7 y/o boy goes on zoo killing spree

[Buddy'sParents]

No one said he needed to go to jail. Does he need to be arrested? ABSOLUTELY. Jail? No. But this should be on his record FOREVER, in my opinion, and he should be under the care of professionals 3 days ago.

With that aside, I never abused any kind of animal or insect, bug, what have you when I was young, in fact, never in my life have I ever abused anything (save chocolate milk ).

I never poured salt on snails, never pulled bugs legs off, never smooshed a bug. The one exception now is spiders, I have an extreme irrational fear of spiders and while I don't wish for them to die, I simply can not contain myself long enough to help them get out of my way. I grew up on a farm. We had chickens and barn cats, never hurt them. My brother and I would catch lizards so we could look at them and then let them run free. One time, I grabbed one and it's tail come off. I was horrified. I think I may have been in kindergarten. I was so upset, in fact, that I made my parents sit with me to have a memorial service for a lizards tail. Silly? Yes, but that shows how it's not normal for a kid to hurt innocent creatures. So no, I don't think its normal to hurt, maim or otherwise injure ANY kind of creature. Who are we, as humans, to do such a horrifying thing?

And, I agree with Sweet.. a child with that kind of rage... capable of those actions.. at SEVEN... words can not express how saddened and horrified I am.

 

[GSDlover_4ever]

I don't think he needs to go to jail, but he needs to go to a lot of counseling and then some more.

The extreme cruelty against animals and the lack of emotions are signs of psychopathy. And yes, they can be present in children. I think I have seen studies that were concluded with 3 year olds.

:hail:

First off, a THERAPIST cant do anything for this boy, he needs a REAL doctor. And he needs to be taken from his parents and placed in an appropriate facility. Obviously, something is wrong and the authorities take kids away from their parents for WAAAYYY smaller issues than this. He is showing signs of a serial killer, and if this is not dealt with accordingly, he will be a danger to society. What he did is NOT normal, NOR can it be overlooked. A few therapy sessions isnt going to cut it. I dotn care how old that boy is, in my eyes he's a disturbed person, and he needs to know the consequences to his actions. And if that affects his entire life than so be it. This experience should haunt him for the rest of his life. No one forced him to go in there and go on a killing spree. Killing innocent animals is something I will NEVER accept, no matter the age or situation. Unless, someone held a gun to your head and forced you to do it, there is NO excuse. NONE

 

[GSDlover_4ever]

I pulled of a lizards tail too, BP when I was maybe 5 or 6. I was TRAUMATIZED and was hysterical. And when i kill an insect I make sure its dead the first time, so it wont suffer. Sorry I cant live with bugs in the house . I knew and understood death when I was 4, so yeah a 7 year old knows better.

 

[Sunnierhawk0]

I admit, I once killed a frog in my backyard. And I still feel bad to this day. Everytime I see a frog, in my mind I go " IM SORRY!".... its been years and I still remember it.

I think this child has some serious issues that need to be worked out. Hopefully he can get the help he needs, and if his parents didnt know it then, HERES YOUR SIGN YOUR A BAD PARENT.

 

[Whisper]

No one said he needed to go to jail. Does he need to be arrested? ABSOLUTELY. Jail? No. But this should be on his record FOREVER, in my opinion, and he should be under the care of professionals 3 days ago.

With that aside, I never abused any kind of animal or insect, bug, what have you when I was young, in fact, never in my life have I ever abused anything (save chocolate milk ).

I never poured salt on snails, never pulled bugs legs off, never smooshed a bug. The one exception now is spiders, I have an extreme irrational fear of spiders and while I don't wish for them to die, I simply can not contain myself long enough to help them get out of my way. I grew up on a farm. We had chickens and barn cats, never hurt them. My brother and I would catch lizards so we could look at them and then let them run free. One time, I grabbed one and it's tail come off. I was horrified. I think I may have been in kindergarten. I was so upset, in fact, that I made my parents sit with me to have a memorial service for a lizards tail. Silly? Yes, but that shows how it's not normal for a kid to hurt innocent creatures. So no, I don't think its normal to hurt, maim or otherwise injure ANY kind of creature. Who are we, as humans, to do such a horrifying thing?

And, I agree with Sweet.. a child with that kind of rage... capable of those actions.. at SEVEN... words can not express how saddened and horrified I am.

Agreed. I can't count how many memorials my family has had to endure- even for roly poly bugs.

 

[Squishy22]

Snark elaborate don her jail comment with what she actually meant, Reggin.

I was not referring to snark since he/she explained. I was referring to another member... dont remember her name. Back pages ago. We actually got into quite the debate about it.

 

[Squishy22]

No one said he needed to go to jail. Does he need to be arrested? ABSOLUTELY. Jail? No. But this should be on his record FOREVER, in my opinion, and he should be under the care of professionals 3 days ago.

With that aside, I never abused any kind of animal or insect, bug, what have you when I was young, in fact, never in my life have I ever abused anything (save chocolate milk ).

I never poured salt on snails, never pulled bugs legs off, never smooshed a bug. The one exception now is spiders, I have an extreme irrational fear of spiders and while I don't wish for them to die, I simply can not contain myself long enough to help them get out of my way. I grew up on a farm. We had chickens and barn cats, never hurt them. My brother and I would catch lizards so we could look at them and then let them run free. One time, I grabbed one and it's tail come off. I was horrified. I think I may have been in kindergarten. I was so upset, in fact, that I made my parents sit with me to have a memorial service for a lizards tail. Silly? Yes, but that shows how it's not normal for a kid to hurt innocent creatures. So no, I don't think its normal to hurt, maim or otherwise injure ANY kind of creature. Who are we, as humans, to do such a horrifying thing?

And, I agree with Sweet.. a child with that kind of rage... capable of those actions.. at SEVEN... words can not express how saddened and horrified I am.

See some people think killing insects should be a crime (not saying you, but some people do). I dont see a problem with it. In fact I tell reggin to kill and eat crane flies that come into our house. I was brought up into a family who uses fly swatters. It was NORMAL. Yes, I've used salt on slugs because I though it was cool, as a kid. So did my little sister. I used to kill pesky ants that had pincers on them. The only insect I would not kill was caterpillars because I liked them. I was your typical tom boy. It is all in how you are raised, so who is to say what is right and what is wrong? If you were raised a certain way, thats what you know.

I am not speaking about this case in particular, I am speaking about insects.

EDIT:

And about the memorial thing you speak of, I used to bury any dead bird I would find. I just thought it was so sad that they died. I would bury my hamsters when they would die. But at the same time I did not carry insects in the same regard, or snakes. Technically that makes no sense, but from how I was raised, certain animals were higher than others. Shooting a deer was ok, while its not ok to shoot a dog.

 

[Squishy22]

I remember the first time I ever heard that killing an insect was mean. Dont remember how exactly old I was, but I thought it was the weirdest thing I've ever heard. I it was just so weird for me, because I've never met anyone in my entire life that ever felt that way, lol. I just thought it was so bizarre and she had a few screws loose.

Today I am actually a bit more aware and sensitive to killing anything that is alive, such as insects. If I find a spider, I have my fiance come and kill it and I hate to watch. I hate spiders with a passion, and yes, they have got to go or else they WILL come back. We have a HUGE spider problem here.

With mice I've never had a problem with mouse traps because the death is fairly quick. The other year my mom told me that she was catching mice with a sticky tray type thingy. Their feet would get stuck but they were still alive. So she would take the tray and tip it upside down in some water. And watch the mouse drown. A slow death. I was sickened by that and I could not believe she thought that was ok. Thankfully my sis and I talked her into quit using that method.

 

[GSDlover_4ever]

Insects cannot even be compared IMO. I have no problem killing bugs, but I dont do it for fun or enjoyment, and I make sure its dead, so it doesnt suffer. I have a problem when the pain of other animals are used for entertainment purposes for humans.

 

[Squishy22]

Insects cannot even be compared IMO. I have no problem killing bugs, but I dont do it for fun or enjoyment, and I make sure its dead, so it doesnt suffer. I have a problem when the pain of other animals are used for entertainment purposes for humans.

Of course when you are an adult you realize that all living things can feel and you have a better understanding of life. But as a kid I just did not think much about it. I never though that salt was mean to a slug, I just thought it was neat because my uncle showed it to me once. And with the snake thing... I was 5/6 and my cousins killed a couple snakes and pulled the babies out of their stomachs and I thought that was so interesting and got into the action. I would take the babies and lay them out onto a wheel barrel trying to dry them out because I thought they would survive, but of course they did not. I remember cutting a worm in half to see if it would make two. I was a curious kid and I felt that it was a normal thing to do. Go ahead call me a psychopath because I know some would, but I so disagree. As I got older and understood things better, it all changed. Now I am a complete opposite.

 

[Romy]

Just wanted to add that my brothers and I grew up in a farm situation. We helped butcher chickens, rabbits, cows, pigs, etc. The only animals we killed ourselves as kids were the chickens, the rest the grown ups did. We watched them do it. And we helped gut/clean all of them. We were 3-12 years old. We never killed anything for "fun". Only the food animals when it was our chore, and we certainly didn't enjoy it. It was a messy sad chore. We never thought of hurting animals of any kind as recreation, never participated in any activities that involved harming an animal unless that animal was to be eaten by us and then it was done with as little pain to the animal as possible. Even as little kids being exposed to blood and guts and killing animals, even doing it with our own hands when it was our chore never evergave us the idea that it was okay to just go out and do.

Two of my brothers don't even hunt now. Another brother hunts for food. They all eat meat, and they are all kind and loving to bugs and other lifeforms.

If we survived all that without turning into coldblooded lizard smashing killers....well, that kid and his parents really need to be seriously assessed and something appropriate done. What exactly, nobody will know until an assessment is done.

 

[Boemy]

I don't think the kid should literally go "to jail", but he should go into heavy duty therapy. There is something seriously wrong with this kid's head. This is NOT normal behavior.

Also, I think "boys will be boys/kids will be kids" is nothing more than a pathetic way to excuse bad behavior. Every time I've heard that phrase in real life it's from a parent who can't be bothered to discipline or control their child. "Little Tommy bites and punches everyone he meets, but boys will be boys, you know."

 

[Lilavati]

There's a difference for killing snakes that you randomly find... then breaking into a zoo and killing animals with a rock, and throwing the rest to an alligator. A little more thinkin involved there methinks.

But wait.. he's just a kid! Lets just let him walk without punishment for his actions. Pffftt!!

I don't think ANYONE is suggesting he shouldn't be punished. Assuming that the zoo was open and he slipped away from his parents, then I woudl hope they are taking proper action. I certainly hope the zoo's lawyer suggests therapy as a prerequisite to settlement. However, I side with REggin on this . . . I think he needs to be checked out, and so do his parents. But I'd be a whole HE!! of a lot more worried if he were 10 or 12 rather than 7. Children that age, depending on how they were raised, and on their level of maturity, often don't know what they are doing is wrong, or reckognize animals as living things, that, like the child himself, feel pain. SHould this be checked out? Yes. Should it be cause for panic, stigmitizing the child for life, and claiming the decay of Western civilization? No. He's 7. Small children do horrific things sometimes . . . like hit other children on the head with toys . . . we punish them, tell them its wrong, and move on. If they do it alot, they see a doctor. If an OLDER child is doing the same thing . . . its a reason to be very worried. But not little children . . . and that's WHY they can't charge him . . . the law assumes, correctly, that children that age are too young to understand right and wrong, to control themselves, or to understand criminal charges. They can understand people are mad that them, and that they shouldn't do that . . . but they do not have the moral culpabilty of adults or even older children.

 

[puppydog]

I personaly feel that the fitting punishment for this little sh*t is a lead pill in the back of his head!

 

[ACooper]

I don't think ANYONE is suggesting he shouldn't be punished. Assuming that the zoo was open and he slipped away from his parents, then I woudl hope they are taking proper action. I certainly hope the zoo's lawyer suggests therapy as a prerequisite to settlement. However, I side with REggin on this . . . I think he needs to be checked out, and so do his parents. But I'd be a whole HE!! of a lot more worried if he were 10 or 12 rather than 7. Children that age, depending on how they were raised, and on their level of maturity, often don't know what they are doing is wrong, or reckognize animals as living things, that, like the child himself, feel pain. SHould this be checked out? Yes. Should it be cause for panic, stigmitizing the child for life, and claiming the decay of Western civilization? No. He's 7. Small children do horrific things sometimes . . . like hit other children on the head with toys . . . we punish them, tell them its wrong, and move on. If they do it alot, they see a doctor. If an OLDER child is doing the same thing . . . its a reason to be very worried. But not little children . . . and that's WHY they can't charge him . . . the law assumes, correctly, that children that age are too young to understand right and wrong, to control themselves, or to understand criminal charges. They can understand people are mad that them, and that they shouldn't do that . . . but they do not have the moral culpabilty of adults or even older children.

I have to disagree with you here Lilavati.

I have never in my life met a 7 year old child (and even younger) who doesn't understand that it's wrong to kill other living things. Never met one who doesn't understand it's wrong to break into a place (go in somewhere without permission from the "owner"). Never met one who doesn't understand that other things feel pain either. Shoot, just on a basic level, I have never met one who doesn't know it's WRONG to take something that doesn't belong to you.

I have been around more than my share of children, In a professional setting as well as my personal life. If the child does not suffer from any sort of mental disabilities or impairments............then YES, 7 years old is PLENTY old enough to know and understand what they are doing is wrong, old enough to "control themselves" and old enough to face up to a consequence.

Children as young as 3-4 years old will take things from stores or other peoples houses. Now, if they just grab it and walk out holding it in plain view........ok, they don't get that it is doing wrong yet. But I have seen with my OWN eyes 3-4 year old kids who take an object, shove it under their coat and try to be as quiet and inconspicuous as possible.

THAT action tells me they KNOW better, if they know enough to hide the evidence, they know what they are doing or attempting to do is wrong period.

There is no way that I agree with Jail for a 7 year old, but I do believe (unless he has some mental issues) that he should be punished and evaluated as well as his parents.

 

[Lilavati]

When I say right from wrong, and control themselves, of course 7 year olds do manifest both. But its not comparable to adults and older children. One, their right from wrong is heavily molded by what they have been taught. Two, my impression of them is that they understand it largely in the way a dog understands it: right is what pleases others, wrong is what gets me in trouble. They don't understand it in the way that an adult does. They may understand that it is wrong, but not why. With cruelty to animals, it has a lot to do with upbringing, and exprience with animals . . . some children view them as animated toys, bascially. It varies by child of course.

As for control, its the same issue . . . they may be able to control themselves, but certainly not in the same way that an adult can, or should. Again, I never said he shouldn't be punished. HE should be, and severely. But the criminal justice system has always stayed out of the crimes of small children, and with good reason . . . it is a system based on the assumption that criminals know right from wrong, can control themselves, and understand the consequences. At least, that they should. Small children don't have as clear of idea of these things (And possibily no understanding of the consequences).

Now, perhaps the juvinile system needs to get involved in these cases . . . but think about that for a moment . . . do you really want the government stepping in when your child is naughty. I talked in the other thread in this topic about a colleagues' child who bites and spits, and that some of his teachers think he's a violent psycho in the making. I doubt it, his mother doubts it, and their shrink (She did take him to one) doubts it. He's a 6 year old with anger issues, that should be handled. But I'm very leery of getting the machine that is the criminal justice system (including the juvinile system) involved in in the crimes of small children.

I hope this child gets therapy. I hope his parents are responsible enough to do that. I hope the zoo's lawyer demands therapy as a term of settlement. I hope the AUstralian equivalent of CPS takes a look at exactly how this happened, and takes appropriate action if his parents were particularly delirict. But I don't think charging the child with a crime will be helpful, and it will be a dangerous precedent.

I also don't think that the child's age should be an aggrivating factor here . . .which many people think. My god, he's only 7! I think, thank god, he's only 7. One, he's young enough to change. Two, he's young enough that its quite possible that he doesn't understand the full import of his actions, or the depth of wrongness. To him, it might have been a video game (which I don't believe harm children, generally, but you see my point). If this were a 12 year old, I would be MUCH more worried . . .because if a 12 year old doesn't know these things, something is very wrong, and likely they do know these things and chose to do it anyway, which is an alarming lack of impulse control and a sign of sheer viciousness.

 

[mrose_s]

I heard about this the other day... unaceptable. Gotta say though, considering the area, I'm not that surprised.
I would really like to see that zoo get some better security. That is an 11ft saltwater crocodile, I have more respect for that animal than nearly anything else on the planet. How a 7 year old can get that close is scary to say the least.

 

[HoundedByHounds]

When I say right from wrong, and control themselves, of course 7 year olds do manifest both. But its not comparable to adults and older children. One, their right from wrong is heavily molded by what they have been taught. Two, my impression of them is that they understand it largely in the way a dog understands it: right is what pleases others, wrong is what gets me in trouble. They don't understand it in the way that an adult does. They may understand that it is wrong, but not why. With cruelty to animals, it has a lot to do with upbringing, and exprience with animals . . . some children view them as animated toys, bascially. It varies by child of course

Yep...a 7 year old concept of consequences and DEATH is not the same as an adult.

My daughter is 7...we had a pup die here this weekend when the mom laid on it...and tho she understood it was "dead" she moved on from the fact so quickly, to some TV show...that it worried me...then I realized...she is SEVEN.

Her concept of grief and time and the depth of both is completely totally foreign to me...as an adult. She has a detachment, and an ability to forget and move on, that I consider to be a form of insulation, and defense that Mother Nature has given her. She SHOULDN'T feel these things to her core and be forever changed like I am...otherwise what kind of hope is there for her? Life KICKS YER AZZ people...and as a child you should be allowed some insulation and NON understanding of the finality and true deep consequences of things at times.

Not applying this to this case specifically...just to the overall thought that kids "know" things at 7 the same way they do at 12...16 or 35.

 

[ACooper]

Well Gina, the fact that it wasn't HER puppy that died makes a big difference here too.

She had no attachment to this pup, probably hadn't even spent much time around it, hadn't even held it (in all likely hood)

Sort of the difference in reading about a death of a stranger in the paper or someone close to you dieing IMO.

I can read of a death in the paper, feel sad for them/their family for about 5 minutes and move on with the rest of my day............not so if it's someone I actually knew, and REALLY not so if it's someone close to me.

When Corey's little bird died after having it for only a week, BOTH boys cried and cried. They don't do that when they see a dead bird outside............they will say "Awe, poor birdie" and move on. It doesn't affect them in their daily lives and that IS very adult like of them IMO.

And for the record, no, I don't think a 7 y/o processes things the same way an adult does, but then again I don't think a teen processes it like an adult either. Most teens I know are still under the impression that they will never get old, nothing can really hurt them badly, and they will live forever. They don't have to actually SAY these things, but they are apparent in their actions.