Angulation: What IS it? What is correct?

[Gwinnywillow]

Originally Posted by RedyreRottweilers

REAR angulation is much more than turn of stifle.

It is the combination of angles of the pelvis, the femur, the fibula and tibia, the hock joint, and the rear metatarsus.

Correct bone lengths have much to do with proper rear angulation leading to the efficient and effortless movement that is desired in my breed, and many others.

You might also note what they call the BACK in this diagram....

http://www.vicboxer.com/boxer.html

I take it you did not notice how terribly straight in front that dog is?

Oh, and anatomically, the "back" encompasses cervical, thoracic, lumbar, and sacral vertebrae. Unless the doctors have been lying all these years.

And that Boxer is not "let down" either! Poor example all 'round.

[Gwinnywillow]

Originally Posted by JennSLK

But I thought winning and Championships ment nothing and were all bought.

Is it possible that those who cannot spell cannot read either?? I mean those who REALLY can't spell! Just what is "ment" supposed to MEAN???

[motherofmany]

Originally Posted by Gwinnywillow

Oh, and anatomically, the "back" encompasses cervical, thoracic, lumbar, and sacral vertebrae. Unless the doctors have been lying all these years.

No, dear, that is the spine. Here, this may help you.

http://www.lookd.com/dogs/anatomy.html

[RedyreRottweilers]

Turn of stifle is one piece of rear angulation.

VERY important to rear angulation is the angle of the pelvis.

The angle made by the pelvis and the femur is just as important as the turn of stifle.

Here is an excellent study and explanation of fore and rear angulations, with diagrams to illustrate.

http://www.geocities.com/willowind_dals/page2.pdf

[motherofmany]

[/quote]If the lower thigh is noticeably longer than upper thigh, it does not matter what the angles of hip and femur are. There will be no "turn of stifle". Gee, thought you should have known that![/quote]


Actually, that is something I have said multiple times in this and other threads. The upper thigh should be longer in proportion to the lower thigh in most breed but several breeds, notably the GSD, actually require a longer lower thigh. they still have "turn of stifle" appropriate to their breed.

[motherofmany]

Since we had a bit of bashing about regarding Chow Chows, I thought it might be beneficial to post a link to their illustrated standard, so everyone can see why they have a stilted gait and why IliamnasQuest was correct (of course, since she actually owns and shows Chows)

http://www.chowclub.org/is/CCCI-IS-NF.doc.html

Very unique breed

[RedyreRottweilers]

Yes. And they don't LUMBER.

heh heh

[Gwinnywillow]

Originally Posted by motherofmany

Since we had a bit of bashing about regarding Chow Chows, I thought it might be beneficial to post a link to their illustrated standard, so everyone can see why they have a stilted gait and why IliamnasQuest was correct (of course, since she actually owns and shows Chows)

http://www.chowclub.org/is/CCCI-IS-NF.doc.html

Very unique breed

If llama ever gets one of the Chow Books, have her look up Sa-Mi. She owns a couple of pet quality Chows. That does not make her an expert. Now as far as obedience-----my hat is off to her. AND, if her Chows were not pet quality, they would most likely not be able to perform in obedience. Since the show Chows at one time were REALLY overdone!!!!
But by the standard, hers are not SPECIALS material. I think that is where I have been less than clear. When I talk about show dogs and their quality, it is in terms of them being of high enough quality to win groups and BIS. As I said, most anything can become a champion if shown long enough----except for Myrna Cagel's male toy Poodle who had about 70 points, and never did get that second major. But that is a local joke.

One of the names I dropped.....MEDEROS of whom I am sure you have never heard....who had Betancourt Kerries (oh, George came here from Cuba with his good friend Desi Arnez)......also showed Toy Poodles. Angie was the Poodle lover. She had a male......Betancourt's Lord of The Ring. When he finally finished, he had a total of 30 points!!!!!!!! I told her she should have never named him Lord of the Ring....he thought he was supposed to spend his whole life in the showring, lol.

Oh, and just what do you have to say about your lying about me buying a dog and putting it out with someone famous??????? Debbie and I hung out whenever she came to the shows here. She checked out a litter for me, and came up with the same evaluation of them I did. We ate together, etc. I don't supposed the name Caroline Coile (Dr. Coile, PhD and a few other things?) Rings any bells? She has Saluki's.

What is really funny is that you did not pick up on the fact that these were people I knew 20 years ago! Dropping their names now wouldn't do me a bit of good, or give me a lick of credulity!! Only someone like YOU would think it would,

I bet you have no clue as to who Anna K. Nicholas was either, do you?? No, I did not know her, but I showed under her a couple of times.

You show dogs, huh? How many of your dogs have picked up 3 majors in one weekend? And the following week picked up a 5 point major and gone BOV????? Let's find out YOUR CV in dogs! Inquiring minds want to know! Oh, AND IN MY OPINION, there ain't nothing more lovely than a well put together blue merle Sheltie...or Collie for that matter. Although the heads of the Shelties have not been uglified as have the Rough and Smoothe Collies. Again, of course as I said, just my opinion.

[Gwinnywillow]

Originally Posted by RedyreRottweilers

Yes. And they don't LUMBER.

heh heh

Poor Red.....have you never seen a Chow of sufficiently massive bone structure? They lumber. They sure ain't got no reach and drive!!!!!!

[RedyreRottweilers]

You will never get it. A Chow Chow of such heavy bone as to lumber is highly undesireable.

READ THE STANDARD.

And yes. In fact, Bill Buell is a good friend of mine (since you like to name drop). He has a deep red smooth puppy bitch coming up that is going to be just stunning.