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  #31  
Old 02-16-2008, 12:56 AM
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Originally Posted by blue View Post
At least Im not the only one who sees this thread as blatant self promotion.
lol, funny how it didn't work, huh? They must be getting desperate, I guess people arent quite as stupid as they expected. I wonder if they have to move again and look for fresh meat??
Hey shouldn't that very old generation with their out dated so called training methods start to die off soon?? Or at least get start to be so crippled up that they can't do anymore damage?
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  #32  
Old 02-16-2008, 01:52 AM
Chikadee77 Chikadee77 is offline
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Originally Posted by adojrts View Post
Well how interesting, I made a couple of phone calls since I last posted.
I spoke with some folks that have some very high credentials and asked them what they knew about this chap.
They said that he *allegedly*, has taken dogs in for training, charged $700.00 and NOT trained the dogs nor had there been any success with any or little training that had been done ( so much for his guarantee). That he allegedly, doesn't show up for prepaid lessons. Nobody in the dog industry in his direct area wants anything to do with him and its appears that he was also in the Ottawa area before and his rep. was the same there.

Hmm, he sounds like a "trainer" we have here in the Springs... "Mutt Master" Bob Warren. He's a con artist that's pretty much banned from all training clubs and centers here, so he had to start his own place. If you go to any training center (besides his) around here and ask about him, you will not hear anything good at all about him. No one seems to know what kind of training methods he uses because he never trains the dogs that are brought to him! Just charges them money for the dog to sit in a kennel all day and then when the owner comes to pick up their dog, he tells them the dog needs more training and needs to stay longer (for of course more money!). And people would actually buy it too.... I've heard that he trains Personal Protection dogs though, which is pretty scary given his track record.

Maybe theses two are related?
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  #33  
Old 02-16-2008, 09:25 AM
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Originally Posted by BostonBanker
Umm...wrong. Even if you are a tried-and-true supporter of the stave school of training, and believe that only hormonal silly females would use treats to train their dog, operant conditioning isn't bribing with food. At all. Operant conditioning is using consequences to change the volutary behavior of an animal. That could mean "If you come running over when I call you, I will give you this piece of steak" or "If you get up when I tell you to stay, I will whack you with this stave". You CAN'T train any animal without operant conditioning, because operant conditioning IS training - that's basically the definition. I'd be hard pressed to listen to any "trainer" who didn't bother to educate themselves at least that far.

.

Hi there,
You forgot to add that the treat is supposed to be weaned.However I have known many dogs where the treat was not weaned.
Wait, what? I don't think anything in the definition of operant conditioning talks about the need to wean treats. Again, operant conditioning ISN'T a method of training - it IS training. So whether I choose to always give my dog a treat when she comes running at my call, or if I wean her off treats and just give her praise, or beat her with a stave - it's all operant conditioning. There is always a consequence to whatever action my dog chooses, and that consequence will affect the behavior in the future.

I have no idea what your comment and mine have to do with each other.
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  #34  
Old 02-16-2008, 09:32 AM
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LOL boston.. Ask them if they wean punishment. HAHAHA. So if some day the dog doesn't listen do they stand there and think 'darn, I can't punish (stave, leash pop, yell etc) at the dog, cause I have weaned off punishment now that my dog is TRAINED. That I would like to see.

They think its ok to use P+ for the rest of the dogs life to keep it tuned up. But heaven forbid if we use treats (and of course all educated people know that treats means toys, food, scratches, or what ever the dog deems valuable) to occasionally tune up a trained dog!

I once had a client who had done obed training with this guy. She had a wonderful dog. But she adamanty wouldn't use a clicker (that was before I made it mandatory) or food. Only toy rewards. Problem was she handn't built enough toy drive in the dog. The other dogs in the class progressed so nicely (and M Morrison if you are reading NO ONE IN MY CLASSES EVER LURES... luring is stupid and ineffective) using effective R+. Her dog wouldn't work and she wouldn't change. She blamed her poor dog. (never once really getting in through her head that if her training method isn't working for her dog... maybe she should re think it)
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  #35  
Old 02-16-2008, 09:42 AM
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Brandy J. M Oliver, MA, states that if a dog has bitten someone, and especially if he has drawn blood, he has a much greater chance of repeating this action.
because we all know how dogs get after they taste blood

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Dog training with food is not a very smart practice, especially if children are involved. Food bribery training often destroys the respect for people. amateur trainers make many dogs even more pushy and aggressive. This happens a lot.
Because if you train with food then your dog looses all respect for you and attacks you

And can't go past a picture of a child riding a dog on this page
http://www.dougmorrisonk-9development.com/programs.htm

I can't believe the misconceptions about PR training.
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  #36  
Old 02-16-2008, 11:01 AM
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Your dog lives with me for 4-5 weeks to become fully trained.
4-5 Weeks?!?!? And they're fully trained?!?!?! Wow! All of us service and guide dog schools really need to figure out how he does that!
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  #37  
Old 02-16-2008, 11:28 AM
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Originally Posted by lizzybeth727 View Post
4-5 Weeks?!?!? And they're fully trained?!?!?! Wow! All of us service and guide dog schools really need to figure out how he does that!
Oh gezzz, I have another ex police dog trainer (NOT Morrison) that lives not to far from here.
He doesn't believe in clickers etc and he thinks that dogs should work only for praise. Now to give this guy credit, I don't think he is as brutal as some others and to speak to him, he is a least not rude etc.


I also have to give him credit..........I was at a fair and I had Petie with me, this guy was putting a agility demo with some students. He had an open question period and I asked him a couple of questions and we ended up having a good chat.
He then invited me to bring my dog into the ring and give a demo of a dog that competes in agility.
At the end he complimented me on how well my dog was trained etc and he did this in front of the crowd. That was pretty big of him considering that we didn't agree on methods........
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  #38  
Old 05-06-2008, 12:20 AM
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Nice.. they are multiplying.. This one just opened down the street from me.. trained by.. Morrison. Wonderful..

http://packmentality.ca/
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  #39  
Old 05-06-2008, 06:22 AM
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The look on the face of the black dog says it all. And is that a dog on a treadmill wearing a weighted blanket? I can't imagine what else it would be.

Well, at least now you will have easy access to some REAL training for Smudge. All you problems will be solved!
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  #40  
Old 05-06-2008, 01:53 PM
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Totally eh. My mom saw them advertised on a sign.. So I looked them up and was horrified. I'm not sure how or why in this day and age that yank and crank training is multiplying..
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