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  #21  
Old 07-29-2008, 02:20 PM
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sparks19 sparks19 is offline
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Originally Posted by Buddy'sParents View Post
While I agree with you, I do not feel that anyone would WANT their dogs to be in harms way. I would protect my dogs and I know (for sure) that two of the three of them would protect me. It does not mean that I would push them out in front of me and let them take a bullet first, that is absurd and offensive. It does not mean that I would ever WANT them to be in the position where they felt they needed to protect me. It does not mean that I would allow them to have a few gnawings on someone before I were to call 911.

It does mean, however, that my dogs would protect me if the need arose. It is really as simple as that. We have a guardian breed and I would never attempt to train her natural, instinctive traits out of her. We have another dog that I never would have thought would protect me, but he did. We strive to make their lives safe and their surrounding environments safe, but sometimes things happen and sometimes people and animals feel they need to protect.


and just to add... that I love my dogs very much and I will do whatever I can to ensure their safety but when push comes to shove my priorities have to lie with protecting my daughter first. if I can protect both dogs and my daughter at the same time I wouldn't hesitate to do so but if I had to choose I would have to go with hannah. BUT I have no doubt that I wouldn't GET the chance to protect Beezer because he would put himself up in the front to protect Hannah even if it were against my wishes
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  #22  
Old 07-29-2008, 02:47 PM
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You'd have to define protect for me. Is it bark and snarl, showing teeth, hair standing up so the bad guy runs away? (to me that is a complete fear reaction) Is it nip or half heartedly bite someone so they run away? (more fear) Is it engaging someone who is physically assaulting you, and holding onto them even if the bad guy is kicking and punching them, until you call the dog off? (closer)

We have a guy who comes to train with us who thinks his dog will protect him. The reality is the dog is a fear biter. He'll bite the decoy to get him to leave him alone. He'll bite soft, cheap shot bite, and and bite shallow in the mouth, more like a nip than a good bite. He won't hold on if you put up any kind of fight. If you run at the dog he'll run away, but he'll bark and growl and show his teeth the whole time.

The guy wanted to do a simulated car jacking the other day, which his dog isn't close to being ready for. The decoy got loud and physical with the handler outside the car, and the handler "escaped" long enough to let the dog out of the car. The dog went after the decoy, bit the sleeve, then turned away. Now, most people would run if they saw that dog coming at them, he's a big white GSD. Anyone who KNEW him would run right at him and scare him away. Honestly, that's how MOST dogs are. Given the chance of fight or flight, they are going to take flight. It's the natural response- live another day.

I bet out of all the responses to this thread so far, where people who have said yes their dog would protect them, there are only a few dogs who would REALLY protect you. I bet most of them could be run off, even if the person they were going after took a few bites in the process. Most dogs don't want the fight.

Protect to me means fight to the death if that is what is required. Hopefully it never comes to that. Even with his training I don't know, and I don't want to know if Gunnar would take it that far. When it really comes down to it, I'm going to be right there protecting him while he protects me, we work as a team and that's how we'll go out.
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  #23  
Old 07-29-2008, 02:52 PM
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DanL,it would depend on the scale of "protect" to me.
If i was arguing verbally id tell my dogs to shut up,if i was jumped on by 4/5 guys or robbed id hope my dogs would fetch me somebodys butt cheeks after.

Seriously i think my dogs are wise enough to distinguise whats serious and what is not.
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  #24  
Old 07-29-2008, 02:57 PM
release the hounds release the hounds is offline
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when the stuff hits the fan, most people would be suprised at their dogs reactions. A lot of dogs that people swear would protect them cause they've shown teeth before will be gone so far so fast, and some that never show protective traits can stand up and defend their handler to the end.

Even training isn't always a good predictor.
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  #25  
Old 07-29-2008, 02:58 PM
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I don't know how far T-Bone would go.... but two door to door sales guys were harassing me bad... and one put his arm out as to push open my door... T-Bone just stood next to me snarling with every piece of hair hackled.. That was enough to have them back off.

Another instance she put a guy from the housing office in a corner who came in without permission. Her snarling is usually enough for people not to come closer or at least not to move.
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  #26  
Old 07-29-2008, 03:08 PM
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I doubt Raja would, as she was very timid and has now switched to thinking pretty much every person she meets is her friend. However, I have been wrong about that before, so I could be underestimating her.

And I have no doubt that my cats would say "sorry about your luck" and stroll off to a quiet part of the house. Were they attacked, it would be a different story. But they are the queens of the house, and I am just a lowly servant.
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  #27  
Old 07-29-2008, 03:09 PM
borzoimom borzoimom is offline
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I have had several situations over the years.. Dogs totally accepting of anyone then surprise me what they know.. One time I was walking with Hottie, on a a bike trail. Hottie pulled up to me ( normally he trots on ahead) as we passed this man. I heard a low growl from Hottie.. He never did that before- we saw people alllllll the time.. He did that day. As we continued to walk, hottie kept turning his head to look backwards, and I turned and saw the man watching us. I got home and my best friend left a message a rapist had hit on the bike trail we were on earlier in the day and did we make it home.. Another time- I had shepherds - most were working dogs, but one was just obedience and show. My daughter was very young, and I walked in the house to get her some juice or something, when I heard Misty go off! I ran out the door to find my shepherd with a man treed on the AC unit. This dog was never trained to protect, but this man climbed over a 6 foot high fence ( that was pad locked) into the yard with my daughter... Another time- My Belgium Chance who was acutally only obedience, refused from Morristown Seeing eye as she refused to disobey ( a trait needed to be a seeing eye dog)- one day I was running the vac. She kept running at the curtain in the family room.. Over and over- NOOOOOOO LAY DOWN.. - here she would come again.. Kept barking but ONLY if I got near the door.. Finally I got mad.. " CHANCE - STOP - QUIET..".. Pulled the cord from the vac, then my eye caught something shiny in the carpet- the glass was broken at the door knob! Whoever it was did not try to enter but we had a security system- but she knew it was there. And prior to that NEVER disobeyed a command as I told her at least 2 to 3 times... She knew it!
Big old goof ball Zubin- we tease about him allllll the time- never met a stranger... I swear he never read the standand on a Borzoi being aloof.. I had the house open and if anyone that met zubin will tell you, he will meet you with a bone in his mouth, gentle calm and quiet.. I had the house open when all of a sudden the floor rumbled with "WOOOOOOOOOOOOOF WOOOOOOOOOOOF"... A borzoi has a deep chest- when they bark, the floor rumbles.. sure enough- here was a hiker at my deck screen porch door...
I am not sure how dogs know- but they know- Zubin ignored hikers before, Chance would obey what I said, Misty was use to those coming in the yard to " read the meter" - yet somehow- someway- they knew that day- this was not right...
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  #28  
Old 07-29-2008, 03:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by release the hounds View Post
when the stuff hits the fan, most people would be suprised at their dogs reactions. A lot of dogs that people swear would protect them cause they've shown teeth before will be gone so far so fast, and some that never show protective traits can stand up and defend their handler to the end.

Even training isn't always a good predictor.
Exactly. I've never seen any of the dogs we train who are good dogs show teeth. They just come at you. There is no warning signs like get away from me because I'm growling at you with all my hair up and showing you my big sharp teeth. While those factors are intimidating to the average person, it in no way means the dog would take it any farther.

Your comment about training was my point about Gunnar. He's training for it so he knows the score. He's been "tested" with a live decoy sneaking into my yard acting like a bad guy and he did what I expected, he bit him and held on until I told him to let go, then he ran him out of the yard. How long he'd hang in there if someone was trying to really hurt him, you just don't know.
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  #29  
Old 07-29-2008, 03:12 PM
corsomom corsomom is offline
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I think most people want to beleive their dog would protect them, but I agree with dan and hounds, most dogs are going to chose flight over fight with a real threat. My dogs can put on a good show, and would scare the average person away, but dont know if I would count on them to protect me in a real threat situation. They are a good deterent though.
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  #30  
Old 07-29-2008, 03:19 PM
borzoimom borzoimom is offline
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One of several of my shepherds out of my litters was also a police dog in SF. One night the officer went to work for a meeting and paperwork, and left the dog at home with his wife and two kids.. That night as he was at work, the dog- off duty, was at home with the family. When uh ************* gang members tried to enter the house.. They tried to come in the basement window- the dog went after one, caught the second and the 3rd shot him. The dog ( shot mind you) dove out the window after the man. The man was later identified at a near by hospital for bite wounds to him.. While this dog was trained for protection, the fact is- the dog was in his home with his family..
I never doubt a dog will defend you when the chips are down- no matter the breed..
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