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  #31  
Old 11-21-2007, 11:34 PM
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Originally Posted by FoxyWench View Post
ive yet to meet a dog that wouldnt back up the growl IF it truly felt it needed to...
Sorry, I gotta disagree here. Most dogs will not back up a growl, and if they do bite, it's a fear bite. A fear bite is done to try and get whoever/whatever is bothering the dog to go away. The dog does not want to engage in a fight, they simply want the problem to cease. They posture and growl, and then maybe take a cheap bite as a last resort. In reality, a lot of dogs that are protective breeds will do the same thing. In just the last 4 months at our dog club I've seen a half dozen GSDs, Rottie mixes, big American Bull Terriers who wanted to join us, and none of them would engage a person who was making threats towards them or their owners. Most showed total avoidance. The rottie mix even laid down as a simulated attack on his owner took place. ALL of these people thought their dog would protect them, and none did or showed any desire to. Imagine the lady who was having a simulated attack done on her and she's watching her trusted protective pet lay down and not even pay attention to her screaming. She got a dose of reality real fast.

Put one of the dogs you were talking about- cockers, chis, crested, whatever, up against someone like me. Let it growl and posture and I'll make one assertive, quick, menacing move to that dog and it will most likely pee itself. It's not going to attack me. And if it does, it gets punted, and I guarantee it isn't coming back for more. This is what someone who is determined to get you or your property is going to do, a little dog is one small obstacle in their quest. In turn, show me a GSD, a Rottie, Dobie, Bouvier, Mal, that is silent and is standing it's ground with confidence, I'm not going to test that dog. That's the dog that will have no problem taking the fight to you and who won't give up.

I'm not sure what to tell the original poster. A dog that will really protect you is not a dime a dozen dog, it has to have the right genetics, the right training, and is going to be a LOT of work. For a dog like that 99% of it's life is training, and maybe once does it get to prove it can do what it was trained to do. There is really no way around it. Maybe getting a giant dog like a Mastiff is best because they are a great deterrant, but they still require a lot of training and won't be mature enough to really do anything protection wise till they are at least 2 years old.

The main point of my post was to try and quell this myth that any dog will protect, it's simply not true.
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  #32  
Old 11-21-2007, 11:38 PM
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Noccy, a lot of the livestock guardians and mastiff breeds have lower exercise requirements. If you're okay with a really big dog, why not look into a female English Mastiff? They're obviously a lot larger than a Rottweiler, but they're generally rather agreeable dogs and the ones I've been around were not difficult to control, despite their size.
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  #33  
Old 11-21-2007, 11:38 PM
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Originally Posted by DanL View Post
Sorry, I gotta disagree here. Most dogs will not back up a growl, and if they do bite, it's a fear bite. A fear bite is done to try and get whoever/whatever is bothering the dog to go away. The dog does not want to engage in a fight, they simply want the problem to cease. They posture and growl, and then maybe take a cheap bite as a last resort. In reality, a lot of dogs that are protective breeds will do the same thing. In just the last 4 months at our dog club I've seen a half dozen GSDs, Rottie mixes, big American Bull Terriers who wanted to join us, and none of them would engage a person who was making threats towards them or their owners. Most showed total avoidance. The rottie mix even laid down as a simulated attack on his owner took place. ALL of these people thought their dog would protect them, and none did or showed any desire to. Imagine the lady who was having a simulated attack done on her and she's watching her trusted protective pet lay down and not even pay attention to her screaming. She got a dose of reality real fast.

Put one of the dogs you were talking about- cockers, chis, crested, whatever, up against someone like me. Let it growl and posture and I'll make one assertive, quick, menacing move to that dog and it will most likely pee itself. It's not going to attack me. And if it does, it gets punted, and I guarantee it isn't coming back for more. This is what someone who is determined to get you or your property is going to do, a little dog is one small obstacle in their quest. In turn, show me a GSD, a Rottie, Dobie, Bouvier, Mal, that is silent and is standing it's ground with confidence, I'm not going to test that dog. That's the dog that will have no problem taking the fight to you and who won't give up.

I'm not sure what to tell the original poster. A dog that will really protect you is not a dime a dozen dog, it has to have the right genetics, the right training, and is going to be a LOT of work. For a dog like that 99% of it's life is training, and maybe once does it get to prove it can do what it was trained to do. There is really no way around it. Maybe getting a giant dog like a Mastiff is best because they are a great deterrant, but they still require a lot of training and won't be mature enough to really do anything protection wise till they are at least 2 years old.

The main point of my post was to try and quell this myth that any dog will protect, it's simply not true.
^^^I really agree!
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  #34  
Old 11-22-2007, 12:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DanL View Post
Sorry, I gotta disagree here. Most dogs will not back up a growl, and if they do bite, it's a fear bite. A fear bite is done to try and get whoever/whatever is bothering the dog to go away. The dog does not want to engage in a fight, they simply want the problem to cease. They posture and growl, and then maybe take a cheap bite as a last resort. In reality, a lot of dogs that are protective breeds will do the same thing. In just the last 4 months at our dog club I've seen a half dozen GSDs, Rottie mixes, big American Bull Terriers who wanted to join us, and none of them would engage a person who was making threats towards them or their owners. Most showed total avoidance. The rottie mix even laid down as a simulated attack on his owner took place. ALL of these people thought their dog would protect them, and none did or showed any desire to. Imagine the lady who was having a simulated attack done on her and she's watching her trusted protective pet lay down and not even pay attention to her screaming. She got a dose of reality real fast.

Put one of the dogs you were talking about- cockers, chis, crested, whatever, up against someone like me. Let it growl and posture and I'll make one assertive, quick, menacing move to that dog and it will most likely pee itself. It's not going to attack me. And if it does, it gets punted, and I guarantee it isn't coming back for more. This is what someone who is determined to get you or your property is going to do, a little dog is one small obstacle in their quest. In turn, show me a GSD, a Rottie, Dobie, Bouvier, Mal, that is silent and is standing it's ground with confidence, I'm not going to test that dog. That's the dog that will have no problem taking the fight to you and who won't give up.

I'm not sure what to tell the original poster. A dog that will really protect you is not a dime a dozen dog, it has to have the right genetics, the right training, and is going to be a LOT of work. For a dog like that 99% of it's life is training, and maybe once does it get to prove it can do what it was trained to do. There is really no way around it. Maybe getting a giant dog like a Mastiff is best because they are a great deterrant, but they still require a lot of training and won't be mature enough to really do anything protection wise till they are at least 2 years old.

The main point of my post was to try and quell this myth that any dog will protect, it's simply not true.
Well said!
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  #35  
Old 11-22-2007, 12:33 AM
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I would feel very safe with an Akita as well. My only concern would be the potential for small animal aggression. And also, how does the OP feel about a heavily-furred dog blowing its coat twice yearly? I also wouldn't consider an Akita much of a watch dog due to the rarely-barks factor, but they are a very intimidating presence. My old Pit Bull/Akita mix was, if nothing else, an excellent personal protector and a great deterrent. You do need to heavily socialize them, IMO, because it is easy for them to go from protective to over-protective, suspicious, potentially aggressive.

ETA: What about something like a Rhodesian Ridgeback? I have no personal experience with them, but I've heard they're good protectors.
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  #36  
Old 11-22-2007, 12:54 AM
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Personally I feel that the first thing an intruder would do would be to shoot any dog .
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  #37  
Old 11-22-2007, 02:40 AM
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I think they would, too, Grammy. But most intruders with half a brain would pass over a house where a dog resides, particularly a dog that would bark when anyone gets close to the house.

I agree with Dan about a dog backing up a threat, but at the same time I think 99.9***37; of intruders, no matter how determined, will be deterred by any threat made by a dog - even if it's a fear-based growl. They probably don't know the motivation behind the aggression, they just know that a big angry dog is coming after them and it's human instinct to either run away or fight back. Unless armed and trigger-happy, most people will retreat.
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  #38  
Old 11-22-2007, 05:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DanL View Post
Sorry, I gotta disagree here. Most dogs will not back up a growl, and if they do bite, it's a fear bite. A fear bite is done to try and get whoever/whatever is bothering the dog to go away. The dog does not want to engage in a fight, they simply want the problem to cease. They posture and growl, and then maybe take a cheap bite as a last resort. In reality, a lot of dogs that are protective breeds will do the same thing. In just the last 4 months at our dog club I've seen a half dozen GSDs, Rottie mixes, big American Bull Terriers who wanted to join us, and none of them would engage a person who was making threats towards them or their owners. Most showed total avoidance. The rottie mix even laid down as a simulated attack on his owner took place. ALL of these people thought their dog would protect them, and none did or showed any desire to. Imagine the lady who was having a simulated attack done on her and she's watching her trusted protective pet lay down and not even pay attention to her screaming. She got a dose of reality real fast.

Put one of the dogs you were talking about- cockers, chis, crested, whatever, up against someone like me. Let it growl and posture and I'll make one assertive, quick, menacing move to that dog and it will most likely pee itself. It's not going to attack me. And if it does, it gets punted, and I guarantee it isn't coming back for more. This is what someone who is determined to get you or your property is going to do, a little dog is one small obstacle in their quest. In turn, show me a GSD, a Rottie, Dobie, Bouvier, Mal, that is silent and is standing it's ground with confidence, I'm not going to test that dog. That's the dog that will have no problem taking the fight to you and who won't give up.

I'm not sure what to tell the original poster. A dog that will really protect you is not a dime a dozen dog, it has to have the right genetics, the right training, and is going to be a LOT of work. For a dog like that 99% of it's life is training, and maybe once does it get to prove it can do what it was trained to do. There is really no way around it. Maybe getting a giant dog like a Mastiff is best because they are a great deterrant, but they still require a lot of training and won't be mature enough to really do anything protection wise till they are at least 2 years old.

The main point of my post was to try and quell this myth that any dog will protect, it's simply not true.
One more time this has to be quoted! Very well said Dan!! And I agree with what RD said aswell. If a random attacker or intruder is targeting a place, they are looking for an easy target, and a dog immediatley takes things to a new level. They do not know whether the resident dog will act out or alarm their owner. Often the very presence of a dog will act as a deterrent. Now whether the dog will truely act out is another question. Most owners would like to believe that their dog would step up to the plate and protect but very few actually will.

To the OP, first and foremost any and all puppies will have lots of energy. The first year they WILL require lots of daily walks, good runs, and lots of play time. Are you prepared to provide the adequate excersise that a pup needs, or are you willing to look into a more mellow adult dog? Personally, I think a pup does not suit the requirements that you are searching for.

Yes, there are several breeds that have a natural protection drive, but many of these breeds have very high prey drive, high energy levels, or higher than daily walks anyhow, they require good runs. If I had to pick a breed that would suit you I would suggest again an English Mastiff, but they aren't for every dog owner. They have large vet bills, drool alot, and are VERY big. However, an adult is very layed back and content to lay on the couch all day long. Their size alone will make any intruder rethink facing up to a 200 lb dog and testing whether or not they will react. A mastiff was originally used for guarding, although the temperment is much more relaxed than it once was, they still have the instinct to protect if they absolutley must. Typically a Mastiff will get in between you and whatever is causing the threat thus causing the threat to leave before they have to become reactive.

Alot of people over look the giant breeds because they say theat they don't have enough room in their homes for one. Anyday my Beagle takes up more room than my 190lb Saint. The beagle is active, on the go, following from room to room, while my Saint is happy on his own couch or laying at my feet.
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  #39  
Old 11-22-2007, 06:13 AM
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my dachshunds would attack someone if they were trying to hurt me. My dog Lucy, a chihuahua, knows I hate my brother's girlfriend..so everytime she comes into my house, or leaves..or walks into a room I am in, Lucy jumps off whatever piece of furniture shes on and starts barking and "nipping" her heels. My dogs scare people off with their barks.

Dachshunds have a very deep bark, almost sound like large dogs. That alone scares people away from my yard.
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  #40  
Old 11-22-2007, 07:53 AM
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Dan that should be framed I have had a dog who would protect me. (A JRT) and was a little to good at it. If I felt threatened at all he went from calm happy dog to full launch. It was scary, and a good thing he was only 25 pounds (he was a massive JRT) But that dog was uber confident even for a JRT

Dekka, I doubt would protect me. I think in her mind, I am here to protect her. Kaiden might, but the rest would likely wonder why I wasn't taking the person down myself.
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