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  #1  
Old 06-24-2008, 04:17 AM
Squishy22
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Question European rotties and dobies.

Ok, so I've noticed something about these two breeds. The European style Rottweilers and Dobermans look a bit over sized. Is that normal and acceptable or is "European" just an excuse to breed extra large dogs?

To be honest, I like rotties and dobes to have a somewhat heavy bone structure. But not too big to the point of looking mastiffy. I see a lot of dobies that tend to be very small and dainty in particular, even males. Some males I see look like females to me.

I am so confused because I look at one breeder and they have champion dogs that look overly massive, and then I check out another breeder and they have smaller dogs that are champions also. Huh? Are the standards that loose?

Maybe why I like the heavier dogs is because they seem to have better head pieces. The smaller ones have softer features. I dont know if thats a coincidence or not. Heavier dobies seem to have better chests on them.

I am not familiar with the breed standards, but I plan on reading up on it.

I have included pictures for this thread. First are the rotties. These dogs seem a bit too big to me, but I believe some of them are even champions. How do they look to you?

Adult male.


This guy is only 14 months.


This boy is only 13 months.


This is a female. She looks kinda masculine to me. I dunno. I could be wrong.
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  #2  
Old 06-24-2008, 04:25 AM
Squishy22
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Now check out this rottie. Obviously he is not as heavy as the first adult male I posted. His head is smaller, and his body is much less massive looking. This guy looks amazing to me. Do you see the difference? The more I look at this guy, the more I think the first guy looks like a MASTIFF!



Now the dobies...

This guy is a champion I believe. Overly massive?




These two males have head pieces that are a lot bigger than I usually see. Is this normal or over done? Wait... I think the first one might be female. I forget. Darn it.
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  #3  
Old 06-24-2008, 04:36 AM
Squishy22
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For some reason, I envision dobies to have much more of a tuck than this boy.


This guy has a body bigger than some Rotties I see. Normal?
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Old 06-24-2008, 06:31 AM
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the body seems not proportioned i dont know if its normal to them but i dont think it looks good...
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  #5  
Old 06-24-2008, 07:33 AM
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Dunno where you're finding those pictures, but I've never seen rotties and dobes like that.
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  #6  
Old 06-24-2008, 08:42 AM
RedyreRottweilers
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Actually I think all the Rottweilers you posted are nice, ESPECIALLY the bitch.

It is impossible to tell from these photos if these dogs are oversized or not.

The first dog MIGHT be considered slightly "overdone". You can have TOO much bone, and TOO much head. The Rottweiler should be powerful with heavy bone without being cumbersome or losing athleticism.

Dog in Europe, in particular Germany and other countries where there are strict regulations regarding breeding tend to NOT be oversized. No dog in Germany can be bred before completing the Ztpr test, where the dog is evaluated as to breed type, MEASURED, and the temperament is evaluated. This is the most basic breed test, almost ALL dogs earn at least a SCH1 or IPO1 before breeding.

I will not comment on the Doberman Pinscher as I am not familiar enough with that breed, however, in my limited experience there is a much larger divergence of type between the Dobes in the US and the Dobes in Europe.

It might be better nettiquette to post links to the pictures instead of the actual photos.

JMO as always.
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Old 06-24-2008, 08:53 AM
RedyreRottweilers
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reggin View Post
Now check out this rottie. Obviously he is not as heavy as the first adult male I posted. His head is smaller, and his body is much less massive looking. This guy looks amazing to me. Do you see the difference? The more I look at this guy, the more I think the first guy looks like a MASTIFF!

This dog is Multi V-1 ARV/AKC Champion Jeneck's Sam BH,SchH3,IPO3,AD,Korung,ABST, CGC

I am not sure if Sam is still living, if so he is an old dog by now. He was a VERY beautiful dog in his day, with a lovely head piece, and an OUTSTANDING working dog. He and his owner/trainer Amanda competed internationally, represented the US on the IFR team of working dogs. Sam was a magnificent specimen of the breed both on and off the working field, with flawless temperament and character.

Amanda kept him in the utmost physical condition while she was working and showing him. Sam produced many very nice progeny during his breeding lifetime as well.
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  #8  
Old 06-24-2008, 10:14 AM
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The way I've come to understand both breeds is that the American lines have become the lighter, more refined versions and the Euro ones are still holding closer to what the breeds used to look like before the "repackaging for show rings" craze began.
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  #9  
Old 06-24-2008, 10:24 AM
RedyreRottweilers
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Not generally so for Rotties. There does seem to be a recent trend for SOME lines of european Rottweilers to be overdone, sometimes in bone, sometimes in head.

However, most of the time the type and structure of the good dogs is quite similar.

I do see some obvious structural differences since the outlawing of docking in the late 90s. Some of the tailed dogs have much more fall of croup, and tend to have more turn of stifle. I expect these differences will only intensify over the years as long as we keep one step ahead of those who want to outlaw docking here in the US.
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Old 06-24-2008, 10:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zoom View Post
The way I've come to understand both breeds is that the American lines have become the lighter, more refined versions and the Euro ones are still holding closer to what the breeds used to look like before the "repackaging for show rings" craze began.

Eh, that depends on who you talk to. Basically what you got is two different interpretations of the breed standard going on across the seas. (though those Rotties look nice to my unexperienced eye)

At the risk of a broad, sweeping generalization you'll generally find European style dogs to be heavier set than American/Canadian dogs.

Also, in many breeds there is a striking difference between dogs from mainland European lines and then English lines. Boxers come to mind specifically. Breed type there varies a LOT. (Danes are another one.... as are dobes)

Here's a fun linky- http://www.boxerunderground.com/bu20...boxer_type.htm

http://www.worldwideboxer.com/PAGE2.html

Then depending on where you live, everyone argues about which breed type is best and everyone has their own opinions on it.
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Last edited by Laurelin; 06-24-2008 at 10:52 AM.
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