bred to instinctually do.

I don't quite agree with this. Herding for sport/titles is totally different from herding because the animals NEED to be herded, even if it's done by the same kind of dog (or the same dog). That definition would mean that Barn Hunt trials - done for fun - are "work" for some dogs and not others. Doesn't make a lot of sense to me. For that matter, actual working dogs - service dogs for example - wouldn't always be considered "working dogs" with that definition. I have a boxer and a collie. Both have been trained to retrieve. Neither was bred for "retrieving instinct'" but one isn't a working dog, the other is. With this definition, Logan wouldn't be a working dog unless he's herding sheep. Actually, with this definition, Gavroche is a working dog every time he turns in a circle before laying down, every time he eats, every time he pees on something, etc, even though he's NOT, in reality, a working dog.

 

[Oko]

Something is a bad word for it. A job. Tired haha. And by your definition one is a working dog, by mine, technically no. I guess the answer isn't clear cut, but that's normally how I think of working dogs when someone says it? Although obviously Logan works.

 

[Saeleofu]

Something is a bad word for it. A job. Tired haha.

Still doesn't cover it. As I said, Logan wasn't bred for guiding or retrieving or anything he does when he's working. It's a job, he does it, but this definition means he's not a working dog. It also means his dad, who was a SAR dog, wasn't a working dog, since he wasn't bred to be a SAR dog - yet when he was getting his PT title, he was a working dog? Yeah, still doesn't make sense to me.

 

[Saeleofu]

Okay, rat terrier. If they're actually a WORKING rat terrier, they could be...well, hunting rats. Or they could be a service dog. Or a therapy dog. Or any number of things.

But to me, a rat terrier doing Barn Hunt is NOT a working dog. It's a dog having fun, sure, but it's not a working dog.

 

[SpringerLover]

When I think of working dog, I think of hunting-guide dogs. They are out in the field all day long. I also think of herders living on a ranch/functional farm.

 

[Romy]

Still doesn't cover it. As I said, Logan wasn't bred for guiding or retrieving or anything he does when he's working. It's a job, he does it, but this definition means he's not a working dog. It also means his dad, who was a SAR dog, wasn't a working dog, since he wasn't bred to be a SAR dog - yet when he was getting his PT title, he was a working dog? Yeah, still doesn't make sense to me.

By that definition none of the borzoi SDs out there are working dogs either. Although, I don't think many dogs participating in dog sports would count as working dogs under that definition. Sight hounds weren't bred to chase a plastic bag on a clothesline. Rat terriers were made to kill rats/control the vermin population, so a barn hunt wouldn't count?

Edit: I agree with a working dog being any dog that works a job that has real life implications. Like a LGD that sits out in the sheep paddock with its little sheepie buddies. Or a police dog, or service dog, SAR, hunting dog, etc. I don't think they necessarily need to be the "right" breed though. Strider's sire is a borzoi, but functions as a LGD for his breeder's farm. He camps out in the goat kid paddock and kills the coyotes that come in and try to eat the babies. He does a great job too.

 

[Red.Apricot]

Elsie does obedience and rally. She's a pet. If someone called her a working dog I would laugh for days.

She works hard but she hardly works.

 

[Xandra]

Would an owner of a dog for this job still have the dog if they weren't a dog person? If yes then probably a working dog.

 

[Saeleofu]

Would an owner of a dog for this job still have the dog if they weren't a dog person? If yes then probably a working dog.

I like this, but it's still a bit hit-and-miss. Most jobs that dogs do have alternatives, it's just that dogs are better at it/preferred by the person. Someone could use a long cane instead of a guide dog if they're not a dog person. Some people herd from ATVs instead of with dogs. For some detection applications, there are machines that work just as well or better than a dog (natural gas, for instance). But like I said, I do like this one at the core.

 

[krissy]

To me, if you do it for sport, the dog is NOT a working dog. It's a pet you have fun with. A dog doing hunting trials is doing it for sport. A dog you actually take with you when you go hunting because it's trained to help is a working dog.

I agree but also disagree. Because it also depends on amount of training and time spent on the activity. While I do not consider my dogs to be working dogs just because we spend a TONNE of time on agility training, I also don't think my brother in law's dog is a working dog. He has a beagle and he takes it hunting. But it doesn't really have formal training and although he goes hunting on a fairly regular basis, it's not like the dog actually spends a lot of time "working".

I guess for me, when I think "working dog" I think of a dog that does a job that is essential. A herding dog on a real farm has o herd sheep for that farm to operate. A service dog has to perform certain tasks or its owner would not be able to function. A police dg has to detect drugs and bombs because humans have a useless sense of smell.

A dog that does a sport at a high level is working and as a job... but is not a working dog... if that makes sense.

 

[Saeleofu]

He has a beagle and he takes it hunting. But it doesn't really have formal training and although he goes hunting on a fairly regular basis, it's not like the dog actually spends a lot of time "working".

If the dog isn't trained and doesn't work, then it's not a working dog. Just because a dog goes with a person doesn't mean it's working, but there are dogs that are trained hunting dogs. If it's not trained, it's just a pet accompanying you in the field. If I drug a pet dog around with me to store, I wouldn't be able to call it a working dog just because it was present, because it wasn't trained to actually help me.

 

[Laurelin]

The best way I can word it would be: A working dog is a dog that performs tasks that allow a person to maintain their lifestyle or livelihood.

I'm not sure that covers everything. SAR dogs, hunting dogs, service dogs, dogs that work stock on a ranch, etc.

Dogs can do sports and still be a working dog but they're not a working dog because they do sports. They're a working dog because of their job outside of sports. Sports can be more or less instinctual but that doesn't change the fact that they're sports and not essential. Some working dogs are performing jobs that are not instinctual but are trained but that does not make them any less of a working dog.

My dogs are pet dogs that do sports. I doubt I will ever have need of a working dog.

 

[release the hounds]

I think plenty of sport dogs are working dogs, they just don't have jobs. For me the the definition has always been about the intention of the breeding and the intrinsic drive and temperament for work that has been a generational goal of the dogs in question.

and for every dog that is a sport dog without a job, i can point to a whole lot of dogs with "jobs" that are in title only, given by their owners.

 

[sassafras]

I guess I think of it as... could the person reasonably do the activity or work in question without the assistance (not mere presence) of the dog as well, as easily, or as conveniently as they could do it without the dog.

I don't think the activity necessarily needs to be essential. Most hunters up here hunt recreationally and seasonally, it's essentially a sport, but I'd still consider most of their dogs working dogs. I'd consider a lot of racing sled dogs working dogs even though the mushers don't need them for transportation (although many at least partially make their living off of tours and leasing dogs).


Although honestly it doesn't bother me if someone wants to call their sport dog a working dog. At least they're doing something with their dog(s) above and beyond couch potato and if they're proud of that and what their dog can do, ok.

 

[FG167]

Just want to also point out that GSDs are often defined as a split between WORKING line and showline. Yes, working line dogs are most often the ones chosen for police work and explosives work etc etc So while you may not consider Kastle a working dog, he's still a working line dog. If that makes sense. Even though he only does IPO.

 

[Romy]

I agree but also disagree. Because it also depends on amount of training and time spent on the activity. While I do not consider my dogs to be working dogs just because we spend a TONNE of time on agility training, I also don't think my brother in law's dog is a working dog. He has a beagle and he takes it hunting. But it doesn't really have formal training and although he goes hunting on a fairly regular basis, it's not like the dog actually spends a lot of time "working".

I guess for me, when I think "working dog" I think of a dog that does a job that is essential. A herding dog on a real farm has o herd sheep for that farm to operate. A service dog has to perform certain tasks or its owner would not be able to function. A police dg has to detect drugs and bombs because humans have a useless sense of smell.

A dog that does a sport at a high level is working and as a job... but is not a working dog... if that makes sense.

It also depends on the activity though. Historically, hunting hounds might spend days or weeks between individual hunts depending on the season. Still doesn't make them less of a working hunting dog.

SAR is another good example where most of them go out and train on weekends and only work if someone is lost. So, they're training on a similar schedule to a lot of dogs involved in competitive sports and only go on missions. . . I don't know, it could be once a month. There conceivably could be a few months between searches depending on the season and how many people are out hiking unprepared. Does that make them non working dogs? What about avalanche rescue?