Dog Site - Dog Stuff
Dog Forum | Dog Pictures

Go Back   Chazhound Dog Forum > Dog Discussions and Dog Talk Forums > The Dog Breeds


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #11  
Old 10-31-2008, 07:09 PM
Laurelin's Avatar
Laurelin Laurelin is offline
I'm All Ears
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 29,227
Default

Merle is very controversial in a LOT of breeds. I know for sure it's shown up in cockers, poms, chis, and even pit bulls and it is ALWAYS a bone of contention. That's because A) merle is dominant and really impossible for it to just pop up suddenly unless you have a ridiculously long line of cryptics and B) because of the health associations with the color. Imo it's a pretty color but if a breed doesn't have merle already in it, then no need to try to add it.
__________________
Mia CGC - (5 year old papillon)
Summer TG3 TBAD - (10 year old papillon)
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 10-31-2008, 07:15 PM
Squishy22
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Laurelin View Post
Merle is very controversial in a LOT of breeds. I know for sure it's shown up in cockers, poms, chis, and even pit bulls and it is ALWAYS a bone of contention. That's because A) merle is dominant and really impossible for it to just pop up suddenly unless you have a ridiculously long line of cryptics and B) because of the health associations with the color. Imo it's a pretty color but if a breed doesn't have merle already in it, then no need to try to add it.
I agree 100%

That is the number 1 thing that I hate. Mixing in other breeds to achieve a different color. Its all about making more money and having something "rare". BYBs over price these "rare" merles like you wouldn't believe.

With the pit bull, I am very glad that merle is a fault within the standard. As well as blue eyes.

The AKC needs to revise the chihuahua breed standard, in my opinion. Not that it would stop the BYBs.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 10-31-2008, 07:16 PM
Squishy22
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LauraLeigh View Post
Very interesting! I have pretty well decided sometime down the road, a looong ways that would like to get involved in Chi's more seriously, purchase and show a breed quality bitch. I soak all this stuff up so thanks for the links!!
I think showing would be so much fun, and if I were to get into showing, no question would it be the chihuahua. I just know absolutely nothing about it. lol.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 10-31-2008, 07:28 PM
Dekka's Avatar
Dekka Dekka is online now
Just try me..
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Ontario
Posts: 19,262
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Reggin View Post
he AKC needs to revise the chihuahua breed standard, in my opinion. Not that it would stop the BYBs.
Problem is even if you revise the standard, there's no overseer from the KC to review what you register your dogs as.. In cockers there is roan. While at birth roan and merle are polar opposites, in adults they look alike, some dogs more than others. Merle is unregisterable.. So skeazy people often register merles as roans. Hopefully anyone good wouldn't accidentally use one of those dogs, but stranger things have happened.

The CCA put merle to a vote as a DQ in the ring. It failed.. The AKC can't make changes the CCA doesn't approve of. Parent clubs are responsible for the breed standards. The AKC has nothing to do with it at all. They are a registry. Nothing more.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 10-31-2008, 07:35 PM
Squishy22
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dekka View Post
Problem is even if you revise the standard, there's no overseer from the KC to review what you register your dogs as.. In cockers there is roan. While at birth roan and merle are polar opposites, in adults they look alike, some dogs more than others. Merle is unregisterable.. So skeazy people often register merles as roans. Hopefully anyone good wouldn't accidentally use one of those dogs, but stranger things have happened.

The CCA put merle to a vote as a DQ in the ring. It failed.. The AKC can't make changes the CCA doesn't approve of. Parent clubs are responsible for the breed standards. The AKC has nothing to do with it at all. They are a registry. Nothing more.
Oh, I see. Wow, how unfortunate that people can do that...
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 10-31-2008, 09:08 PM
LauraLeigh's Avatar
LauraLeigh LauraLeigh is offline
Irritate with Caution!!
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Brighton Ontario
Posts: 3,659
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Reggin View Post
I think showing would be so much fun, and if I were to get into showing, no question would it be the chihuahua. I just know absolutely nothing about it. lol.
The KC showing part would be new to me as well, I have only ever shown terriers and it is far more casual I have every intention to get involved in breeding again once my kids are on their own, and as much as I love my JRTs and will ALWAYS own one I am not interested in getting involved in breeding them again for several reasons, none of which are the fault of the terriers themselves
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 10-31-2008, 09:41 PM
~Jessie~'s Avatar
~Jessie~ ~Jessie~ is offline
Chihuahua Power!
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Central Florida
Posts: 19,601
Default

Yep, my Chloe has merle markings and blue eyes. She looks like a chihuahua to me

I have seen some monsterous merle chihuahuas, but it's that way with any color. The problem is that there are some really bad BYB's cashing in on the color. I personally don't want to see the merle color banned in the AKC... it has been traced back through pedigrees for the past ~25 years so it isn't an entirely recent fad coloring.

Davishall is one of my favorite breeders... they have some gorgeous very typey chis... here are some of their merles for example. They're stunning:

http://www.davishall.net/tokalon/males.html

For all of the anti merle material out there, there is an equal amount of pro merle material stuff out there as well. There are questionable pictures of possible merle chihuahuas from books published in the early-mid 1900's, and there is evidence that merles have been around but improperly registered until the 1980's. There is also evidence showing that the long coat chihuahuas were crossbred with papillons and pomeranians, but they're considered purebred chihuahuas as well. I guess it all comes down to what you believe. I'm not entirely sure what I think.

This is from the davishall page, but it has a history/old pictures of merles:

http://www.davishall.net/tokalon/history.html

For anyone who is really interested in learning about merles, there is a merle chihuahua forum. If you'd like the link, send me a PM as I think posting it is against the rules on here.

Also, I don't think that merles are any less healthy than any color if bred correctly. Obviously merles need to be CERF and BAER tested, NOT bred to other merles, bred to darker colored dogs(to prevent phantom merles... lighter colored dogs where the merling doesn't show up), etc. But any good breeder would be doing that anyway.

I'm really not in the mood to prove or disprove the history/validity of merles... I just want to say that if you are considering getting a merle to do your research, as there are so many conflicting opinions out there.
__________________

L to R: Chloe, Rylie, Emma, Tucker, and Rory
My Blog- Chihuahuas are not Sheep

Last edited by ~Jessie~; 10-31-2008 at 09:56 PM. Reason: added information
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 10-31-2008, 09:43 PM
jess2416's Avatar
jess2416 jess2416 is offline
Who woulda thought <3
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: NC
Posts: 22,553
Default

I was hoping you would post in here great info
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 10-31-2008, 09:52 PM
Laurelin's Avatar
Laurelin Laurelin is offline
I'm All Ears
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 29,227
Default

Quote:
For all of the anti merle material out there, there is an equal amount of pro merle material stuff out there as well. There are questionable pictures of possible merle chihuahuas from books published in the early-mid 1900's, and there is evidence that merles have been around but improperly registered until the 1980's. There is also evidence showing that the long coat chihuahuas were crossbred with papillons and pomeranians, but they're considered purebred chihuahuas as well. I guess it all comes down to what you believe. I'm not entirely sure what I think.
I researched into merle in chis and a couple other breeds too. a And that's the same thought I got from everything. Chis are a bit less controversial than other breeds.

Though there is a difference with crossing to get a color than crossing to get a long coat, imo. Merle specifically is a problematic color and I really think any one trying to keep potential problems out of their breed would not try to introduce that color.
__________________
Mia CGC - (5 year old papillon)
Summer TG3 TBAD - (10 year old papillon)
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 10-31-2008, 09:58 PM
~Jessie~'s Avatar
~Jessie~ ~Jessie~ is offline
Chihuahua Power!
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Central Florida
Posts: 19,601
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Laurelin View Post
I researched into merle in chis and a couple other breeds too. a And that's the same thought I got from everything. Chis are a bit less controversial than other breeds.

Though there is a difference with crossing to get a color than crossing to get a long coat, imo. Merle specifically is a problematic color and I really think any one trying to keep potential problems out of their breed would not try to introduce that color.
I agree, but so many colors in breeds come with their own set of issues. Dalmatians with no pigmentation, white boxers, etc.

I wasn't saying that LC chis are more or less healthy than merles... I was just saying that they were more than likely created by breeding the chihuahua with a different LC breed.
__________________

L to R: Chloe, Rylie, Emma, Tucker, and Rory
My Blog- Chihuahuas are not Sheep
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:09 PM.


1997-2013 Chazhound Dog Site