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Old 04-17-2007, 05:06 PM
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Default Caloric requirements for dogs - any thoughts?

I've been researching and reading as much as I can in my search for the best diet for my dogs. I'm considering a home prepared diet and in light of the more recent problems with NB (Sophies food ), I've decided now's the time to break free from the dog food company's potentially deadly grip -

Sounds dramatic but that's exactly how I and many others feel. I just don't want to risk it anymore...

Thought these were interesting and worth sharing

http://www.mycockerspaniel.com/mer.htm AND
http://www.phouka.com/dogs/dog_amount.html#cal_req
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Old 04-17-2007, 05:09 PM
Melissa_W Melissa_W is offline
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Those are my thoughts too, Dr2. I'll be interested to see what people say about the articles.
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Old 04-17-2007, 05:20 PM
Psyfalcon Psyfalcon is offline
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The problem with some of them, and it goes for people diet stuff too, is how active is moderately active vs very active? There can be so much variability in dogs, and within the same dog day to day, that you could end up overfeeding by 3x on some of the charts if you think your couch dog is "very active."

And I bet some people do.
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Old 04-17-2007, 05:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Psyfalcon View Post
The problem with some of them, and it goes for people diet stuff too, is how active is moderately active vs very active? There can be so much variability in dogs, and within the same dog day to day, that you could end up overfeeding by 3x on some of the charts if you think your couch dog is "very active."

And I bet some people do.
I agree, but I think that it's good to have a general idea and then to go by your dogs weight and how they do from that baseline.

That was the hardest thing for me find, the caloric requirements. I know that while NB recommends anywhere from 3.5 - 4.3 cups/day - she does well on only 2 cups/day, AND they do not provide caloric information nor do they even give nutrient info. in grams so that I could at least calculate it myself...VERY FRUSTRATING.

The Timberwolf organic formula gives calories/kg and I could calculate cals/cup from that but it seemed so high (over 500 c's/cup) that I don't even know where to begin.

Anyway, I'm going to draw an average from as many sources as I can find and start there...gotta start somewhere. Now the problem is what to feed this itchy, allergic dog *scratches head*
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Old 04-17-2007, 06:01 PM
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I'm looking into it too Doc. I'm just sick of this crap with the commercial foods. If that nice man, Dick Van Patten's food can be messed up, so can anyones. I didn't remember that Sophie was eating that. Apparently, it was just one week's batch. I hope she was on another batch. It's all terrifying. I'm not quite brave enough to do raw, even though I see a lot of logic in it. So, I'm thinking too, of a cooked diet, or partially cooked. But I know there are calcium suppliments and other things that will need to be added.

As far as the calories....it looks kind of complicated. I'm figuring that I'll give them volume wise about what they've always eaten and just watch their weight and condition and go from there. I know that's not very accurate because home cooked is probably less dense than kibble...(?)

I wonder if anything remarkable will come of this as far as commerical food companies in general.....if people will become as disillusioned as we are. I suppose most people will keep on feeding it, one kind or another. People food should also be suspect. Nothing is absolutely safe unless you raise or hunt your own. It's just flat out saddening.
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Old 04-17-2007, 06:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doberluv View Post
I'm looking into it too Doc. I'm just sick of this crap with the commercial foods. If that nice man, Dick Van Patten's food can be messed up, so can anyones. I didn't remember that Sophie was eating that. Apparently, it was just one week's batch. I hope she was on another batch. It's all terrifying. I'm not quite brave enough to do raw, even though I see a lot of logic in it. So, I'm thinking too, of a cooked diet, or partially cooked. But I know there are calcium suppliments and other things that will need to be added.

As far as the calories....it looks kind of complicated. I'm figuring that I'll give them volume wise about what they've always eaten and just watch their weight and condition and go from there. I know that's not very accurate because home cooked is probably less dense than kibble...(?)

I wonder if anything remarkable will come of this as far as commerical food companies in general.....if people will become as disillusioned as we are. I suppose most people will keep on feeding it, one kind or another. People food should also be suspect. Nothing is absolutely safe unless you raise or hunt your own. It's just flat out saddening.
Sophie's actually on the NB Sweet potato and fish, but she was horribly sick from 2 bags of it, although NB denied anything was wrong with the sample that I sent to them. I know it was the food because everything else was eliminated through every test I could have done. My Vet agrees.

Anyway, I'm thinking cooked or partially cooked too. It's just so tough because she's on a fish diet and with mercury levels in some fish I'm a bit concerned about the amount of shopping around I'll have to do.

I'm actually kind of excited to have more control over exactly what she eats and the quality of the ingredients. I can't really mess with the wee ones diets too quickly but I'm going to do the same with them.
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Old 04-17-2007, 06:15 PM
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That's horrible about Sophie. Did you then switch to something else?

I'm going to have to dig and find out what suppliments, what amounts etc will be needed when feeding particular things. I know that just plain meat is no good. So, it will take some study, I see. But yeah....I've had it! This has happened too many times. This big, huge Menu thing isn't the first and it won't likely be the last.

My little dogs have stomachs of lead so I don't think they'll be as sensative as Lyric, who does tend to have a more easily upset digestion process at times. And he's not the only one to have to "pay." LOL.
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Old 04-17-2007, 07:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dr2little View Post
Sophie's actually on the NB Sweet potato and fish, but she was horribly sick from 2 bags of it, although NB denied anything was wrong with the sample that I sent to them. I know it was the food because everything else was eliminated through every test I could have done. My Vet agrees.

Anyway, I'm thinking cooked or partially cooked too. It's just so tough because she's on a fish diet and with mercury levels in some fish I'm a bit concerned about the amount of shopping around I'll have to do.

I'm actually kind of excited to have more control over exactly what she eats and the quality of the ingredients. I can't really mess with the wee ones diets too quickly but I'm going to do the same with them.
Can Sophie tolerate any non fish protien sources ? Rabbit, venison, duck, beef etc? I guess it's tough to know if you've always been using commercially prepared foods what the cause of problems is

I would do a true elimination diet (as much of a PIA as it would be) so you can really figure out what her problem foods really are and get some variety into her diet. I can't see a fish only diet (as protein) being very healthy in the long run- not as you say, with the mercury and other toxins in fish. They are now telling pregnant women to eat fish no more than once a month
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Old 04-17-2007, 07:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sam View Post
Can Sophie tolerate any non fish protien sources ? Rabbit, venison, duck, beef etc? I guess it's tough to know if you've always been using commercially prepared foods what the cause of problems is

I would do a true elimination diet (as much of a PIA as it would be) so you can really figure out what her problem foods really are and get some variety into her diet. I can't see a fish only diet (as protein) being very healthy in the long run- not as you say, with the mercury and other toxins in fish. They are now telling pregnant women to eat fish no more than once a month
I just wrote a list of the other proteins and those are the ones that I'm pretty sure I'll use as well as fish, except the beef.
Duck upsets her tummy it's so rich. I used to roast her a duck once a month or so and skim as much fat as possible (roasted skinless)...she'd have to eat it more often and with other things so as to build her tolerance and cut the richness. It doesn't make her itch at all. She was on NB Duck and potato until she got sick from a bad bag (I think).
No beef for sure, it makes her itch like crazy but Venison.... and I've never tried duck but I asked my dad to get me one. (He's a retired chef so he has contacts )

As for fruit and Veg, any suggestions would be great. I'm thinking I'll cook a batch every second day or so and give her some decent variety once I'm sure of what she'll do best on.
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Old 04-17-2007, 08:02 PM
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Aussie Red Aussie Red is offline
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I have been home cooking for my two mainly and now it is 100***37;
Thank you for the link. good to know.
I bake liver ( beef) and wild rice
Lamb shanks
Hamburger with sweet potatoes
They mainly get red meat.
This just has me so worried as to how many pets are going to die or suffer before it ends
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