Dog aggression.

[babymomma]

Im helping "train" a JRT That is dog aggressive. Im working with the little knowledge That I Have.. BUt she s doing SO much better just in the last 2 days.. I let her greet keely (Im just using keely to help with training first, dont want to overwhelm her)... And if she reacts badley while walking towards her. I correct her (Quick collar pop).. I have keely sit stay and we walk towards keely and I reward her when she does good. If she reacts either bit badley (Even the slightest roll of the lip) she gets corrected. She responds SO well to corrections. So i believe that is the best way to go with her. I took her for a walk with me and keely today for the first time and Im teaching her to follow me.. She isnt allowed to pull or be in front ofme. She is learning that her place is at my heel.

Her and keely had a bit of a scuffle today.. They got into a minor fight that looked and SOUNDED worse then it actually was.. They were bearing teeth and rolling around and making sounds but no actuall biting:shrug: Thats the first time.. I know that she cant get a proper trainer. And I know That I can do this (There has been so much progress in 2 days!) They run around and play but sometimes she reacts badley.

So, do anybody have any advice for me? Any personal experiances?..
Any excersizes i could be doing to help the process?

I really want to help her. Ive fallen in love with her already:shrug:.. I cant help in.. Im a shmuck. ..

I need to learn for her sake.

 

[adojrts]

Having had, bred, rescued, hunted and competed with Jrts for years, I would NOT recommend corrections as you have discribed. It may work to a degree but it does not change the desire nor modify the behaviour when your not there especially, it just suspresses it.

The first question I would want to know is she really DA or not socialized which results in her not knowing how to behave or is she Fear-Aggressive?

Jrts need to learn boundries to be sure, but doing it with corrections will often back fire on you. I have had the best luck with plain training, teaching manners, how not to be rude to other dogs and proper socializing etc. And that training was done with positive reinforcements, no phyical corrects etc.

Ado Jack Russell Terriers.

 

[elegy]

please don't try to do this without knowing what you're doing. correcting the dog is the wrong way to go about modifying this dog's behavior. if the dog is reacting, you're proceeding too quickly. back up. go slower. reward the dog HEAVILY for not reacting to the other dog, especially if the dog looks and does not react. do attention work, practice behaviors he knows at a distance from the other dog at which he is comfortable and relaxed. then very very slowly move it closer. quit before you've gone too far. practice by REWARDING not by punishing. the last thing you want to do with an aggressive dog is use physical punishment.

do not put her in a position to aggress toward another dog. do not set her up to fail. the more times she gets to practice the behavior, the more ingrained it will be and the harder it will be to change.

try the book click to calm by emma parsons or the book aggression in dogs by brenda aloff.

 

[OutlineACDs]

I agree with Ado. Chances are the corrections are working because of shock value. Picture a big guy walking up to you, slapping you in the back and telling you to "Sit up straight." You probably would. I know I would. This is basically what you did with this dog.

In order to really work through aggression there needs to be lots of positive reinforcement. Look into buying the "Click to Calm" book. In my experience, the owner needs to be the one to work through these issues. There needs to be a certain bond and daily work from the caregiver to really make big breakthroughs with aggressive dogs. Its not the same as sending your dog to a trainer to learn to sit and stay. Granted, most owners do need to do this under a watchful eye of someone who will work with aggressive dogs.

Kudos to you for helping this lady. You can get some good suggestions from members on this board.

 

[babymomma]

Thanks everybody.. NO more corrections.. got it.
Ive been using ALOT of positive reinforcment also. Ive always found treats helpful but shes wierd. She doesnt like treats. But she loves a good head scratch and a Good girl!

She is undersocialized. But she is also VERY aggresive about it.. She just wants to KILL anydog she see's. As soon as she see's a strange dog she goes balistic..

 

[adojrts]

Thanks everybody.. NO more corrections.. got it.
Ive been using ALOT of positive reinforcment also. Ive always found treats helpful but shes wierd. She doesnt like treats. But she loves a good head scratch and a Good girl!

She is undersocialized. But she is also VERY aggresive about it.. She just wants to KILL anydog she see's. As soon as she see's a strange dog she goes balistic..

But what does she do? Going balistic can be fear-aggression or just plain being offensive, meaning she doesn't want the other dogs to 'get' her first so she goes on the attack and putting up a good front. Does she actually attack another dog by bitting it or does it just look like she is going to? And why would you want to stop a dog from curling it's lip at another dog? That is their warning and if you stop that or correct it, then the dog learns to bite or attack without giving a warning first, same as with growling.

There are better ways to deal with these issues, but learning what the dog is really saying and doing is the first important step. The books recommended are excellent, you should also think about these two books by Patricia McConnell, For the Love of a Dog and Feisty Fido: Help For the Leash-Aggressive Dog., both are also excellent and they are not expensive either.

As a side note, rewards can be anything that the dog values or enjoys, we often have to work hard to find out what works for each dog. And I saw the pic's of her in the photo section, it wont kill her to miss a meal or two if you do decide to use food or treats. I am not saying to starve her on any level but a missed meal or two does work. Also try different homebaked yummy treats, like liver or salmon works on a lot of dogs that don't like store bought treats.

Also keep in mind that food rewards or rewards in general can be hard to use if the dog is already past or peaking towards their threshold (over excited/over the top etc) and if that is the case then you need to move back a to a distance that she can focus on you. But to be fair to the dog, you have to teach her how to focus first and then increase the distractions in stages. Her success rate can be very low if she is overly excited and distracted, so plan you training sessions with care and consideration to what is a reasonable expectation etc.

Good luck

 

[Maxy24]

Yes it's important to remember that there are different types of aggression. One is caused by fear. The dog is scared of other dogs do to poor socialization or an unpleasant event around dogs (something collar pops may make worse since quite a bit of the time he goes near Keely it is resulting in pain/fear for him). The dog then acts aggressively to keep dogs away from him, he is trying to keep himself safe. This can be cured with lots of positive reinforcement. You have to work hard to change the dog's mind about other dogs. Teach him that other dogs are the greatest thing in the world, there is absolutely no reason to be scared of them. Only good things happen around dogs. NEVER push the dog to the point of acting out, if he is you are too close and he is panicking, your goal is for him never to feel that emotion about other dogs again or else it will put training back. You will inch closer, reward him for calmly looking at the other dog and back at you, a clicker would help to mark these small movements. Remember that punishment (your "corrections") do not help to change the dog's view of other dogs. If the dog learns to behave it's not because he now likes dogs as positive methods will do, but it's because he is more scared of your collar pops than of the other dog so he chooses to endure his awful fear of dogs to avoid the collar pops. At the end you have a very frightened dog. You don't want that, it would be better to make him actually like the dogs, then the bad behavior will go away on it's own.


The other type of aggression which is common in terriers is genetic. It's an urge just like the collie's urge to herd, the Greyhound's urge to chase small critters, a retrievers urge to retrieve, or a doberman's urge to guard the house. Terriers often have the urge to kill animals, it is what they were bred to do. This cannot be cured but can be managed. These dogs cannot ever interact with dogs again. Your goal is for the dog to be able to go for a walk, see another dog pass on the street and not lash out. This calls for the dog to learn what it can do instead of lashing out when it sees a dog. Teaching him to watch the owner's face on command is helpful. The dog is not going to try and attack other dogs if he's not looking at them. Then simply rewarding any calm behavior when a dog passes is good, you can use treats as a reward or a tug toy if that works better, he might enjoy getting his frustration out on a tug toy but that is up to the dog. If the dog looks at the owner, reward, looks at the ground, reward, looks anywhere but at the other dog, reward, if he sits, reward, etc. Again, no punishment, you could easily set him off and there is no need to hurt or scare the poor dog. Teach him what he SHOULD do, not what he shouldn't, it's much clearer and easier for the dog that way.


So it is important to find out which aggression she has because it may not be realistic to have the dog interact with Keely ever if it is the second type. Your goal would be for the dog to ignore Keely as you walk around a few feet away (this step will take a while to get to, it's the final goal). the dog would instead focus on the owner's face. If it's the first type of aggression then yes the goal would be for friendly interaction between the dogs. In any case, for now it's too early for the dogs to interact, the dog should never be allowed so close that he lashes out, you first make sure he's perfect at a far away place and then slowly inch closer and work with him there until you are very close. This should take a long time.


Tell us about the dog's body language and vocalizations when he goes after other dogs. ANYTHING you can thing of that he does before, during and right after he tries to attack. Does he only go after dogs coming near him or will he go after dogs that were already moving away from him (say he's walking a distance behind another dog). Think about times he didn't go after a certain dog, what was different about that?


I'm going to also recommend the book "click to calm", it's very, very helpful.

 

[Brattina88]

*chants* Click to Calm, Click to Calm...

Seriously, lots of good information, things to try, etc. Loved that book!