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  #21  
Old 10-05-2006, 12:17 AM
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Originally Posted by IliamnasQuest View Post
I guess I look at this a bit different.
But I think that most of us are in it for the love of the dog and the fun of interacting and showing and having dogs as part of our lives. I just can't put a price on that.



Melanie and the gang in Alaska
You hit the nail on the head there!
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  #22  
Old 10-05-2006, 12:26 AM
AnimalLoverCatRescuer AnimalLoverCatRescuer is offline
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Originally Posted by cindr View Post
Hi good question. Well here in Ontario there are no cheap Vet clinic's We just took our 4 pups and the mom to the vets yesterday. 2nd set of shots heart guard and moms blood test all including the vet call or Office call. $312.00.

Now as far as the dog food is concerned that is the cheaper brand here. That would be Iams Ukanuba is alot more expensive. But no matter the price of the food it is best to feed the right quality rather than the cheap store brand. So yeah that is what we pay to have the dogs taken care of.

So to date the total invested in the litter we have at this time. Just vet bills alone $2000.00 stud fee $1500.00 and the list goes on.

As a matter of fact the stud owner had called stating that he has 2 people interested. What are you asking for the pups. I was like yeah right. I asked why? Oh so I can tell the people. I told her that is my personal business and that is up to me to discuss with the potential purchasers. So if you have people interested then send them here. She then states to me well the one lady can only afford $500.,00. I told her I can not afford to sell any of my dogs for that price. She stated well its a good home. I told her if the person is serious then she can call me. I will decide what I will do from there. Can you believe the nerve. I had no beefs paying the stud service and they have enough nerve to ask this lame ****. Nope the dogs will stay here as long as they have too. This way I know that they have what they need. The longer they stay and the more time and training invested the price goes up. Or they get donated to the Police Services of need

Ok I see, that makes sense. I didn' realize you are in Canada. And I guess with everything else added in, saving a little on shots really wouldn't make a ton of difference overall. Even if you did home vaccinations.

Did you mean that the expensive food you are referring for $70 a bag is Iams and Eukanuba? That would be about $62 I think in US dollars. I may have mis-understood your post becausae that sentence was worded a little funny. But I don't consider Iams or Eukanuba a high quality food at all. I wouldn't pay $2 a bag for them. I don't mean to sound like I am arguing or anything, just trying to understand your reply to my post
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  #23  
Old 10-05-2006, 12:43 AM
cindr
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Originally Posted by AnimalLoverCatRescuer View Post
Ok I see, that makes sense. I didn' realize you are in Canada. And I guess with everything else added in, saving a little on shots really wouldn't make a ton of difference overall. Even if you did home vaccinations.

Did you mean that the expensive food you are referring for $70 a bag is Iams and Eukanuba? That would be about $62 I think in US dollars. I may have mis-understood your post becausae that sentence was worded a little funny. But I don't consider Iams or Eukanuba a high quality food at all. I wouldn't pay $2 a bag for them. I don't mean to sound like I am arguing or anything, just trying to understand your reply to my post
Hi there sorry for all and any confusion. I love the brand of dog food Iams. Wouldn't use anything else. But I guess it is about personal preferance . What do you feed?
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  #24  
Old 10-05-2006, 12:54 AM
cindr
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Originally Posted by IliamnasQuest View Post
I guess I look at this a bit different.

I may breed someday (my young chow). I can figure in what it will cost for some of the health checks I might not have done unless I plan to breed. I can add in the stud fee and/or the cost of AI (as that's probably what I'll do). I can add in the costs on the puppies too (but puppy food is not anywhere near $70 a bag, nor is registration anywhere near $700 a litter). I would certainly add on any veterinary costs involved with my bitch conceiving, carrying and delivering the pups.

BUT .. I can't figure in the costs for buying, feeding or showing her, because these are things I would do anyway whether I bred her or not. Yes, they are expenses that will certainly be part of her life, but they're not additional expenses that are specifically because I plan to breed her. Heck, I've fed and shown many dogs over the years and never bred a single one of them .. *L*.

So when people say that breeders never make any money, I beg to differ. If a person is ONLY in it for the breeding, I suppose that you could estimate in all those figures. But I think that most of us are in it for the love of the dog and the fun of interacting and showing and having dogs as part of our lives. I just can't put a price on that.

All that being said, I doubt I'll make much money as a breeder if and when I decide to breed. Chows tend to have small litters (four or so). I'll keep one. The breeder of my girl may be interested in one. So I might have two to sell to people who would actually pay the "going" price. Unless I charge an awful lot for those two pups, I kind of doubt I'll break even unless everything goes very well and Khana doesn't need anything special.

But people who have litters of eight or ten - you better bet they're probably making money over what it would cost them if they chose not to breed. I'm not saying that's wrong. People need to earn a living, and if they have good quality dogs and are doing all the right things with health tests and proving their dogs through breed surveys and competitions, then they should ask a respectable price for their pups.

Melanie and the gang in Alaska
Point well made. I as well breed for the love of the breed. I just wish and pray that others would follow suit. It is not fair to the people wanting a real nice dog to end up with many health issues attached to that love. That is to painful not only for the dog the new owner too.

I brought the subject up as to a educational area. To many breed as to the get rich quick sceem. I just called a breeder of Ritties. Why I have a client wanting one. I explained to the client that I will assist in their search. So getting on with it I would call the breeder. German Bred Rotties for sale. Okay So now I ask the pertant questions. Shots, registrations health guar parents cerification so on and so forth. NONE OF THE ABOVE ATTACHED!!!!!!!!

So as a reputable trainer and breeder would I send my client there? Not on your life. I have to not only consider the client I have to consider my reputation along with the fact that I would at no time support a byb and or puppy mill. Hey If people wish to breed they have to have a concious mind. They have to understand that should put more into it than just making babies
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  #25  
Old 10-05-2006, 12:58 AM
AnimalLoverCatRescuer AnimalLoverCatRescuer is offline
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I feed Chicken Soup for the Dog and Cat Lovers Soul and Premium Edge sometimes Solid Gold but that is usually way too expensive for me. My vet as well as a lot of people I know on a cat forum always talk about how Iams is promoted my most vets like Purina is also but it really isn't all that great of a food. I have done a ton, well quite a bit of research on the popular and not so popular foods to find the best I can. Iams I think lists corn as a second ingredient and I stick to the foods with meat in the first few ingredient spots. I also believe Iams has by-product meal in the ingredients list, that is something I stear way clear of, that could be anything off the factory floor. I am a bit obsessive about what I feed my pets. I would love to switch to raw but I don't have a regular enough schedule to prepare and serve it. I also don't know a lot about it.

Check out brands like those I mentioned and Wellness, Innova, California Natural, you will see what I am talking about.

Does Iams cost $70 in Canada?
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  #26  
Old 10-05-2006, 01:20 AM
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wolfsoul wolfsoul is offline
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Originally Posted by cindr View Post
I had one when I was a kid. I bought her for my birthday. LOL boy was my mom mad!!!!!! When wasn't she? I always brought a dog or two home.

I called her My Little Miss Melisa. Mind you she was not that small. She had a lot of health issues as well. Have you ever heard of a dog being allergic to Grass? Well she was. We had to have major sergery done in the areas that were affected.

Mind you not the dogs fault in any way shape or form. It would be the breeders fault. He just bred to breed. No using common sense. Especially with this magnificent breed.

All the other areas put aside she was an awesome working dog. I will never forget working her in our shop. I had her doing off leash building searchs. She never missed a beat. I would send her in the direction and she search the whole area. Once completed she would come and sit right in front of me. Well the one day as our business was closed. I would send her to the door area directed to the 3 offices. Well if I did not send her and someone would walk in. Wame. On the left arm she would go. One command Missy out. With that she released and returned to me. Guess who it would be? Can't beat this one! Our Minister's wife. OOOPSIE

I was only 16 when I bought this girl and for a whole $60.00. Where has time gone?????
Too bad about the health problems -- allergies are another thing quite common in Belgians. But it sounds like she was a wonderful dog. I'm not sure I'll ever keep a terv but I'd love to have some pop up in litters. Jag who is being bred next year might carry terv -- not sure, it'll be her first litter. Loki who is also being bred next year carries terv (his father was a terv). And Solo might carry it, but probably not lol. The others probably don't either. I'm just waiting for the day that I get a little grey pup.

I agree about Iams, not the worst food but certainly not the best -- lots of better stuff out there. I didn't realise it could get so expensive. When I was feeding kibble I don't think I ever spent more than $50 for a 40 pound bag. I feed raw now, but before I got my freezer so I could feed raw, I tried Innova EVO, Nature's Variety, Go Natural, Natural Balance, and California Natural. Some other good ones are Canidae, Fromm's, Foundations, Healthwise, Summit...Can't think of any more lol.
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  #27  
Old 10-05-2006, 02:12 AM
cindr
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Originally Posted by wolfsoul View Post
Too bad about the health problems -- allergies are another thing quite common in Belgians. But it sounds like she was a wonderful dog. I'm not sure I'll ever keep a terv but I'd love to have some pop up in litters. Jag who is being bred next year might carry terv -- not sure, it'll be her first litter. Loki who is also being bred next year carries terv (his father was a terv). And Solo might carry it, but probably not lol. The others probably don't either. I'm just waiting for the day that I get a little grey pup.

I agree about Iams, not the worst food but certainly not the best -- lots of better stuff out there. I didn't realise it could get so expensive. When I was feeding kibble I don't think I ever spent more than $50 for a 40 pound bag. I feed raw now, but before I got my freezer so I could feed raw, I tried Innova EVO, Nature's Variety, Go Natural, Natural Balance, and California Natural. Some other good ones are Canidae, Fromm's, Foundations, Healthwise, Summit...Can't think of any more lol.
Sounds good to me. I do not know if we have that brand here. But I will look for it. We can get ground up cow inner's $2.50 for ten pounds. My kids used to hate it. Why? Because the guy I got the stuff from put it in one big bag and it would be frozen. So when I defrosted it the whole house smelt like cow!!!!!!!!!!Now the dogs were doing great on it and I was going through a whole lot less in the kibble area. That was great as we had 25 dogs at the time.

Now how did we end up with that many dogs? Well we lived on a 50 Acre farm. We were set back away from the road but everyone could see the kennel in the back. Get this just made for one dog and or two. As all of my dogs live in the house. Anyhow getting on with it. I would come home to dogs tied to my porch dogs tied to my tree's. Mind you not all at once but it happened almost every week.

So one day I decided to put a sign at the road stating no more dogs wanted. I was not the humane society and or a rescue. Just a small breeder trainer. So now I end up have a visitor or two. Police Service Officers. By this time I had built (hubby) a large indoor out door facility to house these poor souls. Not a big deal. But when the Sergent and the Constible came to visit the two of them would look at me as if to say. What the heck is going on? I looked at Cam and said " Do you think I have enough of them. He said: I think so!
I said well go look at the road. The sign says NO MORE DOGS WANTED.

This is one of the reasons I have such a hard time with idiot breeders. They seem to want the money for the dogs but do not give a dame where they go to and what will happen to them. It is such a shame. Can you believe every dog that was tied up to the tree's were registered German Shepherd dogs
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  #28  
Old 10-05-2006, 06:11 AM
chickenlittle chickenlittle is offline
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Just a note to let everyone know

It is illegal to order the shots and give them yourself.

All vaccines, by law in Canada must be given by a licensed vet!

So there is no way to save on the shots anyway.
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  #29  
Old 10-05-2006, 07:40 AM
cindr
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Just a note to let everyone know

It is illegal to order the shots and give them yourself.

All vaccines, by law in Canada must be given by a licensed vet!

So there is no way to save on the shots anyway.
Good point: I did not think of that area at all. Many people go order the shots and or crop thier dogs tails and or dew claws. Although get caught your going to jail here. Federal crime receives the time acting as a vet here in Ontario.

It is always best to take the pups to the vets for thier first shots this way we can prevent a wrongful sale. You never know if the dog has a heart mermer and or other health issues. Its always better to be safe than sorry
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  #30  
Old 10-05-2006, 07:45 PM
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The only vaccine required to be given by a licensed vet in Canada is Rabies. You can buy most other vaccines right from the pharmacy.
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