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  #21  
Old 04-02-2009, 10:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Dekka View Post
Around here there are NOT many ACD breeders. And they do do some stuff. I have met the dogs and really like them. They do more about at least trying their breeding stock on animals than most other decent ACD breeders around.
So why not fly the pup to you?

I'm actually suprised by some of your posts. Usually you're saying to "go for th best" not "well they do some stuff, more than most". And I've heard ALOT of people say "there aren't many so and so breeder around me" and then when they REALLY started looking, they found the right one.

I'm sure if the OP starts running in some of the working/ACD circles, you'll be amazed at what you find. I know I was when I started running in the sheepdog/training circles.
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  #22  
Old 04-02-2009, 10:45 PM
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Not everyone wants to import a pet dog. I would if they wanted a performance dog (tho having met these dogs I don't doubt they would make awesome perfomance dogs) I would suggest it. But for a pet dog they are more than decent.

I love Yonder. Chuck had some of them out here doing a little agility and the dogs were great.
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  #23  
Old 04-02-2009, 11:00 PM
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Then add into the mix the number of breeders that refuse to ship....sigh
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  #24  
Old 04-02-2009, 11:01 PM
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what if som'one is dead set on a breed but doesn't want a dog thats so intense.... shouldn't they go with show lines then?

Or should they just pick another breed?
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  #25  
Old 04-03-2009, 12:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Lizmo View Post
I'm actually suprised by some of your posts. Usually you're saying to "go for th best" not "well they do some stuff, more than most". And I've heard ALOT of people say "there aren't many so and so breeder around me" and then when they REALLY started looking, they found the right one.
Lizmo, I'm not bashing you, but these aren't border collies. There is not a big split in this breed, and I would like to keep it that way. ACD's are not a dime a dozen in most areas and neither are places to herd. It is often very difficult to find an instructor who knows enough to work with these dogs. They don't work like a border collie. I drive 2.5 hours one way to work sheep. Even with that far of a drive, I can only work one of my dogs. The other dog is too drivy/grippy/strong for my instructor and I to really work with. She wants to get out there and work, but she is very strong and if something goes wrong, it goes wrong very fast. She has her herding instinct certificate, but our instructors said it would be best to work her on cattle, which we dont have access to.

These people look like very nice breeders and cattle dogs are very adaptable to what their people want to do with them. I noticed they listed various obedience, rally, agility, herding, and even tracking titles. Those dogs couldn't have done all that with faulty temperaments or no drive.

To kind of bring in Zoom's question; Yes, bull terrier type breeds were used in the development of the ACD. I think a lot of good breeders are trying to breed away from the DA while keeping the strong determination of bully breeds. A good cattle dog is going to do his job, not fritz out at the sight of another dog. Realistically, these dogs drove thousands of cattle hundreds of miles with the assistance of other dogs. I think the DA was an unintended trait brought in from the bullies.
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  #26  
Old 04-03-2009, 02:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lizmo View Post
So why not fly the pup to you?

I'm actually suprised by some of your posts. Usually you're saying to "go for th best" not "well they do some stuff, more than most". And I've heard ALOT of people say "there aren't many so and so breeder around me" and then when they REALLY started looking, they found the right one.

I'm sure if the OP starts running in some of the working/ACD circles, you'll be amazed at what you find. I know I was when I started running in the sheepdog/training circles.
But see.... I don't plan to "run" in ACD circles... My hub will not be herding with this dog, though I may do some agility. He is looking for a companion animal and he likes this breed. We would not be looking to ship a puppy in from miles away, and why should we when this breeder is in our backyard and has what looks like incredibly versatile dogs?

There are several photo's of their dogs working sheep, goats etc. on the site.... Other than buying from a farmer how more proven than that can you get with herding dogs? (serious question) I know my neighbor has a BC, great dog, hard working farm dog, awesome worker... BUT has some real temp. issues and also never had a drop of testing of any kind!

Thanks for your opinion though, as I did ask and thanks to everyone else, I may contact them, as even though we are looking a few years away, with so few litters it may be worth getting started and at least a visit!
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  #27  
Old 04-03-2009, 06:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Criosphynx View Post
what if som'one is dead set on a breed but doesn't want a dog thats so intense.... shouldn't they go with show lines then?

Or should they just pick another breed?
Just to answer this questions. Generally I would say yes. (tho in this case there isnt' a huge split in the breed) If you can't handle the breed don't own it. Now if you want just a slighlty more mellow dog, contact a few breeders and say you are looking for a a slightly less intense dog and that if they have a pup like that you will be interested.

I say I don't breed for the pet market, and I don't. But that doesn't mean if I have a more mellow JRT pup show up and a great pet home comes along I won't match them up.
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  #28  
Old 04-03-2009, 09:20 AM
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Originally Posted by OutlineACDs View Post
Lizmo, I'm not bashing you, but these aren't border collies. There is not a big split in this breed, and I would like to keep it that way. ACD's are not a dime a dozen in most areas and neither are places to herd. It is often very difficult to find an instructor who knows enough to work with these dogs. They don't work like a border collie. I drive 2.5 hours one way to work sheep. Even with that far of a drive, I can only work one of my dogs. The other dog is too drivy/grippy/strong for my instructor and I to really work with. She wants to get out there and work, but she is very strong and if something goes wrong, it goes wrong very fast. She has her herding instinct certificate, but our instructors said it would be best to work her on cattle, which we dont have access to.

These people look like very nice breeders and cattle dogs are very adaptable to what their people want to do with them. I noticed they listed various obedience, rally, agility, herding, and even tracking titles. Those dogs couldn't have done all that with faulty temperaments or no drive.
Weren't ACD's bred to work cattle?

I'm not sure what you mean by there isn't a split. So everyone in the breed is okay with where it's going - to be a show dog instead of a working bred cattle dog?
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  #29  
Old 04-03-2009, 09:39 AM
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I definitely would visit ! No sense wondering with a lifetime of commitment ahead !
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  #30  
Old 04-03-2009, 11:42 AM
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Originally Posted by Lizmo View Post
Weren't ACD's bred to work cattle?

I'm not sure what you mean by there isn't a split. So everyone in the breed is okay with where it's going - to be a show dog instead of a working bred cattle dog?
Absolutely, but good luck finding a herding instructor who works cattle on a regular basis. Some herding people refuse to work with any breed besides a bc.

What I mean by "there isn't a split" is that the majority of breeders are keeping the working dog in mind. I don't think there is an overwhelming majority of people who breed "just" working dogs or "just" show dogs. The good breeders out there who do the health testing required usually show in both conformation and some type of performance. If they don't regularly trial in herding they at least work their dogs on stock and/or own their own farm. The few breeders I know who don't trial in herding will either send their dog off to be trained and titled or personally work them at home daily.

In this breed, the conformation specimen is built to work and the working dog should be able to win in the ring.
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