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Old 02-05-2009, 01:38 PM
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dr2little dr2little is offline
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Default How's this for "advice"..

Hi ********,

I have just adopted my first 4 month old brindle pit and named her Karma. I have a 5 year old lab shepherd mix named Charlie. This is the first time in 20+ years of owning more than one dog but I have temporarily fostered. In the past couple of days with her being introduced, Charlie has used a high level of aggression to discipline her from invading his space and stealing toys. In both occasions I have immediately disciplined him, pinned him to the ground, have him submit calmly and have placed the new pup close to his head and blocking her from fleeing as I have seen you demonstrate creating a kind of equal calm submissive truce. I calmly watch both dogs play and when the intensity gets too high I stop the play session. He has gotten better and allows her to take the toys away from him now. I am firmly disciplining growls and showing of teeth as well. I am afraid of making Karma dominant down the road by making Charlie submit to her and allowing her to steal the toys now in the beginning. I also notice Karma continuing to snap and lung at Charlie in an attempt to get more play out of him after I have made an initial disciple to stop. Should I raise my level of discipline and make her stop as pack leader or allow him to? I can tell by the look on Charlie's face he really doesn't want to play anymore but with me watching he puts up with it knowing a correction might come from his aggression. If I am to be the pack leader, I feel it is my job to keep the peace and stop the play when I can tell Charlie has had enough. So should I be disciplining the instigator as well?

Looking forward to meeting you in Atlanta in December.

Namaste

Katherine Wakefield
Spartanburg, SC

First of all welcome to the Pack-oriented world!

Everything you mentioned in regard to your instinctual way of being with two dogs for the first time in your life is great. I do allow dogs that I absolutely trust and respect to teach other dogs how to be a dog. This is something that I can never teach. But I always, make sure the dog who teaches the other dog is reminded by me that I will always be the assertive energy source. The instigator to me represents dominance, so the answer is yes. If his behavior in instigating something was not planned by you, and then he needs to be reminded that he can never begin anything without you agreeing with it. The key of running a pack is that everything they do is created by you.

You are doing great. Again, welcome to the Pack world - be careful it gets addictive!

******** ******

Care to guess who gave the advice? How about a lottery on how long it will take for the 'big event' to send someone to hospital or to end a life?

Just sickening..
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Old 02-05-2009, 01:41 PM
RedyreRottweilers
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That really makes my stomach not feel so good. Those poor dogs. And you are so right. Someone is going to get seriously hurt, but it will probably take a LOT of people getting hurt before it ever points back towards him.
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Old 02-05-2009, 01:44 PM
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You know, that event happened in my hometown while I was working at a Doggy Daycare Center. I'm sure it would have driven people away from US if I screamed at them every time they praised this man's work and talked about how excited they were to go to this seminar.

I had to swallow BILE every time someone recommended his techniques to other people there. I WISH I could have shown them Ozzy a year ago and told them that this man's techniques would have RUINED this bright little dog. It's truly sickening.

There is a quote from a dog book that I've read (and I've read thousands, so I can't, for the life of me, remember which one it is) and that quote is this "SEE the dog." See what you are doing to the dog. Is the light in his eyes dimming? Is his face confused? Does he look scared or worried? SEE the DOG!!! UGH.
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Old 02-05-2009, 01:45 PM
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Oh my.
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Old 02-05-2009, 01:45 PM
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I love this part:
Quote:
Originally Posted by dr2little View Post
If his behavior in instigating something was not planned by you, and then he needs to be reminded that he can never begin anything without you agreeing with it. The key of running a pack is that everything they do is created by you.
Sooooo.... does that mean that the dogs will never ever be able to be left unsupervised together, for any length of time?? Really???

ETA: My money's on the pit being rehomed (or euthed) before he's two years old... maybe before one.
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Old 02-05-2009, 01:46 PM
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CharlieDog CharlieDog is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lizzybeth727 View Post
I love this part:

Sooooo.... does that mean that the dogs will never ever be able to be left unsupervised together, for any length of time?? Really???
No, I got from that, that you are to control EVERYTHING in the dogs life. Everything the dog does has to be okayed by you. Which basically means you don't have a dog, you have a robot.
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Old 02-05-2009, 01:48 PM
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I can't wait for the day he gets mauled to death. I hope they get it on film too.
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Old 02-06-2009, 08:07 PM
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All I can say is:

It's just amazing to me how people can go along with this kind of treatment toward dogs. Poor, innocent things. It IS sickening. Yup...I won't be one bit surprised when someone gets hurt. The question isn't if. It's how soon. And I bet it won't be long. Was that affirmative answer written by CM? (just want to make sure the owner was doing the methods "correctly." Eh, hem. *cough, cough*
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Old 02-06-2009, 09:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doberluv View Post
All I can say is:

It's just amazing to me how people can go along with this kind of treatment toward dogs. Poor, innocent things. It IS sickening. Yup...I won't be one bit surprised when someone gets hurt. The question isn't if. It's how soon. And I bet it won't be long. Was that affirmative answer written by CM? (just want to make sure the owner was doing the methods "correctly." Eh, hem. *cough, cough*
Yes, it was Cesar.. The only reason that he has not lost everything is that no one can legally touch him. Can you imagine the sheer number of 'incident' that are caused by his 'advice'.

Once a dogs been Cesarized, they've likely lost all predictability. It's criminal as far as I'm concerned and NGC is an accessory. All for $$....
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Old 02-07-2009, 01:17 AM
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oh.my.god.

thats just scary
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