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  #21  
Old 08-14-2008, 09:06 AM
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I do pitty him for feeling so worthless .............it must be horrible but his poor wife , son , parents and friends .
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  #22  
Old 08-14-2008, 09:20 AM
Gempress Gempress is offline
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Originally Posted by mrose_s View Post
To think of the suicidal as selfish is an awful thing to do, I have never understood that point of view. Maybe its because I've been exposed to that side of things my entire life, I always wonder why before I pass judgment.
Why is it so awful? While I do pity the man and feel for what he must have been going through, I agree with Grammy....many suicides are selfish.

Take the case of this man, if it really was a suicide. Let's say he was depressed and took his own life. Now, he leaves behind a family who grieves for him, and a wife who herself may be racked with guilt as to what she could have done differently to prevent her husband's death. His young son will grow up with a father, and may be too young to understand why his daddy killed himself. What if he takes it personally, and thinks it's his fault? Children do that sometimes. And what about the future for his wife and child? Life for a single parent isn't easy, especially under such tragic circumstances.

By committing suicide to end his own *treatable* pain (depression IS treatable), this man has thrown the lives of people he swore to stand by "in sickness and in health" into uncertainty and grief, and possibly on the road to depression themselves.

I define that as selfish. But JMO, as always.
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  #23  
Old 08-14-2008, 09:44 AM
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Sad, but touching. Poor dog...poor family.

As for the rest of the conversation, I'll just leave it at "until you've been in that situation, don't be so quick to judge."
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  #24  
Old 08-14-2008, 09:49 AM
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Glad you saw my point Gem .
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  #25  
Old 08-14-2008, 09:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Zoom View Post
Sad, but touching. Poor dog...poor family.

As for the rest of the conversation, I'll just leave it at "until you've been in that situation, don't be so quick to judge."


With really serious depression, nothing makes sense, and it seems that it will never get better. Paranoia kicks in. I know. Suicide may be selfish, but it is best not to judge those who are, bluntly, not in their right minds so harshly. Its hard to understand really severe depression unless you've lived it . . . and all the solutions that seem so obvious to those of us that are well are not obvious at all.
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  #26  
Old 08-14-2008, 10:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gempress View Post
Why is it so awful? While I do pity the man and feel for what he must have been going through, I agree with Grammy....many suicides are selfish.

Take the case of this man, if it really was a suicide. Let's say he was depressed and took his own life. Now, he leaves behind a family who grieves for him, and a wife who herself may be racked with guilt as to what she could have done differently to prevent her husband's death. His young son will grow up with a father, and may be too young to understand why his daddy killed himself. What if he takes it personally, and thinks it's his fault? Children do that sometimes. And what about the future for his wife and child? Life for a single parent isn't easy, especially under such tragic circumstances.

By committing suicide to end his own *treatable* pain (depression IS treatable), this man has thrown the lives of people he swore to stand by "in sickness and in health" into uncertainty and grief, and possibly on the road to depression themselves.

I define that as selfish. But JMO, as always.
Maybe I worded myself badly/harshly, but IMO its not a good word to use in these circumstances, it is not that cut and dry and when you don't personally know the person/situation judgement should not be passed so quickly.
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  #27  
Old 08-14-2008, 10:21 AM
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I wasn't passing judgment on the person or situation. I just said that I think suicide is often a selfish act, and explained my viewpoint with a series of "what ifs". I have no clue what actually happened. *shrug*
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  #28  
Old 08-14-2008, 11:39 AM
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*sigh* Suicidal people don't think they have a choice. I'm sure if he wasn't have a MENTAL inbalance, and was not himself, he would have been able to see that the choice he made to kill himself wasn't a good one. Is it not fact that people who want to kill themsevles usually think their family is better off without them? I know it's terrible his children has lost a father, and his wife lost her love. But to call a man who needed medical help, who was having a mental problem, and who probably thought he was helping those around them rather than hurting them, selfish is like calling someone with a disease selfish. Right in there with alcoholics and drug addicts who we long to call selfish, it's a disease. It's sad to slap judgement on people, not realizing the entire picture of the disease they carry.

*sigh*
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  #29  
Old 08-14-2008, 12:01 PM
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thats what im posting here in bc canada this will happen to dog breeders .
Ummmm... what? Is that some sort of threat?
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  #30  
Old 08-14-2008, 12:11 PM
SizzleDog SizzleDog is offline
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*sigh* Suicidal people don't think they have a choice. I'm sure if he wasn't have a MENTAL inbalance, and was not himself, he would have been able to see that the choice he made to kill himself wasn't a good one. Is it not fact that people who want to kill themsevles usually think their family is better off without them? I know it's terrible his children has lost a father, and his wife lost her love. But to call a man who needed medical help, who was having a mental problem, and who probably thought he was helping those around them rather than hurting them, selfish is like calling someone with a disease selfish. Right in there with alcoholics and drug addicts who we long to call selfish, it's a disease. It's sad to slap judgement on people, not realizing the entire picture of the disease they carry.
I totally agree, good post!

I'd also like to make an observation - not necessarily about this particular situation, but in general... why is selfishness always seen as bad? It's YOUR life, and IMO you are not on this earth to suffer while you keep everyone else happy. Sometimes you just have to do things for *you*. I wonder if more people were "allowed" by society to think about their own welfare *first* a bit more, if we as a population would be happier.

And with cases like these, someone else is almost always seen as being "more important" than the one who was really suffering. And I do wonder how much support this man had in dealing with depression. I know I suffered for years with horrible depression in high school and my parents shrugged it off, said it was only a phase... if they had only stepped in and *helped*, I think I'd be a happier and more confident person today. But I bet if you ask them... they would say they did everything they could to help. Bull.

Just an observation, you can take it or leave it.
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