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  #11  
Old 05-07-2007, 08:59 AM
Gempress Gempress is offline
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If you look at the more obscure breeds, you find many that are still bred strictly to work.

For example, take the blackmouth cur (like my Zeus!). They are a breed you'll almost never find in the show ring. If you look online, basically every single breeder talks only about their dogs' working abilities at hunting and herding.

But the more common a breed gets, the less likely it is to remain a true working dog.
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  #12  
Old 05-07-2007, 09:51 AM
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IMO you really need to look outside of the U.S. where the majority of dogs are household pets. Also, we have the technology & resources to do the same jobs without dogs thus dogs are not used as much as they used to be.

A close friend of mine is a Ca da Bou fancier. He's owned the breed now for over 5 years & has made several trips back to Puerto Rico (where he's from) to learn first hand about these dogs & watch how the dogs still work.

There are many countries not as advanced as us in which people rely heavily upon animals to get jobs done. And those dogs used are amazing in my eyes.

And Gem, I love Blackmouth Curs. We hunt with them often & they are truly wonderful dogs that love doing their job. They don't ask for much human attention other than a pat on the head & a "good job" when all is said & done.
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  #13  
Old 05-07-2007, 09:57 AM
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Border collies are. They have their show counterparts, and their popularity has brought with it BYBs and agility/flyball breeders, but the real, dedicated border collie people are still breeding for a good work dog.

Technically speaking, the border collie is no longer bred solely for working ability, now that the show border collie has entered the arena. But with a split that big, it is rare to see the two lines intertwine and produce a good working dog OR a good show dog. It's almost like they are two separate breeds.
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  #14  
Old 05-07-2007, 10:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RD View Post
Border collies are. They have their show counterparts, and their popularity has brought with it BYBs and agility/flyball breeders, but the real, dedicated border collie people are still breeding for a good work dog.

Technically speaking, the border collie is no longer bred solely for working ability, now that the show border collie has entered the arena. But with a split that big, it is rare to see the two lines intertwine and produce a good working dog OR a good show dog. It's almost like they are two separate breeds.
You just hit the nail on the head. And this has become the fate of every working breed out there if they didn't become extinct by the "new & better for show" version.
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  #15  
Old 05-07-2007, 03:35 PM
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The only breed in North America I can think of bred solely for working is the hangin' tree cowdog. There are not many breeds these days used SOLELY for working. You would probably have to look in third world countries to find anything that isn't shown atleast somewhere in the world. And these dogs would likely be questioned as a breed since they probably wouldn't be recognised by anything. Of course there are still developing breeds that aren't shown (like the Australian labradoodle, which is another "breed" that would be questioned based on the lack of people breeding pure for several generations).

Many breeds do have that "split," like the border collie. My breed is one of them. I have one of the few dogs of my variety left with both a show and a working background and I plan to continue breeding into these lines, and I am buying semen from a male in France bred solely for working to do an outcross with.
Many generations of Show

Many generations of Working

Working X Show (very reasonable outcome, but genetics don't always play out as planned)
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  #16  
Old 05-07-2007, 08:50 PM
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Interesting result in the Belgians, Wolfsoul. I've found that the conformation dogs tend to throw obvious characteristics like coat, markings and angulation.

Here's the breeding that produced my dog.

Working:



Show:



Two dogs from that cross:





The first dog is mine, a very useful goose dog but he'll never be a sheepdog OR a show dog. The second dog is an AKC champion, but he'll never take the breed ring by storm nor will he be winning trials. It seems to me that this kind of cross just produces mediocrity in Border Collies even though the advocates of breedings like this say it's for "versatility".
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  #17  
Old 05-07-2007, 09:20 PM
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I know many working terrier kennels, some of them also show in conformation but their goals are for the working field and not the ring.
They spend more time hunting (earthwork) their dogs than anything else.
And if you approach them about breeding to their studs?? You have to prove to them that your bitch works by going hunting with them or by having another repected terrierman/woman that they repect and trust to vouch for your bitch.

I was making plans this week for our first hunt of the year which will happen in June.
The dogs can't wait, plus I am excited about my one young girl, she has FINALLY shown some prey drive!!!!!!!!! She'll get her chance in the working field to see just how bright those lights have come on.

Lynn
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  #18  
Old 05-11-2007, 09:32 AM
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i agree with a lot of working lines and show lines making the breed almsot split into 2.

i saw some show borders and i relaly don't like their look. their too short and too furry IMO. just not what BC's are ment to look like i reckon
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  #19  
Old 05-11-2007, 10:04 AM
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The things with Belgians is the conformation seems to remain good. and Structure always seems to remain intact.. its just the coat that comes and goes

our breed is also very lucky to have the 4 varieties..

The mals seem to have been bred mainly for work now..

The Tervs, Laeks and Grons are show AND working..

Its rare to see a show Mal around here.
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  #20  
Old 05-11-2007, 03:18 PM
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It doesn't matter what breed it is. Even in a very rare 'only' working breed. A breeder will have pups that don't work out as 'workers' for one reason or another and have to sell as pets. No matter what. Not all herding dogs will herd, not all guarding dogs will guard. So there will always be pets in every breed.
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