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  #41  
Old 06-24-2014, 01:35 PM
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Originally Posted by DJEtzel View Post
Does the scenario change if the parent passes out due to exhaustion from working long hours all day?
yes... accident.
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  #42  
Old 06-24-2014, 02:06 PM
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Also, past behaviors factor in to how we view/deem accidental vs neglectful.

Lady across the street has little children....one too young to potty train...and they are ALWAYS in the street, been brought home stark naked by police from around the block, constantly with no supervision what so ever. I mean they are in the street, around the corner, with NO ADULT EVEN OUTSIDE!

I know people in this neighborhood would look at it as neglect ON HER PART if one of her children were hit by a car. Someone else's child gets hit the same exact scenario? Ya...probably viewed an accident.

True, dead is dead but I agree with RTH about intent and IMO reputation/past behaviors is also a big factor.
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  #43  
Old 06-24-2014, 03:22 PM
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I don't think it's just about intent, there has to be more context.

If it was just tried over intent then anything could go. Child drinks bottle of methadone that mother leaves on counter (she wasn't under the influence at the time, she's under a well maintained programme, she went to the chemist and took a call, places the bottle down and forgets). I bet people would have a different view of that.

Father pops into a shop to buy child an ice cream and child wanders into road and is killed. I bet people have a different view on that again?

Mother forgets that she leaves her loaded gun on the kitchen table... Child picks it up and shoots self. Or sibling. Who is at fault? Nobody? It was an innocent mistake??

At some point we have to be responsible for these little people who can't be responsible for themselves. And that means NOT forgetting they're in your car/home/around dangerous stuff if you can.... Neglect is neglect. Neglect of your duties to care and be responsible for a human life.

Of COURSE mistakes happen... I'm not a judge or jury and I don't ever want to be. But weighing up accountability isn't as simple as "was there intent?". I have to weigh up neglect to children as part of my job and I assure you 99% of parents who neglect aren't really doing it on purpose..... (It's very scary when they do though). They are just not very good at taking responsibility of the life they chose to create. Should we just say "aww but you don't mean it, carry on..."?
Good post.
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  #44  
Old 06-24-2014, 03:23 PM
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Originally Posted by sparks19 View Post
yes... accident.
So they chose to work(totally acceptable to do), accidentally passed out, and the child died.

Someone else chose to have a drink(totally acceptable to do), accidentally passed out, and the child died.

Hm. I just don't know. Is it illegal to be drunk and responsible for a minor? My dad is a drunk, but he was responsible enough to take care of me.

Both should have known that their choices (working too much or drinking) could cause them to pass out and not take care of the child, IMO. Just because someone is drinking alcohol, IMO, does not make them negligent or careless.
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  #45  
Old 06-24-2014, 03:29 PM
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I guess I can't really debate with someone that can't see the difference between drinking till they pass out and someone working hard to put food on the table and falling asleep.
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  #46  
Old 06-24-2014, 03:33 PM
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Originally Posted by release the hounds View Post
I guess I can't really debate with someone that can't see the difference between drinking till they pass out and someone working hard to put food on the table and falling asleep.
But aren't we arguing intent?

In my scenario, neither party intended on work and alcohol to cause them to pass out. Both overdid it on accident, and had full intention of being responsible for their children. Both are completely legal. Why does one get treated differently?
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  #47  
Old 06-24-2014, 03:33 PM
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Originally Posted by release the hounds View Post
I guess I can't really debate with someone that can't see the difference between drinking till they pass out and someone working hard to put food on the table and falling asleep.
pretty much this!

I don't know many who have A drink and pass out but if you know it does that to you then you should wait until the kids are asleep. Drinking to the point of passing out especially when the kids are awake and need you to be taking care of them... NOT the same as working long hours to provide for them.

Working long hours to pay the bills= trying to take care of your responsibilities. Drinking to the point of passing out on your kids= NOT trying to take care of your responsibilities

how does one ACCIDENTLY drink too much?
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  #48  
Old 06-24-2014, 03:36 PM
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If I accidentally forgot my dog in my car and he died a torturous death of heat stroke, y'all would vilify me. I'm sure most would hope for jail time. But if I do the same for my child, maybe a "do better with the next one" and a sympathetic pat on the back? Add me to Romy with being confused...
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  #49  
Old 06-24-2014, 03:37 PM
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Originally Posted by DJEtzel View Post
But aren't we arguing intent?

In my scenario, neither party intended on work and alcohol to cause them to pass out. Both overdid it on accident, and had full intention of being responsible for their children. Both are completely legal. Why does one get treated differently?
I already admitted I can't debate a topic like this with someone that can't easily discern the difference. I really can't
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  #50  
Old 06-24-2014, 03:37 PM
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Originally Posted by sparks19 View Post
how does one ACCIDENTLY drink too much?
Maybe they don't drink much, wanted to have a glass or two of wine, didn't realize until they had passed out that it was too much for them?

"Then they shouldn't have drank so much while watching the kids if they didn't know how they would react!"

Then they shouldn't have worked a double shift for a couple of extra bucks if they didn't know how they would react.
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