Experiences With Importing?

[Equinox]

Preferably from a country and breeder that speaks a different language, because that's the difficulty I am dealing with now.

Am considering importing a pup for my next dog, but I'm not quite sure how to convey what I want because I don't speak German, and the breeders don't speak English. Google Translate can only get us so far. Any advice?

Also, generally how much of a hassle is it getting paper work done? This pup will also need to be papered, but I don't even know the basics of what is required as far as vaccinations, certificates of health, etc.

And, if someone does not mind sharing, how much more does it cost to import as far as fees?

Looking 1 - 2 years in the future, of course, but because of how little I do know, it's a good idea to get started!!

 

[Kat09Tails]

Can I ask what breed and what your intent is? If you're thinking what I think you're thinking I may have a couple ideas for you.

 

[Equinox]

German Shepherd Dog - not for breeding, but I do require "pink/red papers" because I intend to show. Will be showing under the SV and training in Schutzhund as well.

Would love to hear what you have to say. This has given me a headache for a while.

 

[Kat09Tails]

Well my advice to you is to look at someone who imports and brokers actively and then set up the expectations you have for your intended dog. The dog you will want odds are will not be the dog that is openly offered for sale in the country of origin. Remember often times these imports you see coming in are not the better dogs Germany has to offer. Theses are normally titled dogs who just didn't cut the mustard for their own breeding program.

Importing itself has gotten very complicated. Honestly I'm expecting to have to fly and retrieve my new dog myself because of the required broker for importing animals now by US customs. If you fly however you can bring your new dog back with you as your pet.

Finally the other option is to get a dog from the lines you want from a breeder here who imported them and has a vision for a good program and the balls to try to prove it. I know a few very good resources for working line GSDs in this country who are great at working with people, encouraging good training, and can show a track record of producing good dogs.

 

[Equinox]

Should have clarified - I am looking to import a puppy I have already contacted a breeder who has exported plenty of pups to the US before and they have been very helpful. The biggest problem I have to deal with is getting across to them exactly what I want in a pup. I am not looking for a dog that will earn a VA1 rating or excel in Schutzhund. I am just looking for another family pet.

There are several good breeders here in the US I am considering, but there are some very specific lines that I like, and a breeder in Germany who's dogs and lines I have always liked. I want to keep my options open, and as it is possible for me to get a puppy from Germany, I would like to do just that.

Unfortunately, the breeders I know of who do import dogs from the kennels I like are not breeders I would trust to choose a pup for me. Either that, or I have no interest in any of their breedings.

That being said, I haven't looked much into this yet and would appreciate if you could share a few of those resources! Chances are that I actually do not know of them yet

 

[Michiyo-Fir]

A breeder I know had to spend $3500 importing a dog from Europe. The shipping and paper work to get into the country cost a lot of money. Also this was an already titled dog, I'm not sure if that played into the cost of the dog.

Personally if I was importing I would ask a breeder that has imported dogs from the prospective breeder before for help in terms of paper work, how much everything costed, etc.

 

[Linds]

Well, I imported Traveler but my breeder spoke English and Australia is considered rabies free so no quarantine, I just needed written documentation from a vet stating he was born there, the markings, color, breed, sex, a written statement, DOB, date this was all written and the vets name, address and phone number.

The US tends to be pretty lax about dogs coming into the country it seems. I believe a vet visit and rabies shot is all that is needed if not from a rabies free country, and if the pup is too young to be vaccinated against rabies then it needs to be quarantined at your house on your word until it is old enough to be vaccinated and then for 30 days afterward.

In all honesty I did nothing for the importation of him other than pay my breeder and show up at the cargo hold. Everything was taken care of by him and another man on their side of the pond and Gary from Jet Set N Pets in Cali, all I did was show up.

Here's the CDC site and I did call them before any of this got going to make sure I got all the info and clarified some things

CDC - Bringing an Animal into U.S.: Dogs - Animal Importation

And this was given to me by the guy I spoke to at the CDC

USDA - APHIS - Import and Export

It cost me about 1800 not including the dog

 

[Equinox]

A breeder I know had to spend $3500 importing a dog from Europe. The shipping and paper work to get into the country cost a lot of money. Also this was an already titled dog, I'm not sure if that played into the cost of the dog.

Personally if I was importing I would ask a breeder that has imported dogs from the prospective breeder before for help in terms of paper work, how much everything costed, etc.

I do find that older titled dogs go for more than puppies, but $3500 actually is what I have heard being quoted for puppies, too. Considering some breeders here in the States price their "super duper stellar breeding quality" puppies at $3500 - $4000, it's not all that unreasonable.

I have thought of asking breeders for help, but I think there are breeders out there who actually charge people when they aid them in importing.

Well, I imported Traveler but my breeder spoke English and Australia is considered rabies free so no quarantine, I just needed written documentation from a vet stating he was born there, the markings, color, breed, sex, a written statement, DOB, date this was all written and the vets name, address and phone number.

The US tends to be pretty lax about dogs coming into the country it seems. I believe a vet visit and rabies shot is all that is needed if not from a rabies free country, and if the pup is too young to be vaccinated against rabies then it needs to be quarantined at your house on your word until it is old enough to be vaccinated and then for 30 days afterward.

In all honesty I did nothing for the importation of him other than pay my breeder and show up at the cargo hold. Everything was taken care of by him and another man on their side of the pond and Gary from Jet Set N Pets in Cali, all I did was show up.

Here's the CDC site and I did call them before any of this got going to make sure I got all the info and clarified some things

CDC - Bringing an Animal into U.S.: Dogs - Animal Importation

And this was given to me by the guy I spoke to at the CDC

USDA - APHIS - Import and Export

It cost me about 1800 not including the dog

Thank you for the link and information! I thought of you and Traveler when I was making this post, but realized people in Australia spoke English. Go figure

Nonetheless, very helpful information. I do hope that importing from Germany in my situation would go as smoothly.

 

[release the hounds]

I know this is transaction is still a year or two off, but I gotta say it has disaster written all over it. Don't take things I say to personally, it's just how I write things.

But first off you say you just want a family pet? why, would you want to deal with all the pitfalls that come with importing a pup, especially a GSD. I know a lot of transactions go smoothly, but a lot go horribly wrong, with some losing tens of thousands and still no dog, to dogs with bad hips and no replacement, to spending 10K and getting a dog that's afraid of blowing grass and missing teeth, but it's a "top prospect"

unless you have lots of money to burn and just want to say you imported a puppy, I'd avoid that like the plague. There are a lot of excellent dogs being bred right here in the US. The breeders are spread out, but they're here.

If it's not just a "pet" you want, but a show dog, unless you're dropping big coin, know the breeders personally, have a foot in the door and play the show game, you are NOT going to get their best dogs. Dogs you can compete and win with.

If you're not concerned with winning or breeding, but just to have the experience, you can get a fine dog from some small breeder and likely to get a decent dog. If you go to a big time breeder you're more likely to get a dog that is less than average, because to them, you're most likely just a small fish who'll never take their dog or know people that will let you play the game to get them more recognition.

I've seen this story play out multiple times and I gotta say the only ones that turn out, are the ones doing more than email and phone calls. The ones that turn out either know personally and trust somebody that goes to Europe and tests and selects dogs and brings them back, They have enough experience to go and do that themselves, or they buy dogs here.

I'd have to kick off my shoes and still ask for help counting all the times a new person came out for training or even someone we knew, who was still enamoured with the "importing a pup" label would show up with a puppy or young dog with "training" and it was a disaster.

The worst rides, or best depending on your perspective, are given to the ones that are just a name with money on the other side of a telephone or email. A reference to a Steve Miller Band song comes to mind.

 

[JennSLK]

I do have to agree with RTH.

However, if all goes well and you get a nice puppy importing isn't all that hard. I'm assuming your in the US or Canada. You need a cert from a vet saying the puppy is healthy enough for the journey. Importing can be very expensive. Friends of mine just imported a Crestie (so alot smaller) from Slovakia and it cost $1500-$1700 just for the flight. You can go with a company who specializes in relocating pets, and they could help you. They are more expensive though. I would say put aside $2000 for the shipping costs + the price of the puppy.

Germany is rabies free is it not? If a puppy is over 6 months it needs a rabies vacc. Other than that there are no requirements (Into Canada/US).

Find someone who speaks German and is willing to help you email the breeder.

 

[ACooper]

Find someone who speaks German and is willing to help you email the breeder.

Pretty sure we have a few German speakers right here Jules (I think) and Gypsy come to mind right off the bat.....Gypsy is actually IN Germany, so that could help too if she's willing/able

 

[Equinox]

I know this is transaction is still a year or two off, but I gotta say it has disaster written all over it. Don't take things I say to personally, it's just how I write things.

But first off you say you just want a family pet? why, would you want to deal with all the pitfalls that come with importing a pup, especially a GSD. I know a lot of transactions go smoothly, but a lot go horribly wrong, with some losing tens of thousands and still no dog, to dogs with bad hips and no replacement, to spending 10K and getting a dog that's afraid of blowing grass and missing teeth, but it's a "top prospect"

unless you have lots of money to burn and just want to say you imported a puppy, I'd avoid that like the plague. There are a lot of excellent dogs being bred right here in the US. The breeders are spread out, but they're here.

If it's not just a "pet" you want, but a show dog, unless you're dropping big coin, know the breeders personally, have a foot in the door and play the show game, you are NOT going to get their best dogs. Dogs you can compete and win with.

If you're not concerned with winning or breeding, but just to have the experience, you can get a fine dog from some small breeder and likely to get a decent dog. If you go to a big time breeder you're more likely to get a dog that is less than average, because to them, you're most likely just a small fish who'll never take their dog or know people that will let you play the game to get them more recognition.

I've seen this story play out multiple times and I gotta say the only ones that turn out, are the ones doing more than email and phone calls. The ones that turn out either know personally and trust somebody that goes to Europe and tests and selects dogs and brings them back, They have enough experience to go and do that themselves, or they buy dogs here.

I'd have to kick off my shoes and still ask for help counting all the times a new person came out for training or even someone we knew, who was still enamoured with the "importing a pup" label would show up with a puppy or young dog with "training" and it was a disaster.

The worst rides, or best depending on your perspective, are given to the ones that are just a name with money on the other side of a telephone or email. A reference to a Steve Miller Band song comes to mind.

I actually greatly respect and look forward to your opinions, so thank you for your input I don't mind a person who says it like it is.

I think that the lack of general concern over the dangers of importing is directly related to the good experiences I have heard from puppy importers. Many people I have asked who have imported their German Shepherds or Belgian Malinois as puppies have gotten a good dog out of that, and the ones who were "cheated" were the ones who imported titled adult dogs, expecting a top breeding/show quality dog.

Absolutely NOT saying this is the norm, just explaining exactly why I didn't immediately link the idea of importing to a disaster waiting to happen.

Frankly, I don't care if my dog is missing teeth or if his ears never stand. I plan to pay the money so I have the papers and option of showing, but if a dog is nice in all other aspects and has missing teeth, I won't feel I got ripped off. And of course, I definitely do not want to import for the sake of having an import. I don't care for ego boosters

I just have very specific lines and types that I like. There are a few kennels in Germany who have been around for decades with a good reputation, and at that point, I am just thinking, if I cannot find these lines in the States, why not import? The lines are well established and well known, as are the breeders. I feel that even if we are talking about breeders from a different country, I would feel more comfortable with these breeders than with the ones here in the States, breeding similar lines.

I am already exchanging e-mails with these breeders about their dogs and their breeding program. The only problem is, is that I don't know how to get across what type of dog I want, when I eventually am ready to buy a pup. Like I said, Google Translate only gets us so far.

It is not the idea of importing a pup I am enamored with, but the lines I prefer. I see the fact that the dogs and breeders are Germany as a problem and inconvenience more than anything. But if it gets down to trust, I can tell you right now that I do NOT trust the breeders here who breed closely to these lines. I just do not wish to be limited to the US when there are dogs I prefer out in Europe.

Of course, still want to hear your advice and opinion. I am not dead set on importing, not at all.

 

[crazy_paws]

I looked at importing a crested a few years ago. It would have been $1800 ish with dog included.

 

[release the hounds]

I guess I don't really know what you're looking for in a dog.

In my opinion to get a good GSD you have to be really involved, or just extremely lucky.

For me, I have quite high standards for what I expect, and to find that I have to know what i'm getting into. the more litter mates, half mates, parents, parents siblings, etc I can see and work the better.

If I had a timeline and "needed" a dog by a certain date, i guess going oversees to do this work would be eaiser for me, as I know people and can test a lot of dogs in a short amount of time.

But I don't. I work lots of dogs here over time, know what I like, and when the right dog comes along I get it.

I suppose with showing it would be similiar. You have to know who's producing what, and with what consistency. To me showing, well I'll keep those thoughts to myself. But i've done enough work for those that are involved in showing to have some good ideas of how it works. Lots of based on names of dogs and handlers, and who is breeding and who's pockets they are lining back in Germany. At least at the top, and even down into smaller club shows too.

If showing in AKC? they dislike German type dogs more than we dislike Am-bred showlines.

But in the end, i'm never to concerned with "lines". If I had a dollar for everytime i've seen a less than adequate dog and was told he had "good lines" or they were going to breed him or her because they had "good lines" i'd be filthy effin rich right now. you have to train and work/show the dog in front of you, not it's lines. True in the show ring they pay alot of attention to "lines" but if you just want a nice dog to show with, and a dog that is what you want inside, the lines don't really matter.

in my experience, more often than not those that are not that involved in the breed, but decide they're going to show, do schutzhund, breed, etc and go and get a dog or puppy, usually quit when they find out they made a bad choice, or end up doing those things years later when they learn fromt he mistakes they made the first time and get dogs more suitable the next time around.

dont' get me wrong, it's just as easy to get taken for a ride by a breeder right here in the US, lots of those dirty SOB's around. But experience and involvement can get you past that.

I think it's a lot easier to be involved here, than by going overseas with people you can't communicate with and will most likely never meet personally. Then in time, when you have experience, have connections, and know a bit more, it's easier.

 

[AdrianneIsabel]

I have been told a lot of the time Americans get send the less than desirable dogs as imports. I hate to believe it's true but I've heard it so many times it's hard to think it's not at least somewhat true.

I know of some awesome gsd's you can get in America. What does this particular breeder offer that exceeds anything you can find in america/canada?

 

[Equinox]

Thanks release the hounds for your insight. Will be doing some reconsidering.

Technically, I guess I am looking at a timeline. I will definitely not be getting another dog this year, but if I do not get one in 2 years, I will not be able to for the next 10 - 15+ years, just because of my situation. I am not one to usually rush things, but I will admit I am not keen on waiting that long.

Anyway, I guess I did get lucky with my first GSD, then. Found a breeder I trusted and liked, met the parents once, and that was it. Brought home a great puppy, and a great GSD. Everything I asked for and more.

I think you misunderstand my intentions - pet first, Schutzhund dog secondly. Showing is an afterthought. I am getting working lines, not show lines.

Is there any chance you could explain to me, however, why everyone I know who's imported a GSD puppy got the perfect pup for them? Honestly no sarcasm, I am really curious. I never thought it'd be a breeze, but I keep hearing good experiences, even from first time GSD owners who imported a sports prospect.

I have been told a lot of the time Americans get send the less than desirable dogs as imports. I hate to believe it's true but I've heard it so many times it's hard to think it's not at least somewhat true.

lol It's definitely true xD

I know of some awesome gsd's you can get in America. What does this particular breeder offer that exceeds anything you can find in america/canada?

Me, too, but here's my thought - if it even exceeds slightly, or if I just have an overall preference, I don't want to one day feel like I "settled" when I paid the money.

Like I said several times before, the only thing I am trying to do is keep my options open.

 

[release the hounds]

working people tend to get better dogs overall I think. I guess what's "perfect" i know lots of people that love their dogs, but they certainly aren't doing what they had envisioned with them. not the people that went in not knowing anything anyway.

did these people without the help of anyone just email a breeder and get a puppy that grew up to be titled and tested? or are they just dogs they play with and love?

and who's everyone? I can say we get about 30-50 people that were previously unknown to us a year that come with their imported puppy or dog with big visions and find out their puppy or dog doesn't come with everything they were "sold". Most drop out completely because they're too frustrated. Some stick with it, learn and in a year or two get another one that is able to do the sport they want at a level they want.

I'm not saying you can't get a good dog by importing, obviously a lot of people do. both of my dogs were bred here, one by imported parents, whom I've worked and love. I know a few that compete in ring too, most have Mal's bred here, some imported and all have been on a national team, so obviously good dogs come from overseas. I wouldn't hesitate to get a dog from belgium, the netherlands or Germany at this point at all.

But my point being, why? If a good companion dog that may do schutzhund or show is your goal, why go thru the hassle of importing and the cost? me personally, I like to see what i'm buying before I buy it, or at least know who i'm dealing with on a personal level and know the dogs that came before. I can do that with ease here, going to Germany is a once every few years thing, and that is for vacation usually. My wife would kill me if I spent too much time checking out dogs.

 

[Jynx]

are you on the gsd board? German Shepherd Dog Forums

There is a member there, Mrs K, who is from germany, and right now still in Germany (her husband is military,she will be coming to the states very soon),,anyhow, you might want to hook up with her and here's why..Her parents were/are gsd breeders who have had some very well known dogs in their time, she most likely knows the lines your looking for, who to contact, maybe even translate for you?

I am sure she would be more than happy to help you out, she has 3 gsd's of her own, and is also getting a puppy. I would have to say, IF I were looking to import from germany, and wanted to speak to someone from there, she is who I'd be asking since I don't really know anyone else other than a broker.

On another note, there was a recent 'horror' story about another poster on the board, they purchase a 8mth old male from a very very well known kennel , the puppy was imported, and they received the WRONG dog!! That would be my kinda luck Turned out good, she loves this dog and will keep him, but in fact it was the wrong dog

Also to add, I agree with Release above^^^ , while I know your looking for a specific line, I'd rather take my chances with the many wonderful dogs right here vs import.. My female is out of an imported bitch, love her to death, but just sending her cross country was enough stress for me)

 

[Equinox]

Sorry for the late reply, thanks guys. I guess instead of really having an answer to "why?" (besides a "because I can"), it was really more a matter of "why not?". I did not see the much greater risks, as you put it, of an imported dog compared to a dog shipped over from a breeder in the States on the other side of the country. I am leaning towards staying within the US now.

Jynx, I did (and still am) considering a Eurosport dog, although your post reminds me - Kleinen Hain breeds some great dogs that are very close to the lines I like. Not sure why I forgot about them, but your post reminded me!

Will browse through the board (and yes, I am a member ) and try to find that horror story. I am not on that specific forum much anymore (prefer Val's board generally) and am interested in hearing more about this.

 

[Jules]

Pretty sure we have a few German speakers right here Jules (I think) and Gypsy come to mind right off the bat.....Gypsy is actually IN Germany, so that could help too if she's willing/able

Yep, I'm German (in the States though)
and I can help you with some emails.