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  #1  
Old 10-25-2006, 11:37 PM
cardinalfanUSA cardinalfanUSA is offline
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Default When is a mutt no longer a mutt?

Ten years ago, if a golden retriever and a poodle had a litter of puppies, they'd be considered mutts, but now they're "goldendoodles". A bullmastiff is a bulldog/mastiff cross. So, when is a mutt no longer considered a mutt?
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Old 10-25-2006, 11:49 PM
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They are still mutts. People just like to make up fancy names so they can convince people who dont know any better that it is a breed and sell them for bunches of money. But they are mutts, and most of us prefer the term mutt over "doodles" and what not.
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Old 10-25-2006, 11:53 PM
cardinalfanUSA cardinalfanUSA is offline
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All dogs come from a common ancestor. I believe I read that a Rottweiler is a combination of doberman, mastiff, and something else. Tosas have bloodhound in them. But noone ever calls a Rottweiler a mutt. So, at what point does a mutt become an actual breed?
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Old 10-25-2006, 11:58 PM
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if you breed a dobe and a mastiff you have a mutt. but if you take the pups out of those littler that represent the traits you are trying to create a breed for and breed those, and then breed the best of those and so on until you have a standard. When there is a standard that you can expect when breeding, that is when you have a breed. But if you breed a Golden and a Poodle you cant guarantee a hypoallergenic dog, you cant predict what kind of coat it will have, etc. You need color, size, coat, temperament, etc standards before it is a breed.
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Old 10-26-2006, 12:03 AM
Psyfalcon Psyfalcon is offline
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To me, the dogs would need to breed true and create similar dogs without throwbacks to the original breeds. Many of the designer breeds (like the goldendoodle) are still first generation mixes while something like a bullmastiff, while once a mixed breed, has been bred only to bullmastiffs for a long time.

If I wanted a litter of goldendoodles, I would go get a poodle and a golden. If I wanted bullmastiffs, I would get a pair of bullmastiffs. Thats the difference to me.

As a semi- asside, I think that a standard would need to be written up. The bullmastiff wasnt created with a written standard, but the dog world doesnt seem to function well without one now.
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Old 10-26-2006, 12:49 AM
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All breeds were mutts at one point until they became recognised by a kennel club and were only bred to focus on certain desiered traits, thats what selective breeding is.

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Old 10-26-2006, 11:07 AM
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Agree .... it takes years to create a new, standard breeding . So far I only see the Australian Labradoodle approaching this . Any first time breeding of 2 breeds is a mutt.
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Old 10-26-2006, 11:22 AM
Gempress Gempress is offline
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A mutt is usually no longer considered a mutt when:

-There is a recognized standard. That means there are specific requirements for size, coat length, temperament, etc.

-The dogs have been breeding true for several generations (I think the AKC requires 5 or 6 generations). For example, if mommy and daddy labradoodle consistantly produce litters of puppies that all fit the labradoodle standard.

-And I believe that for formal recognition, the breed must have a parent club and following, something like "The Labradoodle Club of America." The club must have shows and maintain a registry of breeding dogs.

That's why the "doodle" breeds are still considered mutts (with the possible exception of the Australian labrodoodle). Most doodles still come from two parents of different breeds---like a breeding between a female golden retriever and a male poodle--not two doodle parents. There are also no written standards.
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Old 10-26-2006, 11:25 AM
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To make a "purebred" you must breed true for at least 7 generation and keep going consistantly with a certain look and a certain temperment. I have a buddy in Brazil who is breeding a Bandogge which to him is the ultimate working dog for his ranch and he has been working at this for years. Recently (as in within the last few breedings) he has been breeding true consistantly so you could say he is on the verge of having a real "new breed" and he is VERY happy with what he has accomplished but if I have it right he is planning on outcrossing to another breed a couple more times yet.
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Old 10-26-2006, 10:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cardinalfanUSA View Post
A bullmastiff is a bulldog/mastiff cross.
Actually, a bullmastiff is a real breed of dog -- nothing mixed in.
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