Puppy trying to find her place in the pack...?

[SunnyNJazzy]

So we have 3 mini aussies, 8 yrs (Jazz), and 2 that are about 4 (DJ & Kizzy), all female (crazy I know) and have now brought Mysti (15 wks) into the mix. For the most part she does really well and accepts that she is the lowest in the group, getting treats last if we are feeding them as a group etc. But there are times if she's trying to play with them and they snap at her for either biting too hard or they just aren't interested in playing and telling her to back off, she will go back at them in an aggressive way. How do I correct this? Currently I am stopping her and giving her a big "NO!" and laying her down...? I've never had a dog do this before so I have no idea if this is correct. I have thought about letting them work it out between them but worry if Mysti wins (as my dog Jazz can be submissive at times and gives up easily) then it will just worsen the behavior...

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

 

[CaliTerp07]

Currently I am stopping her and giving her a big "NO!" and laying her down...?

I'd stop this immediately. All that it teaches her is when she gets riled up, someone is going to yell at her and restrain her. It will create a dog who gets overstimulated and then stressed--and the potential for her to bite you (accidentally or otherwise) is increased.

Without seeing the behavior, is there a possibility it's just play? All dogs have different styles, and as a puppy she's probably still learning how to play nicely with others. (I know my dog probably looks "aggressive" to an outsider, but she's just very vocal and rough housing in her play) Your other dogs are teaching her how to be part of a doggy group, and when they do/don't want to play. She will learn.

Have you taken her to a puppy socialization class? It would be great if she could be around other dogs her age, and the trainers there will teach you how to read behavior signals from your dog.

Finally, I wouldn't worry so much about forcing her to be the "lowest" in the group. Give treats in any order, let them outside in any order, cuddle whomever you want to cuddle. Just make sure that all dogs earn what you are offering. If they want a treat, require them to high five you first. If they want to go outside, they must sit nicely until released, etc. They will work out a group dynamic between themselves.

 

[SunnyNJazzy]

Ok I will Thanks. It definitely isn't play as watching her play with them the do get rough with each other at times but this is obviously hackles up and actually being aggressive there's an obvious change in dynamic. As soon as her puppy shots are finished (next tuesday) we will be starting in a socialization group and she will be going to work with me at a doggie daycare as well as frequent trips to the dog park.

Thank you for your help!

 

[CaliTerp07]

Ok I will Thanks. It definitely isn't play as watching her play with them the do get rough with each other at times but this is obviously hackles up and actually being aggressive there's an obvious change in dynamic. As soon as her puppy shots are finished (next tuesday) we will be starting in a socialization group and she will be going to work with me at a doggie daycare as well as frequent trips to the dog park.

Thank you for your help!

I wouldn't take her to a dog park if there's a chance that this is aggression. Puppy class, yes--there will be knowledgeable folks on hand to help guide the interactions. Day care, maybe--though it may be overwhelming for her. Dog park...that's a lot for a puppy to handle if they are struggling with just 3 other dogs. On top of which, if something happens (she bites someone's chihuahua or sends the wrong signals to a bigger/stronger dog), someone could get hurt.

 

[Doberluv]

Forget about lowest, highest or any of that pack theory myth. This is what using punishment can result in: http://www.chazhound.com/forums/t126011/

If you put your pup on the defensive by force, intimidation, you stand a good chance of producing aggression in your pup. So, I agree with getting into a good puppy socialization class where the trainer uses positive reinforcement methods and understands behavior. It takes some diligent checking out. One place you can look is: Dog Trainer Search

It could indeed be just rough puppy playing. Your other dogs growling at her can teach her to back off a little and simmer down as long as it doesn't escalate to the point where you think injury might occur or to where they're getting too frustrated. Then you step in and use your body to herd her back or block her, change the subject, find something else for her to do or to calm down in another room....all very calmly, matter of fact...no emotion, no scolding etc. The older dogs too, need protection from being harrassed too much by puppy antics.

I recommend you learn about some positive reinforcement type training methods, browse more on this forum, ask questions etc. There are some good sticky threads on top of the pages. (with the little blue thumbtacs) Be sure puppy is getting plenty of exercise, but appropriate for her age....not excessive. And plenty of other mental stimulation from training short sessions and time alone with you.

It's a process and with patience and effective training, which does not depend on pack theory/heirarchy myths, not applicable particularly with domestic dogs...lots of new research on that.

 

[SunnyNJazzy]

Thank you I will read further, I'd always heard the whole pack mentality but obviously am outdated! Any other tips on bonding/training would be greatly appreciated and I will search the site as well -it's been a long time since I've raised a puppy!

When you say getting plenty of exercise but appropriate for her age, what would be appropriate for her? Being that she is 15/16 wk old mini aussie with a brain that never stops lol, she plays with toys quite a bit during the day, and plays with the other dogs and gets atleast 2 SHORT training sessions a day depending as well as 1 or 2 short walks a day.

Thank you guys for all your help dog training/maintenance theories have changed alot since the information I received 8 years ago!

 

[Doberluv]

Dog Whisperer, Dog Psychology and Cesar Millan

On the left is a table of contents...there's some info on training.

Also, you can google Clicker Solutions. There are some good training articles there too.

Several 15 minute romps, running around in the yard, playing, a little walking is fine. You can work up as he grows.

 

[SunnyNJazzy]

Thank you so much, that website is awesome! As is this one, I look forward to learning quite a bit with this forum and Mysti!