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  #31  
Old 03-30-2009, 08:24 AM
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I sell on limited. I wouldn't do otherwise. If a puppy turns out well and the people want to show it and do all the health testing we can talk and PERHAPS the reg can be changed over. You can ALWAYS change it over...but you cannot change a full, to limited. Why wouldn't you use the tools given along with the many other options to prevent unwanted outcomes.
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  #32  
Old 03-30-2009, 12:58 PM
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Ok, that is true about changing limited over to full ... I guess my main fear was someone who slipped through the cracks and bred a dog would just use another registry to breed the litters. So I would rather have them go with AKC and be able to keep track of any progeny. OTOH, what I probably need to be doing is tightening up my contract & interview process even more ... All good points brought up here, thanks

I think I will go with limited for the pet pups but make the screening process even more thorough. It might almost be too much temptation to breed if a pet pup was sold on full registration, maybe?
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  #33  
Old 03-30-2009, 02:59 PM
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You might be able to keep track of them if they were registered through the AKC, but then you still have those pups associated with your kennel name/line... and I personally wouldn't want that. It's protecting you and your line as much as it's an attempt to protect the dogs themselves from an ill-planned or "but I want a puppy from him, he's SO CUTE!" breeding, too.

And yeah, too much of a temptation is one way to put it, but I also think if you sold the dogs on a full registration it's almost like giving your blessing for them to go ahead and breed anyway... like a stupid/shady person who was intent on breeding anyway could easily use that as an excuse. "Well, if you didn't want me to breed her, why did you sell her to me on a full registration??" sort of thing.
Limited registration is just one more step of doing everything you can to prevent a breeding... and I say that meaning there's really very little you actually can do to prevent it when somebody is bound and determined to take their dog and breed him/her. Thorough screening is definitely key, but even well-screened people can surprise you... =<
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  #34  
Old 03-30-2009, 04:56 PM
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The only 100% way to ensure no breedings occur is to s/n before they leave your home, at 8-12weeks. that is drastic BUT I do know people who do that. They can always sleep at night knowing...without a shadow of doubt that NOTHING they place as a pet will end up being bred. I envy that peace...I reaaaaally do. I am not ready to go that far yet....but being that the hounds are a small compact breed without the growth issues of a larger one...that option sounds better all the time. esp with dog puppies where incontinence isn't a major concern the way it is in bitches.
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  #35  
Old 03-30-2009, 05:13 PM
Val_theAussie Val_theAussie is offline
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My Aussie has a limited AKC registration. The breeder has seller's remorse and feels that I SHOULD show my dog; although I did state to her clearly that I wanted a companion dog and honestly, she ought to be happy that this Aussie has a good loving home. I have a kid in college and a bad back and arthritis and I dont need the extra expenses incurred with showing an Aussie. I'm not as young and free as I used to be. Anyway, she brought out a couple of pups that we had to choose from; from a litter of seven, of which two were spoken for. We picked the pup we felt suited our home, came back, paid the fee and she started nudging me about showing the dog. I told her, well, maybe, I'd have to see. I have my hands full with an Aussie pup that I dearly love but dog showing isn't something that I can or want to do right now. When I last spoke to her, she said I got "the pick of the litter" and it was her husband who wanted the dog they had and she wished that she had kept the dog she sold to us.

I don't plan on contacting her again with any questions about the pup, if I can help it!
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  #36  
Old 03-30-2009, 09:27 PM
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Quote:
And yeah, too much of a temptation is one way to put it, but I also think if you sold the dogs on a full registration it's almost like giving your blessing for them to go ahead and breed anyway... like a stupid/shady person who was intent on breeding anyway could easily use that as an excuse. "Well, if you didn't want me to breed her, why did you sell her to me on a full registration??" sort of thing.

Hmmm, I hadn't thought of it that way but you're right. It could be viewed as me making it easier for them to breed but also does reflect badly that I gave the full registration in the first place ...


Quote:
Thorough screening is definitely key, but even well-screened people can surprise you...

Tell me about it Sometimes it seems like the ones who are asking all the right questions and screening me as much as I am them, are the ones who I end up never hearing back from. OR the ones that pull the most crap. You think you're doing all you can, even asking that they PLEASE keep you updated on the pup for your records just ONCE ... then they fall off the face of the earth. Have definitely lost sleep over those pups ... you're just always wondering. :::sigh::: I like the idea of speutering the pups before they leave - I am on the fence about early s/n so might like to try it once just to see how those pups turned out, but can't even find a Vet here that is willing to do it. The Vets here STINK. I have to leave NYC just to get OFA testing done, they just refuse to do it. Ah, but that's another issue entirely! Thanks again for all the great responses!
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  #37  
Old 03-30-2009, 09:50 PM
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Are you going to have good access to these pups if you do a juvie s/n? Are you willing to track them down if needed for the next few years to see how the dogs develop?

I personally will never do a dog before its mature.. and will NEVER get a dog that was a juvie s/n. I know most sport people won't want a dog with the issues that can come from an early alter are you going to get the homes you want?

I too am a breeder and know how hard it is with selling pups, but to me the health and welfare of the dogs is my #1 priority.
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  #38  
Old 03-30-2009, 09:54 PM
Val_theAussie Val_theAussie is offline
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My breeder did tell me to never neuter a dog before it was at least a year old! I agree with that, no matter what, the dog's health comes first and foremost.
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  #39  
Old 03-31-2009, 08:32 AM
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as much access as I have if they AREN'T lol...no difference. The contract is the same sans s/n neuter clause. The screening is the same too.

Whatever the objections may be...s/n prior to placement is still the ONLY 100% way to make sure your dogs are not bred or contributing to the overpopulation/rescue issue you may have in your breed. Good or bad...doesn't change that fact one iota. The rest looks good on a piece of paper and may or may not protect you, your dogs, and your line down the road should the worst happen.

I know that the one person who does it, in a large breed, hasn't had a single issue come up in a 8 wk s/n dog, that hasn't in a 6-12mo s/n dog. And most of her clients have been happy not to have to pay the $200+ it costs to s/n a large breed at the older ages/heavier weights.

I haven't decided it's a fabulous idea...but neither am I ready to chuck it based on research when I have actual real life counterpoints I can see firsthand.
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  #40  
Old 03-31-2009, 08:40 AM
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I have met a few oversized lanky dogs (one is an aussie.. so not a large breed) who were all juvie s/n. But not to say they didnt' have that tendancy to begin with. But we do know it affects the growth of many other animals (as far as I know its never really been studied in dogs) so its safe to assume there are changes with dogs too.

The OP I believe said they had issues getting pet owners to check back in, so that is why I asked would you be able to get them to check in enough to be able to make a call as to how much it makes a difference.

I just know that in my somewhat limited (but I think better than average) understanding of the roll of hormones in the body that I would not be comfortable with removing a few hormones from growing and developing pups.
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