Let's Be Controversial

[milos_mommy]

Why not come out of the woodwork for this one?

My big one that's been building for awhile is that I feel that more dogs should be bred for pet qualities. Specifically for those qualities, and not as an offshoot to other goals (like conformation, or sports, or work). Things like: zero reactivity, a mile-long fuse that's hard to light for dogs and people, fantastic off switch. The last two areas I've lived have been big cities, and both have a lot of people looking for very specific, very tolerant dogs - dogs who need to be dead quiet for apartment living and able to lay under a table at a restaurant every day of the week in summer with 200 passing dogs touching noses to sniff, without specific work and costly training to make them that way - and honestly I just don't see many of those types of dogs coming out of breeders or rescues.

I don't even care what breed is the starting point, if doodles are it then doodles it is (though I meet a fair few reactive and/or fearful doodles...).

This surprises me, as I'm also from NYC and I feel as though so so so many shelter/rescue dogs here are capable of that!! I tend to think in other areas people might have a hard time finding those kinds of dogs in shelters because of the prevalence of working/farm/hunting dogs or just dogs that can be kind of unruly out in rural areas as pets, but I come across quite a few nearly bombproof rescue dogs, and far more that are easily manageable pets.

 

[SpringerLover]

There are some things I don't tolerate and use positive punishment for. Not respecting barriers is one of the big ones for me. I do try to make sure I don't need to repeat my correction. If I have trained a leave it well enough and my dog picks something up outside, I will absolutely use positive punishment to correct that behavior. Those are the only two things I can think of right now.

For the most part, in our everyday lives, we all coexist pretty peacefully and uneventfully.

 

[sassafras]

I hate closed stud books. Outcrossing for all!

Crossbreeding doesn't bother me.

I think companionship is a perfectly legitimate job and a good enough reason to breed all by itself.

 

[CrystalGSD]

It really kind of creeps me out how adamant the majority of dog people are about keeping purebred a pure and not outcrossing and not breeding mixed breeds. Like... Does it really matter? If the dogs are healthy and sound I don't really see the problem. They act like "tainting" a purebred lineage with an different dog is a crime. I know a lot of people on Chaz agree with outcrossing but it legitimately creeps me out how against it some are.

 

[sassafras]

I don't care for merle very much.

 

[SpringerLover]

I don't care for merle very much.

I don't like what breeding Merle can do. But I like the look of it.

I don't like rescues using "different" dogs to get gobs of money, to then not spend it on that dog.

 

[CrystalGSD]

I don't like rescues using "different" dogs to get gobs of money, to then not spend it on that dog.

Could you explain what you mean by this? I don't think I've heard of what you're talking about

 

[SpringerLover]

There are a few rescues local to me that have developed a reputation for taking the "sad cases." And because one of my coworkers ended up fostering a dog in this category (missing legs), it wasn't speculation any longer for me.

The rescues continue to ask for money for these dogs but then he dogs barely get basic medical care, not the specialist or advanced care the money is supposedly fundraised for.

Makes me so angry.

 

[amberdyan]

Oh boy, my favorite!

I do not think that prongs and e-collars are the devil.

I am all for people breeding mixes as long as they're breeding healthy, sound dogs and standing behind them. Same with out-of-standard colors.

Similarly, I do not think that Doodles are a scourge upon dog-kind.

I am 100% for outcrossing and think that the dog fancy's view on it is outdated and spitting in the face of the actual science behind breeding. In fact I think a good portion of the dog fancy has absolutely zero clue about science and instead goes by tradition which is incredibly messed up.

There are some dog breeds that it is impossible to breed ethically, like Bulldogs, unless you're breeding way out of standard.

Purina is not pelleted poison and too many people get caught up in feeding what's trendy instead of actually looking at what works for their individual dog.

I think that in some breeds, AKC conformation is a joke. You're not evaluating breeding stock with you've got a dog whose fur is carefully sculpted in unnatural ways filled with hair spray and chalk.

I absolutely do not think that we should save every dog and that filtering a ton of money into one special case, whether it's a very sick, very injured, or even aggressive dog, is a waste of resources when we should be helping as many needy dogs as possible, not spending thousands to tens of thousands on just one.

Yeah, alllll of these.

It really drives me batty on the ACD facebook group when people are like oh you need to give these guys HOURS of exercise daily amd EVEN THAT WONT TIRE THEM OUT. I'm like no. That's how you create an insane dog who won't settle down after you've given it hours of exercise. Teach your dogs to settle, people!

My dogs don't live in bubbles as puppies and they get exposed to all sorts of stuff and are even allowed to jump and climb stairs and things.

Ugh man I feel like my opinions are nothing but controversial but it's late and I'm tired and I'm blanking on thoughts.

AND these.

My controversial opinion is that I am not a 100% positive reinforcement trainer. I think something more like 90%p/10%n is perfect. I absolutely believe that in certain circumstances, negative reinforcement is more effective than positive reinforcement in preventing certain behaviors, especially if the dog already understands or is close to understanding "the rules". I base this opinion based on the fact that dogs give each other negative corrections all the time, and if they can handle it and learn from each other then they can handle it and learn from me as well.

Same. Hugo is a hard dog and takes the few corrections I give well. We have people coming in and out of the apartment kind of often (our neighbors are close friends) and he was a door darter. I NEEDED him to not run out the door. Did tons of positive training and impulse control but the few times he tried to go out before being given the "okay" I shoved myself in the door with him so we banged together and I shoved him back.

I hate closed stud books. Outcrossing for all!

Crossbreeding doesn't bother me.

I think companionship is a perfectly legitimate job and a good enough reason to breed all by itself.

Yes.

 

[SpaceMutt]

This surprises me, as I'm also from NYC and I feel as though so so so many shelter/rescue dogs here are capable of that!! I tend to think in other areas people might have a hard time finding those kinds of dogs in shelters because of the prevalence of working/farm/hunting dogs or just dogs that can be kind of unruly out in rural areas as pets, but I come across quite a few nearly bombproof rescue dogs, and far more that are easily manageable pets.

Huh, interesting! Maybe I've just had weird luck? I fully admit that I've only been heavily invested in dogs for a few years, I'm sure my experiences will fill out and change, but yeah, up to this point in both the NYC and the DC area, I've encountered a LOT of people winding up with dogs that make life for their owners difficult. The places where they got those dogs varies, but it's the same across the board. I'm glad you see a lot of success!

Also, I didn't mean to disparage rescue dogs by saying that, hopefully it didn't come across that way...In many ways, the more time goes on the more I think being a grade A pet, especially in a city, is actually just as difficult as the various other more lauded work we ask of dogs. Many of the pet owners I know outside of the "doggy world" require their dogs to essentially never be snarky, never be reactive, never be hyper, never be guardy, never have stranger danger or even THINK of being weird around kids, and always be up for a romp around the park and a cuddle from a stranger (but again, with 0 hyperness or overarousal issues). Like I said, maybe I've just had weird luck but I don't meet too many dogs that fit that description period, from either breeders or rescues. That's why I feel there should be breeders who are actually breeding toward this new ideal - I see it so commonly wanted from potential owners, and then they're heartbroken when their dog doesn't fit the bill. And for better or worse, I don't think the demands culturally placed on dogs are going to be lowered, I think if anything they're going to continue to be raised.

 

[Bruschnazzy]

I will never call my dogs Miniature American Shepherds. They will always be Miniature Australian Shepherds. To myself (and breeders of both, for that matter), they are not the same breed. Each is breeding for different things now.

I love crossbreeds and I don't care if you breed them. Breed them for work, breed them for pets, breed them because you want to. Heck, breed crossbreeds or purebreds for all that reason. Just do it with moral and I could care less. I even find seeing what comes out of it, FUN. Fun to see what someone can get crossing certain breeds.

I like fluffy show lines. THERE. I don't believe fluff ruins a breed.

I will judge you if you can't train a dog without using a prong, choke lead, shock collar, etc.

Malinois are not special snowflake creatures who are unlike any other dog out there. You don't need to be a God to be able to handle them. They're a dog, who has mental and physical demands just like any other breed.

I am not for cropping, docking, or dewclaw removal. I'll accept sometimes I need to accept in when looking for future dogs/puppies, but it makes me cringe.

If you're a force free trainer, but are all for cropping & docking, I'll judge you. You can't have a certain collar on your dog, but go ahead and chop them up (and yes, I'm force free/+R, but I still find that silly).

I like merle, and I think a lot of breeds who have had it added in look great with the color. I could say, I like off standard colors in general.

While I don't like choke leads in training, I do like how they can look on a dog, so don't mind them being on a dog for looks. Especially a nice, sleek black dog.

If you shock your dog's genitals to get them to point, I hope you get your hands chopped off.

That's all I can think of right now, but don't worry I'm sure there is more. :lol-sign:

 

[PlottMom]

While I don't like choke leads in training, I do like how they can look on a dog, so don't mind them being on a dog for looks. Especially a nice, sleek black dog.

Mother & daughter, my fav photos of either of them.

 

[busannie]

Anymore when I hear people railing about how they feed their dog only "grain free" food and that's what every dog should eat, I look around to make sure there aren't any sharp objects nearby. I don't have anything against grain free foods and have fed them, but the people doing the preaching about it usually have no idea that their grain free kibble isn't all meat and really, is potato much better for a dog than rice barring a specific intolerance? And people tout it as a cure all for every condition- I could tell one of these individuals my dog has kidney failure and needs a low protein/phosphorus diet or bladder stones and needs a dissolution diet and they would go on about how grain free is just the ticket to cure those ails. I'm all for people feeding better food, and think certain food companies' advertising campaigns have been great to bring concern about the quality of dog food to peoples' attention, but hearing day in and day out that it's the only way from people who don't really even understand what they're promoting or why drives me nuts.

My chondrodysplastic dogs run, jump, and play tug, even after one had an episode of IVDD (well, Annie doesn't now that she's extremely old and decrepit). They're active dogs, and while I could try to restrict them, sometimes that fails even with lazy, sedentary dogs, whose backs go out walking down a single step- I'd rather let them do all the things, and just try to keep them in good shape.

I get annoyed by individuals who say, "X breed should never _____", though at the same time, I strongly encourage some breed specific cautions. Both my dachshunds are off leash regularly (have read/been told more than once that they should never be off leash outside of a fence), though I don't encourage others to do it, I don't have any strong aversion if they do- most are so fat they can't get far anyway.

On the other hand, I do caution individuals who get (usually their first) bull breeds and have other dogs not to leave them alone together or take them to dog parks where they could get into a brawl and in trouble. Judging by the hairy eyes I get in response, I would say that these individuals consider it controversial advice, lol.

 

[*blackrose]

I think grain inclusive, yes, even CORN inclusive, foods can be just as healthy and good for a dog than a grain free food.

I don't care about people breeding dogs for companions. I don't even care about people breeding a line of "watered down" dogs of a certain breed in order to make good, average companions. (So long as there is a demand and the breeding is being done responsibly, of course.)

I don't care how you train your dog, or what tools you use, as long as your dog is having fun, you're having fun, and you are seeing the results you'd like. Prong, purely positive, stim collar, harness, I don't care.

I don't care about cropping/docking *IF* proper pain protocols are followed, including aftercare.

I know just as many crazy rescues as I do breeders. One is not inherently better than the other. Either the people running them OR the dogs available through them.

Holistic/all natural preventions and remedies have their place. As do medications. Medications are not evil.

 

[Laurelin]

I really do not understand conformation showing at all. Like... I've been involved at a marginal level in the past but the older I get, the more ludicrous it all gets. I don't think all conformation breeders are bad (some are quite good) but the system itself is just so downright bizarre.

 

[Locke]

I really do not understand conformation showing at all. Like... I've been involved at a marginal level in the past but the older I get, the more ludicrous it all gets. I don't think all conformation breeders are bad (some are quite good) but the system itself is just so downright bizarre.

Agree 10000%

 

[GipsyQueen]

I think Flexi leashes are great if used correctly. We use one when Zora can't go off lead, but we pretend it's not there - she needs to listen as if she were off lead.

I really don't like cropping and docking. Beauces and Dobes look so much better uncropped. I think it's great that it's illegal here in Germany.

I tend to not like show lines (in most dogs.) because of looks. Esp. German Shepherds.

 

[JessLough]

I love flexis. It's pretty much all I ever used with Rosey, regardless of where we were.

Doodles are great. Every one I've met, the family has been super happy with them. Not my cup of tea, but I love that they are filling a niche.

Your "average pet owner" can, indeed, get a working bred dog and the dog can be happy and healthy and thriving. I see it all the time at work. Even breeds that are regarded as magical unicorns that only like 5 people actually have the ability to properly own.

I fully believe that, in general, the "average pet owner" is a made up fantasy by "dog people" to stroke their own egos about how great of an owner they are. Rarely do I meet somebody as bad as what is often toted as your "average pet owner", and when I do, 9 times out of 10 they're willing to learn.

Alter, leave intact, remove dewclaws, keep dewclaws, rescue, buy from a breeder, feed orijen, feed Dog Chow, I don't care, it doesn't affect me. Just make sure you're making an informed decision and doing what's best for you and your pet.

They hype of a raw food diet is ridiculous, coming from a raw feeder. If it works for you, great! You shouldn't have to make up ridiculous "magical qualities".

Yes, Orijen costs more than Dog Chow. No, you're not always feeding less of it, let alone feeding an amount less that is going to make up the price difference.

 

[Moth]

Add me to the people that advocate outcrossing and open stud books.

Genetic diversity people learn it, live it, love it! We have genetically bottlenecked pretty much all of our dog breeds outcrossing is the only way to fix some of the sadness and misery we have created!!!

I am not a big fan of pediatric spay and neuter. I understand why rescues and shelters do it... but I still do not like it.

 

[SpringerLover]

I really do not understand conformation showing at all. Like... I've been involved at a marginal level in the past but the older I get, the more ludicrous it all gets. I don't think all conformation breeders are bad (some are quite good) but the system itself is just so downright bizarre.

Yes. So much yes.