Service dog not allowed in Wal mart

SharkyX

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#3
Couldn't asking somebody with a service dog to leave become pretty expensive for Walmart?
If more people who have had this happen to them start coming out of the woodwork it could cost them a few pennies and a black eye for anybody who shops at walmart and has a service dog or a bully breed.
 

Whisper

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#4
I'll add that to the list of reasons I won't go to Walmart.
 

Gempress

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#5
I completely disagree with Wal-Mart's position. There is no way they can discriminate against a service dog based on breed and get away with it.

But there's another angle to this story that is nagging at me. Exactly what kind of service dog is Chloe? I took a look at Chloe's website. On Chloe's Portfolio page is a list of behaviors that Chloe "knows or is working on". That made me do a double-take. They include behaviors like heel, high five, bow, leave it, not jumping up, sit with distractions.....I didn't see a single behavior that I recognized as a a specialized service dog behavior.

Zeus can do those behaviors...well, except for the cute tricks like bow and roll over...and he's no service dog. And I've never seen "loose leash walking" listed as a specialized service dog trained behavior.

It makes me wonder if Chloe is part of the recent service dog trend--the one in which owners certify their dog as a service dog just to be able to take them places. Granted, I could be completely wrong. Maybe Chloe is a seizure dog or something, a non-obvious service dog. But I can't find any info on the website.

Perhaps the Wal-Mart manager didn't believe that Chloe was a real service dog and used her breed as an excuse?

Just random musings.
 

jason_els

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#6
It doesn't matter. It's illegal to ask what the dog is used for.

Likely that WalMart did a utilitarian examination of the costs. How much money would they have to pay to defend a dog bite or attack in their stores versus how much money they would have to pay for denying entry to someone with a certified service dog of a breed seen as dangerous. My guess is there's a memo somewhere telling the manager to do just that because the settlement would cost them less money. Defending Chloe defends all service dogs.

And when the last law was down, and the Devil turned round on you, where would you hide, the laws all being flat? This country is planted thick with laws, from coast to coast, Man's laws, not God's! And if you cut them down do you really think you could stand upright in the winds that would blow then? Yes, I'd give the Devil benefit of the law, for my own safety's sake!
-A Man For All Seasons
 

Zoom

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#7
While my gut reaction is to side with Chloe and her owners, because it is illegal to ask a service dog to leave the store (what would they have done if the dog had been a GSD, one of the first "common" service breeds? They've been on BSL lists before), I too want to know what sort of service dog she is. I would want to know even if she was a Lab or Golden and had been asked to leave, primarily because of the recent trend in which people are making up fake titles for their total-pet dogs and trying to pass them off as service dogs. It does true service dogs a great disservice.

So, if Chloe is legit, then fight fight fight, go team go team. If someone just bought a vest off the internet and was trying to pass her off as a service dog out of a well-intentioned, but ultimately misguided, stunt to show her as a "breed ambassador" and give APBT's a good name, unofficially I say "Yay!" Officially, I would say "booo" because soon even service dogs are going to be hard to get into public places for those who TRULY need them.
 
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#8
FYI, there is no actual certification process for service animals. I could go buy a vest, slap it on my dog and waltz into a business, and I am protected by the laws enforced by the ADA (Americans with Disabilities Act) which do not allow the business owners to ask specifics.

Some service dog training programs certify dogs within their program, but federally, there is no test, exam or process that a service dog must pass in order to be called a service dog.

I know of one individual who trained her service dog with help over the internet. :):no comment::)

As a result of this loophole, legitimate service dogs are getting a bad rap, and business owners are suspicious.

I came across this article about an owner-trained service dog who killed another dog....

http://www.guidehorse.org/news_ot_dogs_kills.htm

It's only a matter of time before one of these "home-made" service dogs kills a human.

Sorry, I kind of veered of topic.

I have no problems with legit service dogs - I just wish there were more stringent laws and a certification process.

If this dog truly was a legit service dog, then SHAME ON WAL-MART!! Regardless of breed, shame on them!
 

Kayla

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#9
If I was the owner of that service dog and my dog was a ligit service dog because I had some kind of disablity I would of refused to leave the store and if they had tried further quite frankly called the cops right their and report the criminal behaviour which these employees were imposing on me.

I agree their are waay to many home made service dogs which is a shame as these people have no respect for the type of difficulties true suffers of disablities go through and risk their rights by having to bring their dogs into such stores.

I will second what everyone else has said if chloe was a ligit service dog shame on walmart.

Kayla
 

Sunnierhawk0

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#10
There was a similar issue that arose at a Sears. The lady was asked to leave because her service dog was a Rottweiler. Hopefully the proper action will be taken against Walmart.
 

IliamnasQuest

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#11
I don't have a problem with any breed being a true service dog, but in reading through the website I just see nothing that indicates this dog was actually a service dog (other than the person saying she is). She has no specialized training and was born in April of 2006, so she's not yet a year old. She may be a service dog in training but that's about it as far as I can tell.

This whole concept of service dogs is so lax at this point .. while requiring certification according to national standards creates problems, at some point I expect it will come to that. Too many people are willing to take advantage of the legalities.

Here are some lists of service dog tasks .. Chloe the pitbull doesn't even come close to what I would consider a service dog.

Traditional Tasks performed by Guide, Hearing and Service Dogs:
http://www.iaadp.org/tasks.html

Tasks for Service Dogs for Persons with a Psychiatric Disability:
http://www.iaadp.org/psd_tasks.html

While legally Walmart was supposed to allow the dog in just because the person said the dog is a service dog (and disallowing it because of breed is a poor excuse) .. I would still want to see more proof of service dog training before I'd jump in and complain to Walmart.

I'm a bit touchy about this topic because I have a condition that may very well require me to have assistance at some point and I would like to have a service dog .. I hate to see people create a problem for those with legitimate needs.

Melanie and the gang in Alaska
 
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#12
I think that Chloe was a service dog in training?? That's what it sounds like from her webpage..


ETA-I was thinking about it and she very well could be an active service dog and this woman just doesnt want to talk about her "condition". I probably wouldnt either. She is obviously a service dog or service dog in training, or else the news wouldnt have picked up her story. Also, she mentions she called her "OC HUGS Service Dog" president. I dont think she would be calling them if this dog wasnt truly a service dog.
 
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Sunnierhawk0

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#13
This was taken from her website:
"She was accepted into a Service Dog training program at 5 months and has her Good Canine Certification, Beginning & Intermediate Training Graduate."
 
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#14
I know from my own personal experience wallmart is very discriminatory to service dogs. When i would go there on the rare occasion with my BEAGLE they would harass me left and right about him. He was wearing a vest and well behaved but as I wasn't blind he couldn't have been a service dog! I use a psychiatric and this stress of harassment doesn't help me at all... I even had one woman while down in TN at my in laws refuse to talk to me about MY service dog, only directing her words to my husband.

My new boy I am working with is a pit mix... that could be...fun if we ever have to go to wallmart...

As far as the self trained, I have to train mine myself. I have contacted the local service dog orgs and they pretty much blow me off saying they do not deal with the kind of dog i need. It's pretty frustrating actually because I know I am not a expert on service dogs, but I cant get any help from someone who's main goal is them. So with this new boy we're going at it one step at a time, thankfully he is much more willing and wanting to please then the beagle so i can teach him many more tasks i need!
 

Gempress

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#16
Also, she mentions she called her "OC HUGS Service Dog" president. I dont think she would be calling them if this dog wasnt truly a service dog.
Not all service dog organizations are legitimate. I remember this being mentioned in another thread. The poster said there were "service dog" groups in his/her area that was basically made up of people calling their pets service dogs.

I wish there was some sort of certification process.
 
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#17
Interesting. I looked at the government website for the ADA and found this Q&A about service animals.

http://www.usdoj.gov/crt/ada/svcanimb.htm

Two things struck me:

"Businesses may ask if an animal is a service animal or ask what tasks the animal has been trained to perform, but cannot require special ID cards for the animal or ask about the person's disability."

So Wal-Mart was legally allowed to question her about the dog and it's purpose. I think that they're going to have to change the bit about not requiring an ID, because as so many people have said, that's leaving it open to anyone with a dog and an attitude (and they're legion) to bring untrained dogs into stores, etc.

and

"A person with a disability cannot be asked to remove his service animal from the premises unless: (1) the animal is out of control and the animal's owner does not take effective action to control it (for example, a dog that barks repeatedly during a movie) or (2) the animal poses a direct threat to the health or safety of others."

So there is a provison made for a store asking a person with an assistance dog to leave. While I suppose (2) is more meant to imply "dog is lunging, snapping, etc." rather than that the dog is a pit bull, Wal-Mart's actions had some legit basis.
 

otch1

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#18
Absolutely agree with you casablanca. I've tried to make this point on several threads. A business may ask if an animal is a service animal. For that reason, most of the larger established organizations have their finished service dogs easily identified. A pack/cape with organizations name, i.d. tags on the dog and an i.d. tag for the recipient. Chloe is not a "service" dog by true deffinition of the word, that being what legally entitles the handler to access with their animal. She's a puppy in training with some organization at this time, but that is not the same. That is where they're going to run into a problem if they sue.
 

Boemy

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#19
A school here in Washington state wouldn't let a hearing service dog for a partially deaf kid in . . . I couldn't believe it. It wasn't because of the breed (it was a lab), but because the dog would be a "distraction." Huh, wha??? It was a service dog fully trained by a professional organization. Last I heard the kids' parents were trying to sue.

Anyway, about Wal-Mart, I wouldn't shop there anyways. They suck.
 

Boemy

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#20
Absolutely agree with you casablanca. I've tried to make this point on several threads. A business may ask if an animal is a service animal. For that reason, most of the larger established organizations have their finished service dogs easily identified. A pack/cape with organizations name, i.d. tags on the dog and an i.d. tag for the recipient. Chloe is not a "service" dog by true deffinition of the word, that being what legally entitles the handler to access with their animal. She's a puppy in training with some organization at this time, but that is not the same. That is where they're going to run into a problem if they sue.
I'm fairly sure service dogs in training are allowed the same access that certified service dogs are. I've seen them on the public buses here, (they have little signs on their vests that say "Please don't pet me, I'm a service dog in training" or something like that.) Regular pets (non-service) are not allowed on the bus.
 

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