How to fix this

[Laurelin]

I know I've asked this before but we're still (obviously) struggling with it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5KsfpvEsLkM

[youtube]5KsfpvEsLkM[/youtube]

I know I could band aid it with a leash but... I am guessing we need to do some work with just entering and exiting the back door and make it less exciting for her?

I'm bad at this kind of stuff. Stupid tricks, I can do that. Stopping screaming... not much.

ETA: Apologies for my messy porch with my hose and weave poles everywhere.

 

[DenoLo]

I'm definitely no expert, but what if you practice just opening the door and walking out with her instead of the stay? Give her something else to do right after you open the door like heel or sit?

 

[Laurelin]

If you just walk out with her she does the same thing. She KNOWS when I'm about to let them out regardless of what I do or don't say and she always beats me to the door then starts up. She's super fast and can dart between furniture easily. I had hoped the stay would have her calm down a bit and think but I think it makes the buildup worse?

She'll behave almost immediately after the first screech (maybe 5 seconds of that) then is ready to go do whatever.

 

[SpringerLover]

Can you play door games like you'd play "stay in your crate" games. She has to choose to sit there. Work up to being calm. Enough reps and it should be boring old news going outside.

 

[Oko]

Maybe try practicing doing the whole routine, but the door doesn't open, you feed her some treats, and then you guys walk away and nothing happens? And then build up to opening it, closing it, same thing they don't go out and walking away? I would think that would make it less exciting because it doesn't always mean zomg freedom!, just an idea.

 

[DenoLo]

So it's just getting rid of that one 5 second scream? I know it's a band aide, but what if you taught her to carry something out with her? Maybe I'm underestimating the Mia to think she can't scream with something in her mouth:rofl1: this is something I do with Lucy, harder to be reactive when your carrying a stick in your mouth.

 

[Xandra]

I wouldn't give her a stay command, I'd just prevent her from exiting in whatever way you can (ideally foot block, general "no" if you have that, but if necessary a leash) until she gets super bored and is genuinely distracted for a couple seconds (e.g. looks behind her or something). At that point you can give her the release command... if that works, good. If not then don't give her a release command when she gets distracted. Instead just stop preventing her from going out.

That's how I got Roman to calm down about getting in the van. Before he was a jumping salivating screeching mess, now he stands at the door with his tail slowly waving and hops in politely.

It takes time and patience though. There were times I waited 20 minutes until he got distracted. If that isn't practical you could try throwing a ball in the other direction and then when her mind goes "ball" give her the release to go outside, and maybe when you don't have time to work on it, pick her up and put her outside or somethign so you don't undo any progress in teaching her that she's gotta be calm before she can go through the doorway.

 

[Laurelin]

Those are great ideas! I had kind of tossed around the crate games thing in my head but haven't really tried it. I do think that could potentially help.

I have done some walking to the door then nothing happens and it confuses her so she'll start whining then start demand barking like 'You just acted like you were letting me out. Let me out NAOW!' You can stop that by telling her to go to her place and cool down but it's a long process.

She only does this with the back door, not any other door in the house.

 

[Whisper]

I just want to pop in and say the ideas put forth are all good ones. Any way to make it less exciting for her. She kept her stay like a good girl, but you can tell she was just BURSTING to go before you released her.

 

[Laurelin]

So it's just getting rid of that one 5 second scream? I know it's a band aide, but what if you taught her to carry something out with her? Maybe I'm underestimating the Mia to think she can't scream with something in her mouth:rofl1: this is something I do with Lucy, harder to be reactive when your carrying a stick in your mouth.

She will drop objects on her way out the door. Once she sees you're at the door, the ball is dropped and then she starts ramping up for the run out the door.

Yeah I'd just like to make potty breaks a quieter event.

I wouldn't give her a stay command, I'd just prevent her from exiting in whatever way you can (foot block, leash etc) until she gets super bored and is genuinely distracted for a couple seconds (e.g. looks behind her or something). At that point you can give her the release command... if that works, good. If not then don't give her a release command when she gets distracted. Instead just stop preventing her from going out.

That's how I got Roman to calm down about getting in the van. Before he was a jumping salivating screeching mess, now he stands at the door with his tail slowly waving and hops in politely.

It takes time and patience though. There were times I waited 20 minutes until he got distracted. If that isn't practical you could try throwing a ball in the other direction and then when her mind goes "ball" give her the release to go outside, and maybe when you don't have time to work on it, pick her up and put her outside or somethign so you don't undo any progress in teaching her that she's gotta be calm before she can go through the doorway.

Both good ideas. I've done some blocking (mostly just sliding the door shut so she can't get out). Eventually she just locks on to me like I put her in a stay anyways and waits for an okay. And then she screams. When we had the tree in the back yard she'd run out to the tree and bite it but now it's been removed. Sometimes she goes after Summer, which is annoying to poor Summer.

Distracting her could work but Im not sure if that would carry over. I think whatever I try it's going to take some time. I tend to get frustrated with this stuff and give up and think 'eh... I can live with that'. Which is horrible and lazy.

 

[sassafras]

If you leash her or pick her up and carry her outside, does she still scream? Because anything you do to just break the habit is going to help beyond just being a band-aid. Just like managing anything else to prevent practicing it while you are also training at the same time.

What I might do is carry her outside and only put her down when she is calm. If she's vibrating, I'd wait or go back into the house.

 

[Laurelin]

She won't scream but she will start flailing all about and trying to work her way free. She will scream, though less so at THIS point (I'd imagine it could easily grow), if you unclip her leash. That really happens just about anywhere though. At the park, etc.

She is very very good about coming in when I call or if I tell her to leash up or let me pick her up she does with no complaints. But that initial unclipping will often times make her scream and run all around like that. So I guess at this point you'd just leash her in the yard always and work the calmness up to where she can tolerate being unclipped?

So it does carry over to other aspects of her life beyond the back door.

And Summer is perfect and waits behind me for me to open the door then just trots outside.

 

[Xandra]

Both good ideas. I've done some blocking (mostly just sliding the door shut so she can't get out). Eventually she just locks on to me like I put her in a stay anyways and waits for an okay. And then she screams. When we had the tree in the back yard she'd run out to the tree and bite it but now it's been removed. Sometimes she goes after Summer, which is annoying to poor Summer.

Distracting her could work but Im not sure if that would carry over. I think whatever I try it's going to take some time. I tend to get frustrated with this stuff and give up and think 'eh... I can live with that'. Which is horrible and lazy.

Yeah the locking on is the crux of the whole thing IME, with the method I've used you've got to wait until the locking on part breaks for a second or two (you can extend this time as she catches on). For Roman it would just be a second where his mind wandered and he stopped panting and crying and turned toward a weird noise or smell or something.

Not saying stay doesn't necessarily prevent the tension and anticipation but right now "stay" in that context is basically a cue for "WAIT FOR IT WAIT FOR IT" and that doesn't help.

Intentionally distracting does not work as well as just waiting for them to get so bored that they distract themselves (it will happen eventually, but holy hell it can take a long time...), but I thought she was like that at all doors, and you can't really wait her out everytime she has to take a pee Since she only does it at one door I'd avoid using that door unless you have the time and patience to block and wait.

 

[Laurelin]

Sadly that is the only back door. So we'd have to take her out front and through the side gate to put her in the yard if we avoided the door.

What I don't get is you can let her out- off leash- through the front door or garage door just fine. She waits to be asked out and trots out calmly and will wait by the house If i tell her to or load up I I tell her to. Somehow she knows frot yard is not for playing in though.

She has been like this about potty breaks in other houses weve lived at too

 

[Finkie_Mom]

One thing that helped my guys and Pen especially is to let them out and bring them right back in a bunch of times in a row. So they never know how long they will be out, and it gets less exciting being out there versus coming in to me. Sitting/waiting at the door (even crate games stuff at the door) didn't work for Pen, as his MO outside is squirrel patrol and squirrels trump all things ever. So once he was waiting at the door quietly (for only like a second or the anticipation would hype him up even more) I let him out, then ran back inside and played tug. Let him out like right away, brought him inside for a treat. And on and on and on. I switched up the reward so he wouldn't start barking while coming IN (tug>treat for him), and it was a constant in/out. Like crate games but without the sit/stay before the release (I built that in later). He's gotten a LOT better about it, but every once and a while I will still hear him bark a couple of times while running out. Much better than barking his fool head off as I walked to the door, and continuing it outside, though LOL.

Obviously I did this with multiple sessions, just like training anything else.

 

[AllyssaH]

I haven't read any of the other comments since I'm being lazy, so I apologize if someone has already said this. But maybe try making her sit in front of the open door and don't let her out until she sits there calmly. In the video the second that door opens she immediately starts getting tense. And then if you do get her to go out there calmly: if you don't like her barking, bring her immediately inside the second she barks. (A leash would probably help with that so she can't run away.) It might take a while, but hopefully it will help.

I know I have this issue too. Our dog Jack has figured out that every time he barks we bring them inside, so he's constantly barking outside and I don't have the heart to leave them out there because of our neighbors.