Pics of our new mini Goldendoodle

katt223

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well like someone said earlier... all breeds have been mixed from one type of dog or another throughout history. If you look at it that way all dogs are mixed. I still think that shelters will always be full, not because of who is breeding what, but because people give up on the dogs they do buy for whatever reason... shame on them.
 
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I'll post an observation as a newcomer to the board. First I'll say that I truly enjoy the forum, and I've learned quite a lot. It's been a very valuable resource and I know that it will continue to be.

That said, I'm often distressed by the way The Truth is presented here. (The Truth being the general opinion of The Board on any given topic.) The Truth may indeed be the truth, but the smug (yes, there are many smug posters here) preaching and pontification can really rub some the wrong way, regardless of the validity of your point. People just don't like to be shrieked at and brow beaten.

Again, this is just my own observation as a newbie to the site. And I'm not pointing any fingers at any particular poster or posters. But I just think that the heavy-handedness here can drive some good folks away long before they have a chance to gain the awareness that many of you already have. And that's a shame.

My opinion only, of course.
 

Doberluv

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To keep making the comparrison between humans and dogs with positive reinforcement to fall back on as an excuse to chastise people for speaking their mind, please try to understand that humans understand English and share similar values and are moral beings. Dogs, on the other hand are another species that do not share our value system. The things that are important to us are not the same things that dogs think are important. So, teaching a dog our "right from wrong" is a foreign concept to them. They do NOT have the cognitive ability to grasp logically, right from wrong. It's not part of their repertoire. They can be trained in many things, but there are reasons and ways that they learn. Morality has nothing to do with it. They are ammoral creatures. I think people forget that dogs really are another species and expect them to have this great insight into our culture. When someone hits a dog, you can call it smug that someone else objects to that. You can call it anything. But hitting a dog is wrong. And you will find people objecting to that....people who love dogs and who understand them. Humans ought to understand these concepts. Dogs do not.

The comparrison between about adopting a shelter dog and adopting a human baby or having humans breed with a purpose (of a stringent genetic plan) other than the natural reasons why people have babies is just as disjointed and illogical an argument.

When you come onto a dog forum, any dog forum practically....be forwarded. You are likely to come across dog lovers, dog owners, dog trainers, all kinds of people. But one thing in common will be the passion and love of dogs. And that includes all kinds of aspects of having dogs, from training, to feeding, to health....all kinds of facets. You will always find passion in most people who have dogs. Some may be more so than others.

But I just think that the heavy-handedness here can drive some good folks away long before they have a chance to gain the awareness that many of you already have. And that's a shame.
The fittest survive. That's evolution for ya.;)
 

Herschel

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If I adopt one of these children, do I get to look down my nose at everyone who chooses to give birth to their own child?
Travis and Katt,

I've been nothing but polite to you in this thread. I hope that you don't group me with the supposed smugness that plagues this forum.

I have a puppymill (or back yard breeder) mix. He is a "Schnoodle" (although I call him a Schnauzer mix). I bought him because I saw some adorable photos, I wanted a non-shedding dog, and I thought the breeder sounded good.

Most people in this thread are fine with the fact that you have mixed breed dogs. A lot of people, if you haven't noticed, have commented that Travis's puppy is incredibly cute. I agree--he's amazing.

This isn't about "purebred vs. mixed breeds" at all. The comparisons of health (sorry BP) between those groups are completely irrelevant to the message most of us are trying to convey.

We're asking you to critically evaluate the breeders of your dogs the same way anyone would critically evaluate a purebred breeder. Use the same criteria. Are you comfortable with everything you know about them? Is it OK that they won't let you visit before you offer payment? Do you really think they care about the dogs, or are they breeding for their own financial gain?

I'm all about capitalism. Supply and demand is right, Travis. But these are living, breathing animals. For some reason, people have decided that we have dominion over everything else on this planet. Dominion is governance--not forcing two animals to mate so we can make some quick money from their offspring. Are your breeders truly, honestly interested in the well being of their puppies?

Look at Spiritus, a member of this board. http://www.spiritusdogs.ca She isn't breeding only "snobby show dogs" and in several places, she makes references to her puppies as being pets. I consider her a great breeder due to her interest in the well being of her dogs. (Spiritus, correct me if I'm wrong on any of this. It's just my impression) She isn't breeding for "mini" or a certain coat color. She respects the complete dog and breeds as such--it isn't driven by the kind of animal that will make her the most profit.

On the other hand, we have Von Hunter kennels, who also post here on occasion. They aren't breeding pets. They are breeding "high caliber police/military service dogs". These guys have a purpose and their dogs excel at their jobs. It is clear from their main page that they don't bias their selection on "lines" or any other pretentious measures--they just want the best of the best working dogs. I consider them to be highly reputable.
http://www.vonhunterkennels.com/VHKenter.htm

We bought Herschel through PayPal. Any breeder that accepts payment online without meeting the adopters is at the bottom of the barrel. I can't believe we just sent $750 and then Herschel arrived by plane 2 weeks later. How can people treat animals like this? They aren't commodities or accessories!

Congratulations on your new puppy. Goldendoodle or egg noodle, I'm sure Coda will be a great companion. Please stop defending your breeder. It doesn't reflect on you or your puppy that Mis B-Haven is unethical.

We aren't attacking either of you or your dogs. We aren't saying they are less healthy, less beautiful, or less intelligent than any purebred dogs. We are just trying to help you understand that your breeder is in this for the wrong reasons and we don't need any new types of dog breeds.
 

Doberluv

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Travis and Katt,

I've been nothing but polite to you in this thread. I hope that you don't group me with the supposed smugness that plagues this forum.

I have a puppymill (or back yard breeder) mix. He is a "Schnoodle" (although I call him a Schnauzer mix). I bought him because I saw some adorable photos, I wanted a non-shedding dog, and I thought the breeder sounded good.

Most people in this thread are fine with the fact that you have mixed breed dogs. A lot of people, if you haven't noticed, have commented that Travis's puppy is incredibly cute. I agree--he's amazing.

This isn't about "purebred vs. mixed breeds" at all. The comparisons of health (sorry BP) between those groups are completely irrelevant to the message most of us are trying to convey.

We're asking you to critically evaluate the breeders of your dogs the same way anyone would critically evaluate a purebred breeder. Use the same criteria. Are you comfortable with everything you know about them? Is it OK that they won't let you visit before you offer payment? Do you really think they care about the dogs, or are they breeding for their own financial gain?

I'm all about capitalism. Supply and demand is right, Travis. But these are living, breathing animals. For some reason, people have decided that we have dominion over everything else on this planet. Dominion is governance--not forcing two animals to mate so we can make some quick money from their offspring. Are your breeders truly, honestly interested in the well being of their puppies?

Look at Spiritus, a member of this board. http://www.spiritusdogs.ca She isn't breeding only "snobby show dogs" and in several places, she makes references to her puppies as being pets. I consider her a great breeder due to her interest in the well being of her dogs. (Spiritus, correct me if I'm wrong on any of this. It's just my impression) She isn't breeding for "mini" or a certain coat color. She respects the complete dog and breeds as such--it isn't driven by the kind of animal that will make her the most profit.

On the other hand, we have Von Hunter kennels, who also post here on occasion. They aren't breeding pets. They are breeding "high caliber police/military service dogs". These guys have a purpose and their dogs excel at their jobs. It is clear from their main page that they don't bias their selection on "lines" or any other pretentious measures--they just want the best of the best working dogs. I consider them to be highly reputable.
http://www.vonhunterkennels.com/VHKenter.htm

We bought Herschel through PayPal. Any breeder that accepts payment online without meeting the adopters is at the bottom of the barrel. I can't believe we just sent $750 and then Herschel arrived by plane 2 weeks later. How can people treat animals like this? They aren't commodities or accessories!

Congratulations on your new puppy. Goldendoodle or egg noodle, I'm sure Coda will be a great companion. Please stop defending your breeder. It doesn't reflect on you or your puppy that Mis B-Haven is unethical.

We aren't attacking either of you or your dogs. We aren't saying they are less healthy, less beautiful, or less intelligent than any purebred dogs. We are just trying to help you understand that your breeder is in this for the wrong reasons and we don't need any new types of dog breeds.
:hail: :hail: :hail: Exactly.
 

katt223

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i must have missed that above post... I do agree with it all except for the part about defending a breeder... I have not and would not ever defend a puppy mill breeder... come on now! I do disagree with "we don't need any new types of dog breeds" just my opinion.
 

Herschel

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i must have missed that above post... I do agree with it all except for the part about defending a breeder... I have not and would not ever defend a puppy mill breeder... come on now! I do disagree with "we don't need any new types of dog breeds" just my opinion.
Katt,

For what purpose do you need a new dog breed?

There are already several non-shedding breeds of dogs, as well as puppies in rescues that have been confirmed to have non-shedding coats.

By the way, you should visit this site http://www.pbs.org/wnet/nature/dog/index.html and try to watch that program if possible. It's called "Dogs That Changed the World" and it is a must-see for any dog lover.

Oh--and about defending puppy mills. The same goes for backyard breeders. Personally, would you buy another dog from the breeder of your other dogs?
 

katt223

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well my oldest dog Bella I got from the local humane society and my little Baxter I got from a friend whose two little yorkie-poos did the deed, I don't see anything wrong with letting his own two dogs mate if he is responsible for their medical care and training and finding responsible owners to take them (like me!)
I don't think anyone needs a purpose to have one dog breed with another except to make puppies. I really don't care if it is a pure breed or a mixed breed. As long as the owners are responsible and are looking to find GOOD homes and not in it for the money, a dog is a dog is a dog. I am not stupid I understand the points you are making I just DO NOT agree with some of them. nuff said.
 

Herschel

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well my oldest dog Bella I got from the local humane society and my little Baxter I got from a friend whose two little yorkie-poos did the deed, I don't see anything wrong with letting his own two dogs mate if he is responsible for their medical care and training and finding responsible owners to take them (like me!)
I don't think anyone needs a purpose to have one dog breed with another except to make puppies. I really don't care if it is a pure breed or a mixed breed. As long as the owners are responsible and are looking to find GOOD homes and not in it for the money, a dog is a dog is a dog. I am not stupid I understand the points you are making I just DO NOT agree with some of them. nuff said.
I was just wondering why you said you disagree with me about not needing any new dog breeds. (To clarify, I'm talking about types of dogs.)

The only problem with your friend breeding his two puppies is that he didn't consider the fact that his female could have died while giving birth and he didn't consider that you could have rescued another puppy. By you choosing to adopt a cute puppy from your friend, a dog in a shelter was killed.

Granted--the same goes for people that buy dogs from top breeders. Buying a dog from a breeder means one less home for a shelter dog. It is an extremely personal decision and I don't judge people either way. My first dog was from a bad breeder, my second will be from a rescue.
 

katt223

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By the way, you should visit this site http://www.pbs.org/wnet/nature/dog/index.html and try to watch that program if possible. It's called "Dogs That Changed the World" and it is a must-see for any dog lover.

I've seen something like this before and unfortunatley at work we have no volume on our computers so I can't take a look at it now... maybe tonight at home I will.

However the article has a good point: "Over 400 breeds of dog are recognized around the world, each unique for its personality, habits, and form. Most of these breeds exploded onto the scene over the past 150 years, spurred by the Victorian-era passion for the "dog fancy"-the selective breeding of dogs to enhance particular characteristics. By tinkering with its genetics, humans made the dog the most varied animal species on the planet-and also created a host of hereditary health problems."

Humans created all the breeds today by mixing... and unfortuneatly their genetic tweaking created all these hereditary health problems... but I'm sure 150 years ago they didn't have all the medical advantages we have today that can make sure a dog is healthy BEFORE breeding. If breeders are in it for the love of dogs and making sure that the health of the dogs comes first... mix away :) If you have two healthy dogs, whose to say they don't have the right to let them mate?
 

katt223

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I was just wondering why you said you disagree with me about not needing any new dog breeds. (To clarify, I'm talking about types of dogs.)

The only problem with your friend breeding his two puppies is that he didn't consider the fact that his female could have died while giving birth and he didn't consider that you could have rescued another puppy. By you choosing to adopt a cute puppy from your friend, a dog in a shelter was killed.

Granted--the same goes for people that buy dogs from top breeders. Buying a dog from a breeder means one less home for a shelter dog. It is an extremely personal decision and I don't judge people either way. My first dog was from a bad breeder, my second will be from a rescue.
lol this just makes me laugh at the over all generalization. You are trying to solve the shelter problem the wrong way. Ok first off... you are right, we don't NEED any new dog breeds, but if someone WANTS to mix dog breeds I don't have a problem with that.
Secondly, because I bought a puppy from a friend, I must have killed a shelter dog! Are you serious!? Can you hear how ridiculous that sounds?! So anyone who buys a dog from somewhere other than a shelter is basically killing dogs off one by one.
That is balogna! What must be stopped are people letting unresponsible people buy dogs and breed dogs and selling them to idiots. Lets ban all idiots from getting dogs and then we'll see how many dogs end up in a shelter. I think you may have just put your own foot in your mouth.
 

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