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  #11  
Old 12-09-2007, 12:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Psyfalcon View Post
You know, you shouldn't do that again, due to XYZ. Furthermore, you may have problems due to that... since you now have a puppy however, this is how to keep it in one piece physically and mentally....

While I don't agree with byb or puppymilling I have better things to do than berate the puppy buyer.... like berating the breeder that should know better...
But many of the breeders don't care, the buyers (most) do because they are dealing with the fallout.
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  #12  
Old 12-09-2007, 12:28 AM
Psyfalcon Psyfalcon is offline
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But many of the breeders don't care, the buyers (most) do because they are dealing with the fallout.
Yes, so the buyers aren't likely to do it again after come gentle prodding to petfinder or good breeders. No need for long lectures on ethics or berating (as has happened a couple times...).
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  #13  
Old 12-09-2007, 12:31 AM
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Yes, so the buyers aren't likely to do it again after come gentle prodding to petfinder or good breeders. No need for long lectures on ethics or berating (as has happened a couple times...).
What if said person has done the same things multiple times, despite gentle prodding? What would you do then? More gentle prodding, hoping one day, after all the past puppies, they wake up to realize that just might not be the best way to go about things? (not being sarcastic here, I'm seriously asking waht you (personally) would do then.)
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  #14  
Old 12-09-2007, 12:37 AM
Psyfalcon Psyfalcon is offline
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Originally Posted by Babyblue5290 View Post
What if said person has done the same things multiple times, despite gentle prodding? What would you do then? More gentle prodding, hoping one day, after all the past puppies, they wake up to realize that just might not be the best way to go about things? (not being sarcastic here, I'm seriously asking waht you (personally) would do then.)
Apples and... watermelons

In that case, its much different than someone who did it out of ignorance... at some point nothing you say is going to work, but then I doubt they'd follow training/health advice either, so I'd stop worrying about scaring them off.

Luckily, they seem to be the minority on here.
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  #15  
Old 12-09-2007, 01:04 AM
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Apples and... watermelons

In that case, its much different than someone who did it out of ignorance... at some point nothing you say is going to work, but then I doubt they'd follow training/health advice either, so I'd stop worrying about scaring them off.

Luckily, they seem to be the minority on here.
Both apples and watermelons are semi-round fruits. Some apples green, some apples red, and some yellow. Watermelons are red, green, and yellow(ish). heheh. Not necessarily completely different things.

What if both did it out of ignorance. One did it over and over again because they where ignorant to their true harm, and the other well....did it once but for the same reason even if both had resources available to them that it was wrong for them if they so looked. Not that they would if they really didn't know better.

Or if both where here on chaz for a long time. Read about puppymills/byb's and such, yet still claimed ignorance. Or did the same things over again?

One thing doesn't mean they won't listen to another. They may agree with training, or up front agree, but justify themselves for doing the same thing (that most) believe is morally wrong over and over again.
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  #16  
Old 12-09-2007, 01:14 AM
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I do not agree with the statement; "What's done is done." HOWEVER, I am willing to move on if and when I feel that the person understands the moral conflicts involved, and are sympathetic and regretful about mistakes. I would never scold a person who is truly remorseful for supporting a BYB/PM/whatever, and truly understands the problem with doing so. Everyone makes mistakes, and there is shockingly little knowledge in the general public regarding how to spot bad breeders.

I definitely feel that it isn't what you say, it's how you say it. If you attack some one who has done something that you don't agree with, they are instinctively going to become defensive. You're most likely just wasting your time and energy, because your advice will probably be ignored, completely. If you offer supportive, gentle advice and information, you will usually get a much more receptive response... and your advice will usually make a MUCH bigger impact.

I don't agree with turning the other cheek, and ignoring wrong-doings, at all. Apathy is useless. But I find personal attacks, on a dog forum, very childish and rude.
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  #17  
Old 12-09-2007, 01:33 AM
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Originally Posted by ihartgonzo View Post
I do not agree with the statement; "What's done is done." HOWEVER, I am willing to move on if and when I feel that the person understands the moral conflicts involved, and are sympathetic and regretful about mistakes. I would never scold a person who is truly remorseful for supporting a BYB/PM/whatever, and truly understands the problem with doing so. Everyone makes mistakes, and there is shockingly little knowledge in the general public regarding how to spot bad breeders.

I definitely feel that it isn't what you say, it's how you say it. If you attack some one who has done something that you don't agree with, they are instinctively going to become defensive. You're most likely just wasting your time and energy, because your advice will probably be ignored, completely. If you offer supportive, gentle advice and information, you will usually get a much more receptive response... and your advice will usually make a MUCH bigger impact.

I don't agree with turning the other cheek, and ignoring wrong-doings, at all. Apathy is useless. But I find personal attacks, on a dog forum, very childish and rude.
I agree for the most part. Though with the internet, not only is the way you say it important, but the mindset of the person reading it is important too. If they anticipate aggression, all they will hear is agression and start defensive in the first place.

But also, if you're too passive, what are the chances someone will "hear" your message?

And then agian, what's too passive and what's childish and an attack? Those are so subjective. What one person thinks of as an attack, may have not been seen as such by another.
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  #18  
Old 12-09-2007, 01:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Babyblue5290 View Post
But also, if you're too passive, what are the chances someone will "hear" your message?

And then agian, what's too passive and what's childish and an attack? Those are so subjective. What one person thinks of as an attack, may have not been seen as such by another.
I agree, with not being too passive... I have been too passive with giving friends & relatives advice in the past, and they have ended up with BYB/PM puppies... a few of which turned into absolute horror stories. But, then again, you cannot force people to listen to you. All you can do, is give them as much good advice as you can. Some people just DON'T listen, no matter how good your advice is, and that isn't your fault, and it isn't anything you can control.

To me... name-calling, personal judgement, and blatant rudeness is childish, and what most would consider an attack. There are hyper-sensitive people who consider almost any kind of criticism an attack; but there are generally obvious differences between constructive criticism and personal attacks.
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  #19  
Old 12-09-2007, 01:59 AM
Buddy'sParents Buddy'sParents is offline
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What one person thinks of as an attack, may have not been seen as such by another.
If it's even questionable at all- it should not be said. We should all read and re-read our posts before hitting submit, too easy to get caught up in the "educating" moment.
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  #20  
Old 12-09-2007, 02:02 AM
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If it's even questionable at all- it should not be said. We should all read and re-read our posts before hitting submit, too easy to get caught up in the "educating" moment.
Questionable to one isn't questionable to another though. It may not sound bad to you yet someone else takes it as offensive.

I agree, everyone should re-read their posts before submitting it.

We are off subject. Back to the original subject please.

Original Subject: Do you agree with "what's done is done" and the sentiments that go along with it. etc.
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